The Dan Plan - 10,000 Hours to Become a Pro Golfer (Dan McLaughlin)

[Pretzel]

Albert Einstein

[Nosevi]

Albert Einstein

Correct, and he was a pretty smart bloke

I don't see why Dan seems not to have changed his approach at all in the last 2 years and is basically 'playing lots of golf in the hope of getting good'. Quite simply he is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. Not saying he's insane or anything, just that he either seems to be ignoring the fact that it's not working or has no idea what other approach to take.

[Vinsk]

Sorry but you're a long way off on that one. I neither have a SnT swing nor do I use [COLOR=181818]evolvr. I don't have massive negativity towards Dan either. The handicap thing stumped me a bit though. Many have said he's been dishonest at times about his progress and I've always said that I don't believe he has been - check back through my posts. I've said I'll give him the benefit of the doubt on this one but you have to admit it's a stretch to say a guy who plays golf every day doesn't know what his handicap is.[/COLOR] This is basically where I am. I've been a little harsh on Dan a few times but it's born out of huge frustration and certainly not a will for him to fail. In fact it's quite the opposite, I very much want him to succeed if only to show it can be done. I've actually spent my own money taken from my 'golf training account' trying to help him (not a donation) but at the end of the day he didn't want to go down the route I was suggesting even though I've had pretty big success using this route. His call I guess. He has to realise that things are not on track. He has to, no one is that daft. And when things aren't working you change your approach. Quick quiz (Google not allowed) - who said "[COLOR=6A6A6A] The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results." - [/COLOR]Answers below please :) He has to know the 'go out and just play lots of golf' approach isn't working. 5 years in, handicap going up, he must know it. He must know distance off the tee is an issue. He must know his GIR isn't in the right ball park. He must know his scrambling stats aren't good enough. He must know averaging over 80 vs CR is not going to cut it at any level. So where is the details of the intensive fitness regime to help address distance off the tee? Where is the coach addressing the swing plane issues shown in those frames a few posts ago (below the back swing plane, butt end of the club pointing WAY inside the ball, I'd probably hit my foot rather than the ball if I was that far off plane)? Where's the deliberate practice posts addressing chipping and putting? For a programme based on the theory of deliberate practice I'm hard pressed to find any after about year 2. Doing something like this is hard but it's also an opportunity that many don't get. I just feel, right now, he's wasting that opportunity. Personal opinion is Dan needs to make some radical changes in his approach or he will fail. I have tried to tell him this but thus far I have been totally unsuccessful, nothing has changed in his approach. Anyway, I'm sorry to say @Unkynd you are massively wide of the mark, many of us want Dan to succeed but he won't do unless he changes his approach. It's that simple.

Funny thing about Einstein quote is in golf..its been said that golfers always say they want "consistency". And it's been said that these golfers actually have a very consistent swing, just a bad one. Why then do we get so many different results (pulls, chunks, slices, hooks, tops) from doing the same thing over and over? I do the same swing over and over and not only expect but guarantee I'll get different results.

[acerimusdux]

Randy, you're right I'm being a tad harsh. It's possibly he just had a mental block which is why he didn't answer the first time he was asked and rather than saying "I don't remember." simply made it up. His handicap went to 5.5 six weeks before that interview and didn't drop below 5.4 until it.

The prior revision though, on 3/15, was a 3.9, and then at the time of the interview he hadn't really been playing for a couple of months. The back injury was 4/12, so not the reason his handicap went up.  So still a little sketchy, he should have known what his handicap was in early April when he had last been playing seriously, but probably hadn't paid attention to it since then.

[iacas]

Funny thing about Einstein quote is in golf..its been said that golfers always say they want "consistency". And it's been said that these golfers actually have a very consistent swing, just a bad one. Why then do we get so many different results (pulls, chunks, slices, hooks, tops) from doing the same thing over and over? I do the same swing over and over and not only expect but guarantee I'll get different results.

Because golf requires such precision that a swing that's essentially the same can result in a wide variety of results. A quarter inch here, a few degrees there… vastly different results.

I'm sure you've read it but: .

[natureboy]

Funny thing about Einstein quote is in golf..its been said that golfers always say they want "consistency". And it's been said that these golfers actually have a very consistent swing, just a bad one. Why then do we get so many different results (pulls, chunks, slices, hooks, tops) from doing the same thing over and over? I do the same swing over and over and not only expect but guarantee I'll get different results.

