Tiger's Swing at Bay Hill (2011)

[Mr. Desmond]

Originally Posted by Stretch

There's kind of an interesting video over at SITD of some other pros and caddies talking candidly amongst themselves about Tiger's swing/game at Bay Hill. I don't usually link stuff that you have to register to see, but if you are interested enough then go for it. It's a pretty good golf site anyway and I don't think Erik will mind me pointing over there.

http://www.secretinthedirt.com/index.php/video-vault/viewvideo/1335/19th-hole/qpp-playing-with-the-catq-episode-372

What I got out of the video is that Perez really didn't know what Tiger was doing other than Tiger saying he was compressing the ball more. When I saw him lean his back towards the target, telling Tiger to not do that, I thought back to the first "posed" GD photos of S&T.; The other motions he made, hell if I know what he was doing. But I doubt if during a round, those guys talk enough to gain real knowledge about what the other is doing ... bits and pieces is what I saw.

[colin007]

for some reason, i dont like the follow thru when the arms are at parallel.  i have no idea why but it doesnt look right.

[mchepp]

Personally I think Tiger's shoulders are too closed at P6. I would like to see his left arm more out and nearer to the baseline rather than in so much. I think in is a S&T trait so I may take a bit of heat for saying that here but.... I think it is what he needs to to do to hit it better. Just my $0.02...and probably not even worth that.

[mvmac]

Looks good but that finish shows me his rates are off.  I agree with the poster above that the shoulders are too closed at P6 and I think the fix needs to done on the back swing.  All pieces move in relation to one another.  So, to me to keep the axis centered, the left shoulder needs to move down and back 8-9 inches.  I see Tiger, especially with the longer clubs, turning that left shoulder too far back in relation to how much downward movement it gets at P4.  From there he presses into the ground and the shoulder are too closed.  Just my take.

[Bo the Golfer]

Most assuredly only 5% of S&T; as Foley states.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond

Arms not as deep as I'd thought they'd be.

Don't think this will be top 5 at Augusta - his putting and driving still is less than desirable.

But maybe he'd done something in the last 2 weeks ... that he hasn't played.

It's not like he's not been hitting balls.

The hands are a little higher but that's okay - they're not getting there by going immediately high. Though I think eventually they might settle down a little bit. If Tiger's hitting a bunch of cuts like PP says in the video this could be a part of it, especially if Tiger combines it with a more CP-like release.

Originally Posted by Mr. Desmond

What I got out of the video is that Perez really didn't know what Tiger was doing other than Tiger saying he was compressing the ball more. When I saw him lean his back towards the target, telling Tiger to not do that, I thought back to the first "posed" GD photos of S&T.; The other motions he made, hell if I know what he was doing. But I doubt if during a round, those guys talk enough to gain real knowledge about what the other is doing ... bits and pieces is what I saw.

Pretty pointless video in my opinion. What's Pat Perez truly know - in real speed - about the golf swing? Maybe a ton - he obviously PLAYS really well. But geometry and instruction and stuff, we don't know what he knows.

Originally Posted by colin007

for some reason, i dont like the follow thru when the arms are at parallel.  i have no idea why but it doesnt look right.

I think it's getting better. At least his path isn't +10 anymore.

Originally Posted by mchepp

Personally I think Tiger's shoulders are too closed at P6. I would like to see his left arm more out and nearer to the baseline rather than in so much. I think in is a S&T; trait so I may take a bit of heat for saying that here but.... I think it is what he needs to to do to hit it better.

I agree they're too closed, but that doesn't mean he needs to get his arm out. It just means he has to continue forward and continue rotating. He's retaining left tilt too long in the transition and his right shoulder work is contributing to closed shoulders too far into the downswing... If you revised your statement to talk about his right shoulder, then we'd probably agree. ;-) See image below. Hand path and shoulder path are related but different enough.

He's gotta keep the RPMs of his body up, and right now they never really even get "up" until impact or beyond - the body is slow rotationally these days. I think Tiger's spent too much time with Hank trying to slow this action down because he thinks that's what makes him get "stuck" (if you've been stuck you know it's a two-way miss and you feel helpless in your motion).

Originally Posted by mvmac

From there he presses into the ground and the shoulder are too closed. Just my take.

Curious about your take - and everyone else's - on this image:

[PiustheDrGolf]

Originally Posted by iacas

Thoughts?

Yeah.  This remind me of our bet ($100) whether Tiger will win a PGA tournament this year or not.  Swing looks good.  But is that truly all to win? Hardly.

Probably better to see his brain than his swing.

[uttexas]

I compared these stills to Grant Waite and Charlie Wi at the same positions.

The stills above certainly show how closed his shoulders are, especially in relation to his open hips.  You can also see how dramatically down his right shoulder is and up his left shoulder is.  I think his upper thoracic spine is tilting excessively down and toward the ball; and, I'd say he's thrusting his head too far back into impact.  Should get the upper center more forward and upper spine more extended into impact.

[mvmac]

---

Good pics Erik.  Needs to be more forward, his right heel is off the ground early, with shoulders rotating.

[colin007]

over in the pic

Originally Posted by mvmac

his right heel is off the ground early,

yeah, it looks like hes jumping a little soon, almost a paul casey hunch-over because he raised his hips too soon in that pic on the right...

[B-Con]

First two pictures are from his 2006 swing I believe. Last two are taken from his ad for the new Tiger Woods My Swing smartphone application.

His backswing is a little shorter in both the arm and wrist cock. Also there's much less loading on his right leg, which may be why his hips are farther forward during the follow through. Looks more stacked than not at this point, at least to me.