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TST Explores the ShotScope H4 (Stats Tracking Device) and Pro LX Rangefinder


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Posted
1 hour ago, boogielicious said:

I would. I reviewed Arccos for the site when it first came out. It’s improved since then but there are still issues plus the subscription. The H4 tags are much lighter and smaller and stay on well (unlike Game Golf).  Tagging is easy and editing your round is easy. @Bob M has the watch and he likes that too. 

Since you mention sensors one of my issues is that I use the SuperStroke grip with counterweight on my putter. It looks like Arccos has an elegant solution for this. I’m used to coming up with a home brew solution since I use CT10s but it’s never as clean as I’d like. Thanks for your thoughts. 

23 minutes ago, Darkfrog said:

I've been a Shotscope user since the V2

I've used Garmin products before, and I think their watches are really nice. I would rate them as superior to Shotscope from a pure hardware perspective. However the Garmin CT10 tags sucked and cost a lot, and I didn't think the Garmin Golf platform was very good. I have never had an issue with any Shotscope hardware I have used, even if it is a little more "plasticky".

 

I have a Garmin S60 and like it a lot. The CT10 sensors have been a disappointment. That’s why I’m considering other options 

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Posted
15 minutes ago, ChiTown said:

Since you mention sensors one of my issues is that I use the SuperStroke grip with counterweight on my putter. It looks like Arccos has an elegant solution for this. I’m used to coming up with a home brew solution since I use CT10s but it’s never as clean as I’d like. Thanks for your thoughts. 

Shotscope has adhesive backed putter tags (I assume some sort of 3M product as they seem to be the leader in these), so they just stick on the top of the grip. Not sure if that works with a counterbalance grip though.

I also had an S60 and it was a fantastic watch IMO, not just for golf.

-Peter

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Posted
28 minutes ago, Darkfrog said:

Shotscope has adhesive backed putter tags (I assume some sort of 3M product as they seem to be the leader in these), so they just stick on the top of the grip. Not sure if that works with a counterbalance grip though.

I also had an S60 and it was a fantastic watch IMO, not just for golf.

Perfect about the adhesive. I like the S60 a lot and Garmin watches in general but they can’t do golf sensors or make an app at all. 

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Posted
1 hour ago, ChiTown said:

Since you mention sensors one of my issues is that I use the SuperStroke grip with counterweight on my putter. It looks like Arccos has an elegant solution for this. I’m used to coming up with a home brew solution since I use CT10s but it’s never as clean as I’d like. Thanks for your thoughts. 

I just cut the screw thread off and glued the tag over the counterweight with a silicone adhesive. It’s very secure but can be removed with no damage to the counterweight Allen key recess. I probably have the same grip and counterweight as you. I did this with the Game Golf tag as well.

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Scott

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Posted
1 hour ago, boogielicious said:

I just cut the screw thread off and glued the tag over the counterweight with a silicone adhesive. It’s very secure but can be removed with no damage to the counterweight Allen key recess. I probably have the same grip and counterweight as you. I did this with the Game Golf tag as well.

When I was using a counter-weight putter with the game golf tags I got a drill and drilled a small hole at the top of the putter. The plastic screw was never going to hold in the metal but the hole in the rubber grip was small enough that it held the tag in.  Never needed glue & never lost the tag, just had to occasionally give it a slight twist so it did not come I unscrewed.  And I do not think the small amount of material removed affected the putter any.

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Stuart M.
 

I am a "SCRATCH GOLFER".  I hit ball, Ball hits Tree, I scratch my head. 😜

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Posted
1 hour ago, StuM said:

When I was using a counter-weight putter with the game golf tags I got a drill and drilled a small hole at the top of the putter.

I guess I’ll have to wait and see what options I have. Hoping that I can use an adhesive or a solution other than drilling. 🙂

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Wedges P, 48: :titleist-small: T200

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Posted
15 hours ago, ChiTown said:

I guess I’ll have to wait and see what options I have. Hoping that I can use an adhesive or a solution other than drilling. 🙂

Just silicone adhesive.

IMG_0934.jpegIMG_0933.jpeg

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  • 1 month later...
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Posted

I don't know what the maximum number of recorded rounds the H4 will store, but if anyone is curious, it does at least 6.

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Bill

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  • 3 weeks later...
Posted

I've been in contact with Shotscope tech support.   There is a bug in their stats reporting.  I've got nothing but time so I've been reviewing some of my old scores and comparing the data.   One course, I've played twice shows the average per hole different than the actual average.    This occurs on a few holes.   They are aware of the problem.  

image.thumb.png.5cddd3ad3e5fb995bbfd4c2ef0d77b33.png

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  • 2 weeks later...
Posted

Just got an email about a new feature.  Almost sounds like they read LSW and incorporated it.

I am assuming it is not Legal to use during competitive round but pre-round planning would be good.

https://shotscope.com/blog/announcements/mystrategy-ultimate-course-guide
 

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Stuart M.
 

