dont fit in?

[sean_miller]

  Gioguy21 said:

never once mentioned neanderthals...nor pressed pants...nor looking down one's nose. and never once said that those who dress the part fix every mark and/or divot. Did I? Sorry but my point seems to be missed. How hard is it really?

Actually, I think you did. When stating which types of clothing are acceptable - and only those types of clothing - what was excluded is there deemed unacceptable.

Although I may have been paraphrasing (multiquotes aren't my thing), your intention seems to have been to get a debate going. You stated pretty clearly that people without your good fashion sense must not know anything about on-course etiquette (including fixing ball marks).

[Lefty-Golfer]

  Gioguy21 said:

I played morgan hill (believe it or not) two weeks ago...first time. Beautiful course and will def be back when it's nicer to play there. Ever venture up to the Rockaway/Poconos?

Morgan hill is a nice course...you played it two weeks ago?? WTF. it had to be a brick. I played at my club 30 miles south of there weeks ago and that was hard. i can't imagine paying to play that way...you must have a really bad need...

[Fourputt]

  Gioguy21 said:

Understood it's changed along the way. This is a bit out of control at this point. I'll reiterate. Call me a fundamentalist, call me what you will. I'm not saying dress like a tour pro, and I'm not saying dress like white trash. Find a middle ground...

Depends totally on the situation. Now, in the winter, yes I would rather play in jeans. I happen to be comfortable in jeans. I've worn them as casual wear for most of my adult life, and I consider golf apparel to be casual wear. This time of year you will find at least 2 pairs of jeans in any given foursome on my home course. That has absolutely nothing to do with whether we repair pitch marks and divots, which we do. Our course is in at least as good condition as the country club up the road, and they don't allow denim of any kind... go figure. Etiquette is a rules and deportment issue, not a style issue. Sorry but you are just plain wrong there.

  Gioguy21 said:

To understand the game in its entirety; not just 18 holes and clubs with a little white thing, but rather golf itself. The game is about responsibility, etiquette, and honesty. Etiquette for the rules and the manor in which you conduct yourself in all aspects of the game, not just whos farther from the hole. Responsibility for ones scorecard, and finally honesty. Honesty not just in the sense of "yes, i hit it out of bounds" but honesty to the game. I play with all kinds of people and have never ONCE been called snooty or have an elitest view.

Statements like this show just how stuck up you really are. Talk about holier than thou attitudes...

Believe it or not, I can treat the game with total respect and still wear jeans. I'd wager that I have a better understanding of the rules and the fundamental principles of the game than you do. I've been playing in club competitions for more than 20 years, served as chairman of the rules committee, and attended rules workshops paid out of my own pocket. I'm as dedicated to the history and spirit of the game as anyone I know. Surely you don't think that those Scottish shepherds of 400 years ago changed into special golf togs before they started batting rocks around the pasture at rabbit holes? At some point after that the game became more elitist, and the elite gentry who played simply wore the casual outdoor attire of their eras to play. The fact that that attire happened to be somewhat dressy was simply a coincidence of wealth. Nowadays, casual runs the gamut, and whether you believe it or not, clean denim in good repair qualifies as casual in many circles. I follow dress codes where required, and in summer I dress in shorts most of the time anyway. But I see nothing wrong with jeans on courses where they are allowed.

[Gioguy21]

  Lefty-Golfer said:

Morgan hill is a nice course...you played it two weeks ago?? WTF. it had to be a brick. I played at my club 30 miles south of there weeks ago and that was hard. i can't imagine paying to play that way...you must have a really bad need...

...20 bucks, all holes were fine except for the one par three that's about 50ft below you...in the shade was frozen, no holes in the green but a sign that said "green frozen, go to next hole, sorry" ha

[parplease]

  Gioguy21 said:

I played morgan hill (believe it or not) two weeks ago...first time. Beautiful course and will def be back when it's nicer to play there. Ever venture up to the Rockaway/Poconos?

Never have, but intend to venture out a little more this year. Some of the views at Morgan Hill are the best I've seen anywhere. Golf course or not. Especially in the spring. And in reading some of the other views, I don't care what you wear, respect the game. Walking 18 holes in jeans has got to leave a hell of a thigh rash. LOL!

[Fourputt]

  parplease said:

Never have, but intend to venture out a little more this year. Some of the views at Morgan Hill are the best I've seen anywhere. Golf course or not. Especially in the spring. And in reading some of the other views, I don't care what you wear, respect the game.

Not if they fit right....

[Gioguy21]

  Fourputt said:

Statements like this show just how stuck up you really are.