We're just experts in chaos theory.

[Vinsk]

We're just experts in chaos theory. :-D

Lol! Ah...the ole "Red Queen Effect"

[RandallT]

Dan has inspired another "plan."

The main page is on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/igniteproject

He starts for real in September 2015 (from a 15 handicap or so). Looks to be marketing add-on for his own "performance gym."  20 hours per week for 5 years with a team of experts, 5 of which will be physical training at his gym. He'll stay working throughout and try not to sacrifice much family time.

Not the point of this thread of course, but it will be interesting to see if we can compare of what "deliberate practice" means for him, and what his team of experts recommends. Already I like that he will do at least one competition round per week to measure his progress.

[nevets88]

Dan has inspired another "plan."

The main page is on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/igniteproject

He starts for real in September 2015 (from a 15 handicap or so). Looks to be marketing add-on for his own "performance gym."  20 hours per week for 5 years with a team of experts, 5 of which will be physical training at his gym. He'll stay working throughout and try not to sacrifice much family time.

Not the point of this thread of course, but it will be interesting to see if we can compare of what "deliberate practice" means for him, and what his team of experts recommends. Already I like that he will do at least one competition round per week to measure his progress.

Based on his tweets, he's better off spending less time at the gym and more time playing/practicing, already in good shape. I'm wary (from first experience w/this sort of plan), but we'll see.

[Nosevi]

Dan has inspired another "plan."

The main page is on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/igniteproject

He starts for real in September 2015 (from a 15 handicap or so). Looks to be marketing add-on for his own "performance gym."  20 hours per week for 5 years with a team of experts, 5 of which will be physical training at his gym. He'll stay working throughout and try not to sacrifice much family time.

Not the point of this thread of course, but it will be interesting to see if we can compare of what "deliberate practice" means for him, and what his team of experts recommends. Already I like that he will do at least one competition round per week to measure his progress.

Looks interesting, I'll definitely follow along.

In reality he's talking quite a bit under 5000 hours of actual deliberate practice if over 1000 hours of it is in the gym and a competition round per week is also in that time - there's not a lot of deliberate practice during the time you're walking to your ball, waiting for your playing partners, waiting on a tee etc. In reality he's talking about dedicating 5000 hours to his programme of which maybe 3000 could probably be called 'deliberate practice', perhaps a bit less.

It's ambitious but I know someone who basically did it in 2 years from a 7 handicap while working for much of it so it can be done. Good luck to him.

[RandallT]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandallT

Dan has inspired another "plan."

Looks interesting, I'll definitely follow along.

In reality he's talking quite a bit under 5000 hours of actual deliberate practice if over 1000 hours of it is in the gym and a competition round per week is also in that time - there's not a lot of deliberate practice during the time you're walking to your ball, waiting for your playing partners, waiting on a tee etc. In reality he's talking about dedicating 5000 hours to his programme of which maybe 3000 could probably be called 'deliberate practice', perhaps a bit less.

It's ambitious but I know someone who basically did it in 2 years from a 7 handicap while working for much of it so it can be done. Good luck to him.

I thought you'd have an interest in this one .  My gut tells me this is a bit more of a "side thing" for him, no coincidence that it aligns and promotes his gym business.  Of the 3, I think you are more passionate about golf itself. The other 2 seem to have other angles to pursue, not that there's anything wrong with angles.

[nevets88]

There's no mention of what other sports Ignite Project participated in. May have been a professional something in a previous life or a college athlete, which is certainly a leg up.

While he's putting in fewer hours, he does have advantages over Dan Plan at the outset. More money, better weather, better shape.

[Nosevi]

I thought you'd have an interest in this one .  My gut tells me this is a bit more of a "side thing" for him, no coincidence that it aligns and promotes his gym business.  Of the 3, I think you are more passionate about golf itself. The other 2 seem to have other angles to pursue, not that there's anything wrong with angles.

I think doing it to test a hypothesis is fine but it limits your chances of success. I'm not trying to test a theory and I'm not trying to inspire anyone tbh. Selfish as it may seem I'm doing it because I want to achieve the goal. To set out and say "I'm going to do X every week for Y years in order to become a professional golfer." isn't the best way of doing it IMO. Far better to say that you'll do what it takes to succeed and change the plan accordingly. You may well still fail but you'll have given yourself the best chance of success.

There's no mention of what other sports Ignite Project participated in. May have been a professional something in a previous life or a college athlete, which is certainly a leg up.