I am a "SCRATCH GOLFER".  I hit ball, Ball hits Tree, I scratch my head. 😜

Driver: Ping G410 Plus 10.5* +1* / 3 Hybrid: Cleveland HIBORE XLS / 4,5 & 6 Hybrids: Mizuno JP FLI-HI / Irons/Wedges 7-8-9-P-G: Mizuno JPX800 HD / Sand Wedge: Mizuno JPX 800 / Lob Wedge: Cleveland CBX 60* / Putter: Odyssey White Hot OG 7S / Balls: Srixon Soft / Beer: Labatt Blue (or anything nice & cold) 

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Posted

I haven't had a chance to look over the strategy stuff… but I did want to point this out:

shotscope.jpg

Click the link in the sidebar and use the referral code "THESANDTRAP" to save an extra 15% off the already discounted price of their FESTIVE sale!

Wow. I'm genuinely considering buying a second one. 😛

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Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
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Posted
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Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
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Posted
On 11/8/2023 at 11:24 AM, StuM said:

I tried Whispering Woods and then Southern Pines, and neither seem to have anywhere near enough shots plotted to make any real type of maps.

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Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
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Posted

My strategy would just respond:

Go Home!

Scott

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Posted
On 9/1/2023 at 2:49 PM, Bob M said:

I have never used Arccos, but having to pay a subscription fee on an ongoing basis was a negative for me. I have always worn a watch when I play anyway, so it feels pretty natural. 

You may want to check this out, but back when I was using Arccos I stopped paying the subscription fee and everything worked as well (actually better) than when I was paying the sub. I may be wrong on this, but I believe the subscription fee is for "Arccos Caddie", not for Arccos. So, if you don't pay the fee the only ramification is that your Arccos will not recommend a club to you before each shot. Which I actually preferred. 

Granted this was a couple of years ago, but I actually enjoyed Arccos MORE when I wasn't paying the fee. I didn't want the "Arccos Caddie". It was annoying to me to have to swipe the screen every time I looked at my phone to get rid of Arccos Caddie's club recommendation. 

With Arccos Caddie, I'd look at my phone it would say Hit an 8-iron. I'd have to swipe the phone to get rid of that recommendation and see that I'm 150 from the center of the green. Without Arccos Caddie, the system still kept all of my stats and still let me know I was 150 from the middle, but now I didn't have to swipe. 

Where I believe Shotscope is superior, however, is in the way you collect the pin location. 

Oh, I almost forgot to mention. The reason I switched away from Arccos was that I had Arccos grips, you know, where the sensors are built in. They were fine, but once I got into Pure Grips I've never wanted to use anything else. So, when I switched out grips it seemed like a good time to switch out systems. 

My bag is an ever-changing combination of clubs. 

A mix I am forever tinkering with. 

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Posted
12 hours ago, iacas said:

I tried Whispering Woods and then Southern Pines, and neither seem to have anywhere near enough shots plotted to make any real type of maps.

What do you mean about not enough shots plotted? I thought that MyStrategy was superimposing your club / shot data onto the course.

From the website 

To start creating your very own strategy, select your club.

Detailed statistics on your chosen club will appear on the left of the screen including shots to finish and a distance breakdown. 

[snip ]

Once a club has been chosen, players will see a dispersion cone based on player averages. The option to tailor the dispersion cone to your tendency is available, provided you have recorded enough shots.

Simply toggle on the dispersion tendency feature to receive a cone that allows for your natural miss and adjust your aim point accordingly.

Similarly, players will also be able to turn on the shots plotted feature to further visualise their dispersion.

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Posted
6 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

You may want to check this out, but back when I was using Arccos I stopped paying the subscription fee and everything worked as well (actually better) than when I was paying the sub. I may be wrong on this, but I believe the subscription fee is for "Arccos Caddie", not for Arccos. So, if you don't pay the fee the only ramification is that your Arccos will not recommend a club to you before each shot. Which I actually preferred.

Chet… 


Yes, a trialing or active membership is required to use the Arccos Smart Sensors. The Smart Sensors will not function without a membership. Cancelled members can access the Arccos platform however ...
6 hours ago, ChiTown said:

What do you mean about not enough shots plotted? I thought that MyStrategy was superimposing your club / shot data onto the course.

From the website 

To start creating your very own strategy, select your club.

Okay, two things, in no particular order:

  1. I'm a moron.
  2. THANK YOU.

You see, I logged in, and at my laptop's resolution, I saw…

ww.jpg

It seemed to work, but made no sense to me. See the little hint of blue in the bottom left corner? Aha, that's the club stuff.

Now, it's awesome:

ww2.jpg

Incredible.

I'm hoping they can add scratch golfers or even Tour players to the comparison list, though:

sp.jpg

That hole is not an average of 5.5 for me. (Second hole at Southern Pines.)