I'm not gonna sit here and go over a rule book with you, i'm just saying theres' more to the game then wearin a pair of jeans...and as for those scottish shepherds, now that you mention it...they WERE wearin wranglers...lol...yes, denim is casual...but any joe schmo, whether rich or poor can afford a polo or khakis/cargo shorts from walmart, target, wherever. if they say it's ok to wear jeans, wear jeans...but where does it stop? that's another story. this wasn't meant to be an argument, let alone me just defending the fact that it doesn't take a millionaire to wear something other than jeans. Doesn't make me snooty, i don't see someone wearin jeans and think "yea, he's a poor sob who can't afford real clothes, how dare he"...i go about my business and play the course...relax already people.

  parplease said:

Never have, but intend to venture out a little more this year. Some of the views at Morgan Hill are the best I've seen anywhere. Golf course or not. Especially in the spring. And in reading some of the other views, I don't care what you wear, respect the game. Walking 18 holes in jeans has got to leave a hell of a thigh rash. LOL!

When the weather gets warmer keep in touch, i have a few friends that play in Jersey. I work near Rockaway and play Farmstead, Ballyowen, Crystal Springs, Black Bear, Great Gorge, Architects Club...

[murphmjm]

I worked at a club with a 40,000$ initiation fee and 7500$ a year in dues, the people that golfed there were awful. I would cut the tee's greens and approaches, the best spot to be was directly in front of the golfers because they just couldn't hit it straight ;). Don't let the money fool you; let your playing do the talking not the money. I can almost guarantee you if you play with some snooty person who may or may not be rich, they will resent you the rest of the week if you can shoot lower than them :)

[O.B. Right]

I'm having a hard time with all the advice here that basically goes like this:

"I used to feel the same way but I pulled out my driver and hit it long into the fairway and shut them up."

So what are you supposed to do if you suck at golf then? After all, snobbery isn't limited to only impoverished golfers with game. For example, if somebody made fun of my clubs and clothes and then said to his buddies "Five bucks says he hits it into the woods" . .well . .he'd probably be right but that doesn't mean he is "better" than me (well . .maybe at golf but I don't think that's what the OP meant).

Truthfully, though, I have not encountered any real snobbism on the course. I play munis that are not really frequented by the wealthy. I would suggest to the OP that these people you feel like are laughing at you probably aren't even aware of you. It is a common trend in jerks to be completely self absorbed. They are probably too busy worrying if thier clubs are as nice as those of the members of thier foursomes to even notice you.

I say, if somebody makes fun of you on the golf course you should turn around, look at them and cry. That will make them feel like total crap :)

[murphmjm]

  Return2Golf said:

I'm having a hard time with all the advice here that basically goes like this:

That's very true, if you dont have the ability to shoot low scores try not to worry about the rude people you may play with. Just compete with yourself, if they are being rude and ignoring basic etiquette say something, no reason you should be miserable after paying X amount to play. You're not going to be able to control how they act so just try not to worry about it. My good golfing buddy told me this and i bet some of you have heard it before, in golf you have everything to think about and nothing to worry about, so just go out and have fun. If you end the round shooting a 100 but are super happy with the way you played then what's wrong with that. Let the other person be a miserable rude grouch, dont stoop to their level.

[Aetsh]

I get this too..Full sleeve tattoo on my one arm, earrings, somewhat of a "biker" look I guess you would call it. I just smile and be as nice as possible

[dbuck]

I like to be comfortable where ever I go. Most days I wear golf pants, a shirt and tie, and a sport coat to work. If I have a meeting or presentation, I will wear a nice suit and French cuffs. If I go to a restaurant that requires a jacket--I think I have been to one or two in my life, I am ok with that.

Like wise with golf. Summer no problem because it's golf shorts and a polo anyway. Late fall early spring though is different. In my little town, there is a 9 hole muni and an 18 hole university course both open to the general public. There is a fairly nice private club as well. In cool weather I am very comfortable at the muni or the university with decent jeans and a decent sweater. I do not stick out there as there will be about 50% of the other golfers dressed the same. I have played a few times at the private club and there I wear golf pants and golf shirts/sweaters.

[Bullitt5339]

I tend to dress appropriately depending on the rules and the membership of the course I'm playing. If it's a new course, it's always khakis or slacks/polo/shirt tucked in.

I used to play a lot of courses with my father in law where the people on the course (him included) were snobs. When they found out I was in the military at the time, it seemed like they looked down upon me, but were still polite. I played a couple courses when I moved into this area after retiring from the Army, and found that there were a few courses where the members weren't friendly unless you were in the "group". Then I went to a small, local course with about 100 members to play. I went to play by myself on a Friday morning, wearing the standard accepted golf attire. When I show up at the course, unloading my clubs, I notice a large amount of people wearing jeans and t-shirts, so I kind of thought "Oh Great.........Here we go". I walked up to the 1st tee, and there was a two-some teeing off, both in jean shorts and polo shirts. They saw me standing back, waiting for them, and they immediately started talking to me, and invited me to join their group. I told them if they didn't mind playing with a hacker, I would, and they assured me there were no better than I was.

