USGA/R&A Distance Insights Project (Updated Feb. 2021)

[ncates00]

3 hours ago, Sandy Divot said:

I don't feel that I have lost much distance, yet.

It's a holistic approach to be sure, like you taking care of yourself as you have stated.  However, you haven't lost distance in large part also because of the equipment that you keep current.  Tiger has said the same thing--he's said he's hitting the ball further than he ever has but that it is all relative.  In his heyday, only Daly averaged over 300 yards.  Now a lot of guys do.  You haven't lost distance for the same reason Tiger has gained on the net, even if not gross.

[phillyk]

56 minutes ago, lastings said:

My assumption is that bifurcation would only be implemented in situations where there a professional consequences.   Professional tournaments and Open qualifiers and such.  
I don't really know exactly where the line would be, but I'm sure it would be somewhere that really only affects players with professional aspirations and doesn't affect the majority of recreational players. Maybe at the Q-School pre-qualifying stage or something.  

I play in Open qualifiers and a few state or other opens. For our chapter pro ams is where I don’t know. It’ll likely be up to each PGA chapter/section to decide on their own events. Club pros are the edge of recreational and tour golf. So as someone potentially being apart of that 1%, I’m not a huge fan of any potential ball roll back. I’d have to learn 2 games, as if 1 wasn’t hard enough. 

[lastings]

8 minutes ago, phillyk said:

I play in Open qualifiers and a few state or other opens. For our chapter pro ams is where I don’t know. It’ll likely be up to each PGA chapter/section to decide on their own events. Club pros are the edge of recreational and tour golf. So as someone potentially being apart of that 1%, I’m not a huge fan of any potential ball roll back. I’d have to learn 2 games, as if 1 wasn’t hard enough. 

Fortunately we have incredibly accurate launch monitors available to us now, that'll help to alleviate the pain of learning new distances.  

[phillyk]

2 minutes ago, lastings said:

Fortunately we have incredibly accurate launch monitors available to us now, that'll help to alleviate the pain of learning new distances.  

I’d gladly take a donation of $10,000 so I can buy one. A couple hour sessions ain’t going to do it.

[lastings]

25 minutes ago, phillyk said:

I’d gladly take a donation of $10,000 so I can buy one. A couple hour sessions ain’t going to do it.

Kinda makes me think that if bifurcation were to pass, opening a trackman supported training facility might be a decent investment. 

[iacas]

22 minutes ago, phillyk said:

I’d gladly take a donation of $10,000 so I can buy one. A couple hour sessions ain’t going to do it.

This is one of the areas where 8 handicaps really can’t speak to what they’re trying to speak to.

[DaveP043]

1 hour ago, DeadMan said:

Here's a link to the PGA Tour's statement: 

  Quote

The PGA TOUR is committed to ensuring any future solutions identified benefit the game as a whole without negatively impacting the TOUR, its players or our fans’ enjoyment of our sport.

Exactly.  My interpretation of the last bit, "without negatively impacting the TOUR, its players"  is that the tour and the players won't accept anything that reduces their income from sponsorship.  It seems likely (to me at least)  that adoption of any local rule regarding limited distance equipment could compromise ad revenue and individual sponsorships by equipment manufacturers, and that would be a "negative impact."  And I don't blame them for taking that stance.

 

[lastings]

8 minutes ago, iacas said:

This is one of the areas where 8 handicaps really can’t speak to what they’re trying to speak to.

whoops, sorry.  That wasn't quite up to date.   

how about now? 

[cutchemist42]

Would the Masters do it? They would have the clout if they think their tourneys holes are not as memorable as they were in the past.

[lastings]

20 minutes ago, cutchemist42 said:

Would the Masters do it? They would have the clout if they think their tourneys holes are not as memorable as they were in the past.

Considering that they’ve been forced to add 800 yards to the course over the past 20 years, after not changing the distance at all in the 50 previous years, I imagine they are playing close attention. 

[Sandy Divot]

Can't wait for the driver ads in the future claiming to hit it 20 yards shorter.

[lastings]

1 hour ago, phillyk said:

I’d gladly take a donation of $10,000 so I can buy one. A couple hour sessions ain’t going to do it.

Let’s be honest, if the ProV2 ball came out this year and it added 10% to all your shots, you’d find a way to get it on your bag pretty darn quickly.    Even though you don’t own a track man.    I’d wager that you’d find a way to make it work. 

[iacas]

1 hour ago, lastings said:

Considering that they’ve been forced to add 800 yards to the course over the past 20 years, after not changing the distance at all in the 50 previous years, I imagine they are playing close attention. 

<500, and you’re wrong about the previous 50.

2019 Masters Tournament - Wikipedia

7,475 yards in 2019. 6985 in 2000. < 500.

1 hour ago, lastings said:

Let’s be honest, if the ProV2 ball came out this year and it added 10% to all your shots, you’d find a way to get it on your bag pretty darn quickly.    Even though you don’t own a track man.    I’d wager that you’d find a way to make it work. 

Give it up man. Repeating the same nonsense doesn’t make it any more true.

You still haven’t proven a problem either. And I don't care if someone else says "there is a problem," you haven't convinced me, nor have they.

[phillyk]

13 minutes ago, lastings said:

Let’s be honest, if the ProV2 ball came out this year and it added 10% to all your shots, you’d find a way to get it on your bag pretty darn quickly.    Even though you don’t own a track man.    I’d wager that you’d find a way to make it work. 

Probably because it provides an advantage, lowers my scores. Reducing distance, raising my scores, being at a disadvantage doesn’t sound as good.

However, you are right, if it goes through, I will still try and play my best and adapt. 

The Masters spends money moving trees 10ft and practically replanting fairways every year. Adding yardage? I doubt they really care all that much. They can make almost anything work. 

[Double Mocha Man]

Here's where I come down on this.  For now, at least.  No bifurcation.  Freeze all club specs (COR, head size, etc.) and ball performance in place right now.  Nobody gets any longer; nobody gets any shorter.

Tour pros can still shill clubs and balls... but it's almost like buying a new car.  The design can change yearly (or twice yearly if it's TaylorMade) and be the bold, stylish, sleek new model.  But the performance specs stay the same.  Clubs wear out, we'll need new ones.  Balls get old with age, so the manufacturers can continue to release this year's model, just no performance changes that don't fit with the USGA and R&A.

So we can all have our cake and eat it too.  All of us (pros and amateurs alike) need to adapt to no more length gains.  Nobody has said anything about improving your own body's performance and strength.

I don't feel any "dialing back" is needed.

[Double Mocha Man]

9 minutes ago, phillyk said:

The Masters spends money moving trees 10ft and practically replanting fairways every year. Adding yardage? I doubt they really care all that much. They can make almost anything work. 

Augusta National has bought land from the adjacent Augusta Country Club to lengthen #15 so it's not an automatic two strokes to reach the green on that par 5.  But they only plan to do this lengthening if drives continue to get longer.  So they now may be able to turn that extra acreage into a dog park... or something. 😊

[iacas]

2 minutes ago, Double Mocha Man said:

Augusta National has bought land from the adjacent Augusta Country Club to lengthen #15 so it's not an automatic two strokes to reach the green on that par 5.  But they only plan to do this lengthening if drives continue to get longer.  So they now may be able to turn that extra acreage into a dog park... or something. 😊

13, and they haven’t lengthened it.

This far they’ve built a road back there.

[Double Mocha Man]

Just now, iacas said:

13, and they haven’t lengthened it.

This far they’ve built a road back there.

Oops.  #13.   From what I heard yesterday they don't want to lengthen it.  And with the new USGA and R&A combined statement they probably won't have to.