Why is it a GIR if you drive Par 4s or reach Par 5s in two?

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by nleary9201

It could be a "better" indication of how your ball striking is.  You struck the ball better by hitting a par 5 in 2 than 3 but the stat doesn't reflect that in its current form.

You're absolutely correct. You should keep this stat. You should compare your rounds against all other players, especially your kids', and see who's the most awesome.

I have a new stat too.

"Others".

From your total score, subtract the number of putts and tee shots. For argument's sake, let's make this 72 - (36 + 18) = 18 shots.  Any combination of 18 "others" should get me to scratch.

[ghalfaire]

I read most of these posts and found it interesting, although I think the question posed in the OP was answered early and correctly that golf is a digital game unlike horse shoes.  But I'd like to add that your statistics are for you and you alone to use.  They are interesting but the purpose of going to the effort of keeping data on your game it to educate yourself on what you're doing right and what you're not so good at.  But as older fellow (probably about the age I am now) told me once "the game is about how many, not how far", but how far seems to creep into a lot of threads.  Far is a good attribute to have if you can keep it on the short grass but not necessary to a single digit handicap.   I guess after all these years I'd say "the game is about how many, not how".  There isn't any style points in golf or pictures on the score card, but most of us have to get older to appreciate this.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by ghalfaire

. . .  I guess after all these years I'd say "the game is about how many, not how".  There isn't any style points in golf or pictures on the score card, but most of us have to get older to appreciate this.

(emphasis added)

Not the point of this thread, but when guys like Ryan Moore (clothes don't fit and wears a silly tie) and Rickie Fowler (orange clad rodeo clown motocross hat guy) get more ink than guys like Mark Wilson and Carl Pettersen, then clearly it's not what you get done, but how you look doing it that's most important.

[Zeph]

That's true, a more colorful (literally and metaphorically) will certainly give you more media time. It won't win you tournaments though.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by Zeph

That's true, a more colorful (literally and metaphorically) will certainly give you more media time. It won't win you tournaments though.

It won't necessarily win you fewer tournaments, and it will certainly garner some praise from sponsors and fanboys. Golf at the professional level is as much about providing entertainment and making money as it is about wins and losses. Finishing "near" the top, and doing it in style is always important for the professionals. Case in point: Greg Norman has > 3 times as many top 10 finishes in major championships as Larry Nelson. Guess which player has won more majors (hint: it's the player that nobody under the age of 40 has even heard of)

If I had a choice of a long driving game or a high GIR game, I'd go with the GIR, but to be honest I want both.

[nleary9201]

To Fourputt-- No I don't hit the ball farther than the next guy.  Ave. drive 245.     The idea of this stat isn't for me, I was just thinking "what if".   I do find it interesting that nobody does agree with my posts.   Just trying to find a new way of thinking about some of the "convention wisdom" of things.  Things do change in sports.  I remember in H.S. & college basketball not being allowed to dunk, no 3 point shot, football change the rules on what constitues a fumble i.e. the ground can't cause it etc.  Golf does have some crazy rules, just wondering why nobody seems to care to change anything???

[newtogolf]

It's not that we don't want to change things in golf, it's that you want to redefine the meaning and application of an existing statistic.  You might get less resistance if you suggested creating a new statistic.

[Shorty]

Originally Posted by nleary9201

To Fourputt-- No I don't hit the ball farther than the next guy.  Ave. drive 245.     The idea of this stat isn't for me, I was just thinking "what if".   I do find it interesting that nobody does agree with my posts.   Just trying to find a new way of thinking about some of the "convention wisdom" of things.  Things do change in sports.  I remember in H.S. & college basketball not being allowed to dunk, no 3 point shot, football change the rules on what constitues a fumble i.e. the ground can't cause it etc.  Golf does have some crazy rules, just wondering why nobody seems to care to change anything???

GIR is a statistic.  It's not a rule.

You may as well say let's change the putting statistic so that putts form off the green are counted as putts.

Ast the end of the day, the statistics mean what you want them to mean. You can call drives on the fairway greens in regulation if you like. Noone else cares.

It's not something that has to be changed, because it is straightforward.

I would be guessing that a person with this obsession would never hit a par 5 in 2 and a par 4 in 1 and if they did it would be on a course with a  220 yard par 4 and a 420 yard par 5.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by nleary9201

To Fourputt-- No I don't hit the ball farther than the next guy.  Ave. drive 245.     The idea of this stat isn't for me, I was just thinking "what if".   I do find it interesting that nobody does agree with my posts.   Just trying to find a new way of thinking about some of the "convention wisdom" of things.  Things do change in sports.  I remember in H.S. & college basketball not being allowed to dunk, no 3 point shot, football change the rules on what constitues a fumble i.e. the ground can't cause it etc.  Golf does have some crazy rules, just wondering why nobody seems to care to change anything???

No you don't. You enjoy being contrary for the sake of it. Not sure what the exact definition of troll is, but if the shoe fits . . .

Cases in point:

1.) This is your second thread on this "issue".

2.) In your "golf insruction" thread you were apparently bothered by the lack of consensus on which aspect of the game was more imporant, even though that has nothing to do with actual techniques which was your original concern.

3.) In this thread, you've got pretty much unanimous agreement that the existing GIR stat is both accurate and straightforward, but you don't want agreement unless it's with you.

4.) The stat to which you are referrring already exists, as you've already been told: http://www.pgatour.com/r/stats/info/?486

[natp0wers]

Um, no....

[B-Con]

I realize that - but mostly the only stat anyone ever refers to is GIR. I seems silly that you don't get more "credit" (if you will) for hitting a par 4 in one or a par 5 in two.  You are reaching the green "under" regulation.

[quote name="B-Con" url="/forum/thread/44721/why-is-it-a-gir-if-you-drive-par-4s-or-reach-par-5s-in-two/18#post_583332"]The point of GIR is not to record how many holes you played well before getting onto the green, not to give points relative to how well you did.[/quote] Again: The idea isn't to give credit/points based on performance, just to measure checkpoints. It's all about [i]measuring checkpoints[/i]. Now, if you were trying to assess the capability of a player, it would be good to see how often they get "GIUR" (Green In Under Regulation) because you're right, GIUR is harder than GIR and should count more heavily if you're trying to assess the ability of a player. But that would be for a different statistical analysis by a different person for a [i]different purpose[/i].

[saevel25]

But most of the time, hitting a green in two on a par five is just luck anyways. Even Fred Couples said that when he had a long iron in his hands he was trying to get it on the green, he wasn't pin seeking for par 5's. So for us, we should be happy to get it close to the green and not in trouble. I don't think its that big of a deal to give higher credit for hitting it less than the standard GIR.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by nleary9201

To Fourputt-- No I don't hit the ball farther than the next guy.  Ave. drive 245.     The idea of this stat isn't for me, I was just thinking "what if".   I do find it interesting that nobody does agree with my posts.   Just trying to find a new way of thinking about some of the "convention wisdom" of things.  Things do change in sports.  I remember in H.S. & college basketball not being allowed to dunk, no 3 point shot, football change the rules on what constitues a fumble i.e. the ground can't cause it etc.  Golf does have some crazy rules, just wondering why nobody seems to care to change anything???

For one thing, your topic has nothing to do with the rules.  The rules are only concerned with how many strokes it took you to get from tee to hole.... the route you took is irrelevant.

Your concern is purely about data gathering, and basically that's a personal issue.  It's just like counting putts.... some say it's anytime you use a putter, but others say it's only if you are on the green (I'm in this group).  Pick your poison.