An Nearest Point of Relief (NPR) dilemma

Right-handed player. Cart path runs down the left side of the fairway. For the first 200 yards a red-staked lateral water hazard runs closely paralleling the cart path with about two feet of grass between the margin of the LWH and the cart path. Player’s ball rests on the cart path such that the NPR would be in the narrow strip of grass.

Q1 May the player, under R24, drop within one club-length of the NPR and stand in the LWH to play his next stroke?

Further along the same hole, the LWH ends and the red stakes are replaced with white OB stakes. Same two feet of grass between the cart path and the OB. Player’s ball rests on the cart path such that the NPR would be in the narrow strip of grass.

Q2 May the player, under R24, drop within one club-length of the NPR and stand OB to play his next stroke?

Yes and yes.  The key point is that the ball comes to rest through the green.  If there is no longer interference from the obstruction then the ball is in play.

One angle covered in that thread that hasn't been mentioned here is that after you take relief and end up with a stance in the LWH or OOB you can elect to play your shot left-handed* and receive relief from the cart path again. After each drop you have a new situation and you treat it separately. If you did the above you may still be entitled to relief a third time if your drop for relief of the left-handed swing leaves you too close to the cart path to take your normal right-handed stance.

* Note, you can only choose to take relief from interference for a left-handed shot if that is a reasonable stroke to take given the circumstances. If your stance in the hazard or OOB is clear and level there is no reason to swing around and swat at the ball lefty except to try to gain further relief. Howerver if the ground is sloping, there are OB boundary stakes (or fence) in the way, etc then taking a left-handed stance for the shot is reasonable and you are entitled to relief in that case.

Good morning, David. Here's my "excuse." Yesterday afternoon in the midst of a mini-Rules refresher clinic at a local golf course, I answered "yes" and "yes" but was challenged in an aggressive way by a pair of their best players. Though confident of my position, I couldn't immediately locate a Decision to justify my answers. (There's an old saw by Josh Billings, "I have lived in this world just long enough to look carefully the second time into things that I was most certain of the first time.") I thought it wise to work it out here in the company of friends. Thanks.

Agree. Figured there had to be a reason, and I'll admit, I took a quick look at R24, albeit, after I posted. Thankfully, I couldn't find anything to make me eat my words either! ;-)

The real point is whether the drop is allowable if the player has to stand in the hazard or out of bounds.  The assumption is that there is room for his stance.

Note that when dropping from a water hazard, relief is only for the lie of the ball.  It is still a good drop as long as the ball lies outside of the hazard, even if the player must still stand in the hazard to play it.  Also for a ball which lies near a boundary, the player is allowed to stand out of bounds to play a ball which lies in bounds.

It is only when taking relief without penalty that the player is given complete relief for stance and swing from the condition he is dropping away from.  Just as with those two conditions above, the rules are consistent when taking relief from an immovable obstruction.  The player is not allowed additional relief as long as the conditions of Rule 24-2 are observed and the dropped ball lies through the green.

It's worth adding that taking relief in such a situation does NOT guarantee an improvement over the original situation. As such, the player is well advised to consider all possibilities before lifting your ball. You can end up out of the fry pan and into the fire otherwise!

Yep.  Nearest point of relief is not necessarily a good point of relief.  I've been in more than one situation where I played from a cart path because the dropping area within one clublength of the NPR was not likely to be playable.  It was less of a risk to just play the ball as it was.  I always make certain that I know where I'll be dropping before I lift my ball from the obstruction.

nearest not nice point of relief

How about not using so many acronyms for those of us who have no idea what they all mean.  At least spell out first use.

Trying to read these posts is like deciphering a puzzle.

Q stands for question, R for rule, LWH is lateral water hazard, and I assume you know OB is out of bounds. Hope that helps. As you learn the rules of golf (ROG) these will be easier to remember. (Should be noted though that op did spell out lateral water hazard the first time - and I didn't address NPR because I assume you're not asking about that one since its in the thread title.)

I know the Rules Of Golf (not everything, but I have a better then working knowledge).

The problem is people start using their own acronyms for everything instead of spelling it out.  It can't be that much more effort just to spell out.  While a lot of them are fairly easy to figure out, it makes reading the posts that much more difficult.  I tend to skip over them when they are overloaded with acronyms.

Sorry, rob0225, but those who frequent this arcane folder usually get LWH, NPR and OB. I will try to do better in the future, not only for you but for others.

Here's a glossary from another site!

What do the abbreviations/acronyms in the posts mean?
. AGC - Abnormal Ground Conditions
. BIP - Ball In Play
. CL - Club Length
. CIBAE - Could It (the ball) Be Anywhere Else
. CIC - Committee In Charge
. COC - Condition(s) Of Competition
. CR - Course Rating
. CW - Casual Water
. FC - Fellow Competitor
. GUR - Ground Under Repair
. IO - Immovable Obstruction
. KVC - Known or Virtually Certain
. LB - Lost Ball
. LCP/LC&P; - Lift, Clean and Place
. LCR/LC&R; - Lift, Clean and Replace
. LI - Loose Impediment
. LOH - Loss Of Hole ( in Match Play)
. LR - Local Rule
. LWH - Lateral Water Hazard
. MO - Movable Obstruction
. MP - Match Play
. NPR - Nearest Point of Relief
. OA - Outside Agency
. OB - Original Ball
. OOB - Out of Bounds
. OP - Original Post
. PB - Provisional Ball
. PG - Putting Green
. PL - Preferred Lie
. PS - Penalty Stroke(s)
. RB - Ruling Bodies
. RO/HRO - Rules Official/Head Rules Official
. SB - Serious Breach
. SP - Stroke Play
. SR - Slope Rating
. STF - Stableford
. SSS - Standard Scratch Score
. TIO - Temporary Immovable Obstruction
. TLR - Temporary Local Rule
. TTG - Through the Green
. UB - Unplayable Ball
. WB - Wrong Ball
. WH - Water Hazard

Are you sure about that?

IMO the player must drop the ball at a spot, where full relief of the immovable obstruction is given.

If he would have to stand on the same IO , from which he is taking relief, he would have to drop somewhere else.