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Posted

Wow this looks great! That’s what I get for not editing and posting the last dozen rounds or so that I’ve played…

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Bill

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    • Please see this topic for updated information:
    • Please see this topic for updated information:
    • When you've been teaching golf as long as I have, you're going to find that you can teach some things better than you previously had, and you're probably going to find some things that you taught incorrectly. I don't see that as a bad thing — what would be worse is refusing to adapt and grow given new information. I've always said that my goal with my instruction isn't to be right, but it's to get things right. To that end, I'm about five years late in issuing a public proclamation on something… When I first got my GEARS system, I immediately looked at the golf swings of the dozens and dozens of Tour players for which I suddenly had full 3D data. I created a huge spreadsheet showing how their bodies moved, how the club moved, at various points in the swing. I mapped knee and elbow angles, hand speeds, shoulder turns and pelvis turns… etc. I re-considered what I thought I knew about the golf swing as performed by the best players. One of those things dated back to the earliest days: that you extend (I never taught "straighten" and would avoid using that word unless in the context of saying "don't fully straighten") the trail knee/leg in the backswing. I was mislead by 2D photos from less-than-ideal camera angles — the trail leg rotates a bit during the backswing, and so when observing trail knee flex should also use a camera that moves to stay perpendicular to the plane of the ankle/knee/hip joint. We have at least two topics here on this (here and here; both of which I'll be updating after publishing this) where @mvmac and I advise golfers to extend the trail knee. Learning that this was not right is one of the reasons I'm glad to have a 3D system, as most golfers generally preserve the trail knee flex throughout the backswing. Data Here's a video showing an iron and a driver of someone who has won the career slam: Here's what the graph of his right knee flex looks like. The solid lines I've positioned at the top of the backswing (GEARS aligns both swings at impact, the dashed line). Address is to the right, of course, and the graph shows knee flex from the two swings above. The data (17.56° and 23.20°) shows where this player is in both swings (orange being the yellow iron swing, pink the blue driver swing). You can see that this golfer extends his trail knee 2-3°… before bending it even more than that through the late backswing and early downswing. Months ago I created a quick Instagram video showing the trail knee flex in the backswing of several players (see the top for the larger number): Erik J. Barzeski (@iacas) • Instagram reel GEARS shares expert advice on golf swing technique, focusing on the critical backswing phase. Tour winners and major champions reveal the key to a precise and powerful swing, highlighting the importance of... Here are a few more graphs. Two LIV players and major champions: Two PGA Tour winners: Two women's #1 ranked players: Two more PGA Tour winners (one a major champ): Two former #1s, the left one being a woman, the right a man, with a driver: Two more PGA Tour players: You'll notice a trend: they almost all maintain roughly the same flex throughout their backswing and downswing. The Issues with Extending the Trail Knee You can play good golf extending (again, not "straightening") the trail knee. Some Tour players do. But, as with many things, if 95 out of 100 Tour players do it, you're most likely better off doing similarly to what they do. So, what are the issues with extending the trail knee in the backswing? To list a few: Pelvic Depth and Rotation Quality Suffers When the trail knee extends, the trail leg often acts like an axle on the backswing, with the pelvis rotating around the leg and the trail hip joint. This prevents the trail side from gaining depth, as is needed to keep the pelvis center from thrusting toward the ball. Most of the "early extension" (thrust) that I see occurs during the backswing. Encourages Early Extension (Thrust) Patterns When you've thrust and turned around the trail hip joint in the backswing, you often thrust a bit more in the downswing as the direction your pelvis is oriented is forward and "out" (to the right for a righty). Your trail leg can abduct to push you forward, but "forward" when your pelvis is turned like that is in the "thrust" direction. Additionally, the trail knee "breaking" again at the start of the downswing often jumps the trail hip out toward the ball a bit too much or too quickly. While the trail hip does move in that direction, if it's too fast or too much, it can prevent the lead side hip from getting "back" at the right rate, or at a rate commensurate with the trail hip to keep the pelvis center from thrusting. Disrupts the Pressure Shift/Transition When the trail leg extends too much, it often can't "push" forward normally. The forward push begins much earlier than forward motion begins — pushing forward begins as early as about P1.5 to P2 in the swings of most good golfers. It can push forward by abducting, again, but that's a weaker movement that shoves the pelvis forward (toward the target) and turns it more than it generally should (see the next point). Limits Internal Rotation of the Trail Hip Internal rotation of the trail hip is a sort of "limiter" on the backswing. I have seen many golfers on GEARS whose trail knee extends, whose pelvis shifts forward (toward the target), and who turn over 50°, 60°, and rarely but not never, over 70° in the backswing. If you turn 60° in the backswing, it's going to be almost impossible to get "open enough" in the downswing to arrive at a good impact position. Swaying/Lateral Motion Occasionally a golfer who extends the trail knee too much will shift back too far, but more often the issue is that the golfer will shift forward too early in the backswing (sometimes even immediately to begin the backswing), leaving them "stuck forward" to begin the downswing. They'll push forward, stop, and have to restart around P4, disrupting the smooth sequence often seen in the game's best players. Other Bits… Reduces ground reaction force potential, compromises spine inclination and posture, makes transition sequencing harder, increases stress on the trail knee and lower back… In short… It's not athletic. We don't do many athletic things with "straight" or very extended legs (unless it's the end of the action, like a jump or a big push off like a step in a running motion).
    • Day 135 12-25 Wide backswing to wide downswing drill. Recorder and used mirror. 
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