I think any sporting background would help as playing pretty much any sport builds coordination and balance. You'll also be used to physical training which is a bonus. Be interested to see how this guy does simply because there's such a strong slant on physical fitness.

[pumaAttack]

I am curious, how many amateur/rec golfers put in 5,000 or 10,000 hours of practice over a 5 year time span.  20 hours a week really isn't that much.

[ChrisWev]

I am curious, how many amateur/rec golfers put in 5,000 or 10,000 hours of practice over a 5 year time span.  20 hours a week really isn't that much.

I think with him doing gym work and course time as somebody above mentioned it's more like 3,000 hours. Over 5 years with a couple of days off a week that's about 2 hours a day. I would say a lot on here wouldn't be far off that, in fact I'm pretty much mirroring what he's doing (I'm a year older). At my rate I expect to break 80 next year and hopefully to be playing at less than 10 HCP. With my rate I would need to go 10>5>3>1.5>0 just to get to scratch in 5 years which would be very difficult. He'll need to get to +5 and by then he will be 37, I would say Dan has more chance, 3,000 hours is not enough.

Saying that, I think the gym work would be very important (Dan not doing that and being too weak has proven that) but it is going to tire him out. Thing is if he works on the right gym work for the golf swing he should be able to hit it miles, especially form the 15 HCP head start.

[nevets88]

[QUOTE name="pumaAttack" url="/t/45853/the-dan-plan-10-000-hours-to-become-a-pro-golfer-dan-mclaughlin/3294#post_1173834"]   I am curious, how many amateur/rec golfers put in 5,000 or 10,000 hours of practice over a 5 year time span.  20 hours a week really isn't that much. [/QUOTE] I think with him doing gym work and course time as somebody above mentioned it's more like 3,000 hours. Over 5 years with a couple of days off a week that's about 2 hours a day. I would say a lot on here wouldn't be far off that, in fact I'm pretty much mirroring what he's doing (I'm a year older). At my rate I expect to break 80 next year and hopefully to be playing at less than 10 HCP. With my rate I would need to go 10>5>3>1.5>0 just to get to scratch in 5 years which would be very difficult. He'll need to get to +5 and by then he will be 37, I would say Dan has more chance, 3,000 hours is not enough. Saying that, I think the gym work would be very important (Dan not doing that and being too weak has proven that) but it is going to tire him out. Thing is if he works on the right gym work for the golf swing he should be able to hit it miles, especially form the 15 HCP head start.

We just saw a guy w/similar build and older than Dan Plan win the Open Championship. In the playoff, the burly over 6 foot guy came in last. DJ failed miserably. Bubba burnt out. I agree that Dan Plan lacks physicality, but imho, his swing was/is the biggest factor in his progression, although I agree he should spend more time in the gym, which I've said before many times I know I'm repeating myself my apologies. Who ignite plan chooses as a first pro will be huge (no pun intended :-)), imho, w/respect to how successful he is. Duh, I know, but little is said about it in detail.

[Lihu]

I'm probably close to 3000-4000 hours, but deliberate practice is less that 40 for me. Far less, but I'm changing that this year. Hoping to see serious improvement this year. . .

[ChrisWev]

We just saw a guy w/similar build and older than Dan Plan win the Open Championship. In the playoff, the burly over 6 foot guy came in last. DJ failed miserably. Bubba burnt out.

What I meant by that is Dan is pretty scrawny by the looks of things. He even describes himself as less than average height and weight and only carries his driver 245, and hits 40% of fairways (based on last trackman stats when he was a 6 HCP). Statistically over time this isn't going to get you on tour, when the average swing speed is at least 10mph faster. ZJ is still probably swinging a good 8mph faster than Dan. Obviously I agree that Dan's swing needs looking at too.

I may be incorrect but to me you need to get your swing speed up to tour average (113mph?) by the time you get to scratch (providing it's within your possible scope etc) to stand the best chance of getting/ staying on tour. I know it's not the be all and end all but a slow swing speed improvement along with any other improvements will make a massive difference. 10mph is about another 30 yards for total driver distance and if the S/S is in the tank you can always loft up to improve accuracy, Dan can't afford to do that to get to where he wants to be, which is probably one of the reasons he misses a lot of fairways.

I would say it wasn't a big deal years ago (Drive for show, putt for dough etc), but now it obviously is or you just get left behind.