I had the most fun I've ever had playing a round of golf with those guys. They weren't uptight, were funny, talked a lot of smack to each other (and me after the first couple holes), and generally had a good time. I was sad to see the round end. After talking to them, I found out that they were members, and that the rules of the course were built for people to be able to relax and enjoy the game, while not concentrating on how well they were dressed. The course was decent, wasn't horrible by any means, and the atmosphere was great. The people that worked there were friendly, and when you call them about a problem, they are quick to help out, and always handle things appropriately. So I never judge a course by the dress-code anymore. I also chose that club to be a member at, and have been for a few years now, and will continue to be a member.

Now, I will not wear jeans on the course when it's cooler, like a lot of the members do, but during the summer, you can catch me every once in a while with a pair of jean shorts, accompanied by my Polo shirts, and they're always tucked in. It just doesn't feel right to me to play with my shirt untucked for some reason. But nowadays, I'm all about comfort.

[Yukari]

  mewtwo55555 said:

In golf it seems like i dont fit in like all the people that play are like rich and snooty. I meen I have money. But it seems that all the other people that play think they are better than me.

You must be playing at a course that is not a muni course. I play mostly muni courses and once in a while at an upscale public courses. I have not had that experience. Are you sure you are not being too paranoid??? People that I get paired with do not have that attitude.

[Doctorfro]

Hate that this turned into a "What should be worn" thread. That's been beaten like the proverbial dead horse. FWIW, I was brought up to believe that you don't have to be dressed to the nines but simply dressed neatly, not look like a slob. I've seen designer jeans worn on the course and frankly they looked pretty good. I wouldn't wear them but.... And the sloppy, baggy, cargo shorts and untucked shirts I find to look crappy. But that is not the point of the OP. How do people act out on the course; towards others and towards the course. Living on a course I sit on my back porch and watch all kinds go by and I play with all kinds. The attitude I see and hear that annoys me the most is "I've paid my money and I'll do what I damn well please". That unnerves me to no end. I am very appreciative to those who show respect to all and to the course. I hate to say it but it's not the norm. And that's sad. And the nicest guys wear nice clothes....and sloppy clothes. So no stereotypes here.

[WUTiger]

  Bullitt5339 said:

I tend to dress appropriately depending on the rules and the membership of the course I'm playing. If it's a new course, it's always khakis or slacks/polo/shirt tucked in.

Bullitt's comments, plus the remarks about people judging you by your clubs, says a lot.

OP said he had money, but felt looked down upon. Some people who play golf at the fancy clubs are polite and accommodating to outsiders, whereas others are very snooty and want to look down on someone. Often, the ones who struggle to pay their club dues each month are the snootiest. In St. Louis area, snootiness by the old-money people in the early 1900s led to the founding of Sunset Country Club. The blue-bloods didn't want the Busch boys who owned a brewery with the Anheusers to darken the door at St. Louis C.C. After all, they were new-money beer barons, while the blue-bloods were "refined" people. So, the Buschs and their friends founded their own country club. Nowadays, some of the old-money bastions are in danger of closing, because they have lost members, and new-money people who could keep them afloat are put off by the reputation for stuffiness and snootiness. Clubs and dress are two interesting things. If you have a beat-up bag and an odd mix of clubs, and you can't hit your tee shot more than 100 yards , you face a mix of snootiness and people who don't want to play with non-serious golfers. The dress thing is critical - match the place where you play. If you're playing at Winged Foot, call ahead to the pro shop a day ahead and ask about the dress code, rules on tipping, etc. They'll give you the how-to. Older, veteran employees can also coach you on-site. Dress can be a killer, even for members. Our former CEO for our organization which has sites in more than a dozen states, was a member at Bellerive CC (site of 1965 U.S. Open, and other stuff). He got put on probation for six months at the club because he had his shirttail out on an unusually hot day while playing golf. Some people call this snootiness, but others say the nicer golf courses demand you dress properly and behave politely. I personally avoid joining up with people who show up drunk, in sloppy/dirty clothes, and generally act like crumb-bums.

[zeg]

  WUTiger said:

He got put on probation for six months at the club because he had his shirttail out on an unusually hot day while playing golf.

Sometimes it's nice that these things are self-regulating to a degree, because there is no way in hell I'd want to associate with the kind of people who consider that a reasonable (or necessary) response. IMO nothing to do with "nicer golf courses." Can't say I have any sympathy for that kind of club having trouble finding new members.

[Yukari]

As some of the responders had said, you got to dress appropriately for the place. If you don't and expect to be treated as one of them, well that is your fault for being treated badly. But there will always be snobs no matter where you go, be it a muni course or a private club. As the saying goes, "...you can't please all of the people all of the time..."