Patting down grass behind ball when in the rough ...

[zeg]

Originally Posted by Rulesman

But be aware of this new decision on what 'improve' means

http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Rules-of-Golf/Decision-13/#13-2/0.5

Thanks for the link. I think that just about any change that would be caused by pressing behind your ball at address will fall into the category of a possible improvement, though.

[Rulesman]

Very likely. It may even cause the ball to move also.

[nick1998bunker]

if resting is using its own weight, what about letting the club drop behind the ball?

[Fourputt]

... I've always wondered when in the rough if it is allowed to give the grass behind the ball a little pat down with your club to give better access to the back of the ball (obviously, as long as you don't touch the ball) ?       I'd be surprised if the answer wasn't no, but have always been curious ... thx.

No.  You can only allow the weight of the club to rest behind the ball when grounding the club at address.  Any patting or additional pressure is a breach of Rule 13-2.

13-2. Improving Lie, Area Of Intended Stance Or Swing, Or Line Of Play

A player must not improve or allow to be improved:

the position or lie of his ball,

the area of his intended Stance or swing,

his Line Of Play or a reasonable extension of that line beyond theHole, or

the area in which he is to drop or place a ball,

by any of the following actions:

pressing a club on the ground,

moving, bending or breaking anything growing or fixed (including immovable Obstructions and objects defining Out Of Bounds),

creating or eliminating irregularities of surface,

removing or pressing down sand, loose soil, replaced divots or other cut turf placed in position, or

removing dew, frost or water.

However, the player incurs no penalty if the action occurs:

in grounding the club lightly when Addressing The Ball,

in fairly taking his Stance,

in making a Stroke or the backward movement of his club for aStroke and the Stroke is made,

in creating or eliminating irregularities of surface within the Teeing Ground or in removing dew, frost or water from the Teeing Ground, or

on the Putting Green in removing sand and loose soil or in repairing damage (Rule 16-1).

[Rulesman]

No.  You can only allow the weight of the club to rest behind the ball when grounding the club at address.  Any patting or additional pressure is a breach of Rule 13-2.

That was the answer given many times almost a year ago.

[Rulesman]

That was the answer given many times almost a year ago.

In fact nearly 3 years ago

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rulesman

That was the answer given many times almost a year ago.

In fact nearly 3 years ago

Oops.  I usually check the date, but this time I just read, clicked "Reply", and typed.  I'm usually pretty good at noticing that.  I was tired last night (after driving 2½ hours each way to the dentist to finish having a crown put in.

if resting is using its own weight, what about letting the club drop behind the ball?

My answer still applies to Nick's new post.  Letting the club drop behind the ball would not be "lightly grounding", and it runs the additional risk of causing the ball to move.

[Rulesman]

Oops.  I usually check the date, but this time I just read, clicked "Reply", and typed.  I'm usually pretty good at noticing that.  I was tired last night (after driving 2½ hours each way to the dentist to finish having a crown put in.

My answer still applies to Nick's new post.  Letting the club drop behind the ball would not be "lightly grounding", and it runs the additional risk of causing the ball to move.

Oops also. I missed the specific of the question.

[phan52]

I have a friend who I played with a lot and he always presses his club into the ground behind the ball, no matter what club he has in his hand, even his putter. I have told him numerous times to stop doing it but it is a bad habit and he won't/can't stop. He is definitely improving his lie in the rough and, on the green and fairways, his ball is oscillating. I stopped playing with him last summer but just played with him a few weeks ago because there was nobody else around. He asked why we hadn't played, as if he had to ask. Still was doing it.

[Patch]

I remember watching Sergio Garcia tamping down the grass behind the ball. It was shown on TV several times, and nothing was done about it. I think, on the PGA tour this falls under the "everyone does it, so it's OK" rules of etiquette. I also remember the talking heads not saying a word while Sergio was doing this. Later on there was short quip that while tamping down the grass, Sergio's ball did not move, although it did go up, and down on the grass that Sergio was tamping down. Funny thing is I don't remember the out come of his shot.

[iacas]

He asked why we hadn't played, as if he had to ask. Still was doing it.

Did you tell him?

Penalize him the next time.

[phan52]

Quote:

Originally Posted by phan52

He asked why we hadn't played, as if he had to ask. Still was doing it.

Originally Posted by iacas

Did you tell him?

Penalize him the next time.

Yes, I told him. And I told him there won't be a next time if he keeps doing it.

I put a printout of Rule 13-2 in his locker this past weekend. I am sure he knows where it came from.