which is harder...

[doublesuited77]

we had a debate this weekend on this and i thought this would generate some good debate here. The question is which level of handicap improvement is the hardest (e.g. requires the most work, time) to achieve. Here are the options.

- From 3 to 0
- From 6 to 3
- From 12 to 6
- From 24 to 12

[rmgr]

has to be 24 to 12 because it's the point where you're still learning how to play

[sonicblue]

we had a debate this weekend on this and i thought this would generate some good debate here. The question is which level of handicap improvement is the hardest (e.g. requires the most work, time) to achieve. Here are the options.

I almost voted 12 to 6, 'cuz I'm in it! When you can decently strike a ball a reasonable length, you can play to a 12. A 24 is making all kinds of mistakes re: course management, going in hazards, and likely chunking a bunch of short shots and hitting bananas and snap hooks. Eliminate those, and you can easily start making six pars a round and bogeying the rest.

To go from a 12 to a 6, you just have to be more consistent in shots you already know how to hit, and usually do. I find that what keeps me from dropping to a firm single-digit is playing like I already am one, and making some course management mistakes. Sometimes I just need to give my head a good jiggle, but by then, I've usually already lost my chance to shoot the low number. I envision that 6 to 3 is very tough, but I think the hardest has got to be 3 to 0 because at that point, you're really just talking about making more putts, which is the least forgiving part of the game. It always amazes me, to watch pros, especially Tiger, repeatedly drain 10-foot putts. I'm at the point where I really try to make everything, but 10-feet is still not a high % for me. Tiger was at 100% from that range this week!

[getinthehole]

I haven't got there yet but I would think 12 to 6 would be the hardest as it's going to be harder to play under a 12 handicap than a 24 handicap. Bogey every hole you play under 24, but much harder for 12.

[ChiChiIsMe]

I did 12-6 as well. I was at 12.2 index earlier this year looking at breaking 10 for the 1st time in years and took a step backwards. I suppose at any index you can have the same issues, I just wish I had more a)range time available to work on the issues and b)more idea what the hell I'm doing that I keep chunking my 8i!

[TheNextBen]

for me 12-6 was pretty goddamn hard and 6-3 was a piece of cake, same for 24-12... I don't know about 3-0 obviously ;)

[doublesuited77]

i might be a little biased because i went from a 19 to a 7 in less than two months. however, i think it is 3 to 0. Just looking at the number of people in both ranges should provide proof to this.

However, one of my best friends, a scratch golfer, claims it is 6 to 3 unless there are physical skills (length) which prevent you from playing par gold. His theory is that going from 6 to 3 is usually driven by preventing mistakes, eliminating doubles and course management, while moving from 3 to 0 is about making more birdies. his view (at least for him and his playing partners) is that scratch golfers don't make any more bogeys than 3 handicaps, they just make a few more birdies. With practice, he claims that it is easier to work on scoring shots (a positive) as opposed to preventing mistakes (a negative). Also, he says that when you can smell scratch, you just practice harder.

[thumper07]

well i voted 12-6 because thats what i've been in for about a year or so. my ball striking has dramatically improved over the last couple weeks. i'm pushing at shooting in the 70's and getting to a single digit by Jan 1, 08. what do people mean when the have a +handicapp?? like a +1.6. i'm just curious.

-matt

[gsujeff55]

well i voted 12-6 because thats what i've been in for about a year or so. my ball striking has dramatically improved over the last couple weeks. i'm pushing at shooting in the 70's and getting to a single digit by Jan 1, 08. what do people mean when the have a +handicapp?? like a +1.6. i'm just curious.

that means they average better than scratch. ie +1.6 is avg 70.4 on a par 72 course. and I think the hardest is going from 12-6....because to get to a 12 you don't really have to get THAT serious about the game....but to go from 12 to 6 you have to actually think, practice, and be able to 2 putt every green.

[Jeepthrills]

I said 24-12. The reason being that there is a huge difference between the two. Not just in strokes. Granted, the mistakes that a 24 makes may be easier to correct. The one factor that needs to be brought into the equation is how much practice time is being put in. Most golfers end up stuck in this range because they don't do the stuff off the course to get better. There may be reasons for that, but most involve time. I am a 17 because I get to play 9 holes, twice per week. My Sunday round is at a course without a range. My Wednesday round is at a course that has a range, but I rarely get there more than 10 minutes before my tee time, so the range is not an option. Given the chance to practice regularly I could easily knock 5 shots off. From there I would say, the lower you go the tougher it is. There is no margin of error for the scratch player. You need to minimize any mistakes. So I guess all things being equal I disagree with my choice. Go figure.

[iacas]

Wouldn't only a scratch golfer (or one who used to be scratch) be able to answer this question? How does a 9-handicapper know what it takes to get from 3 to 0?

However, one of my best friends, a scratch golfer, claims it is 6 to 3 unless there are physical skills (length) which prevent you from playing par gold. His theory is that going from 6 to 3 is usually driven by preventing mistakes, eliminating doubles and course management, while moving from 3 to 0 is about making more birdies. his view (at least for him and his playing partners) is that scratch golfers don't make any more bogeys than 3 handicaps, they just make a few more birdies. With practice, he claims that it is easier to work on scoring shots (a positive) as opposed to preventing mistakes (a negative). Also, he says that when you can smell scratch, you just practice harder.

I think that may have some merit, but then again, I've been between 3 and 6 for three years now. Getting down to scratch is proving to be quite difficult. It isn't just about making more birdies per se - it's about improving noticeably in all aspects of the game (in order to give myself more birdie chances, or more reasonable birdie chances). A little more accurate driving, a little better iron game, a little better bunker play, a little better pitching and chipping, maybe even a little better putting, a little bit of everything.

6-3 versus 3-0 may depend on the kind of golfer a person is. I'm pretty consistent, but that just means I am usually pretty close to the fairway and pretty close to the greens. Days when I score well all aspects of my game are working. I putt pretty well, so for me to get "more birdies" it's usually a matter of both driving the ball a little better and having a better iron and short game.

I said 24-12.

Everyone will have their opinion, and that's fine, but I'll never agree it's 24-12 or 12-6. No way in heck. I went from about a 24 to a 12 or so in about a year, then from a 12 to a 6 in about another year. I've been between 3 and 6 (currently 2.6, actually) since then.

Heck, most 24s could get down to 12s if they simply took an extra club into the greens, didn't try to kill their driver, and practiced their short game and putting for 30 minutes a week.

[lamebums]

I voted 3 to scratch - as you get closer to par, there's fewer and fewer errors you can afford to make, and fewer opportunities to save strokes, so there's not only pressure on your game not to screw up, but also pressure on yourself to make improvements, when there might not be many places to make them.

Imagine a diminishing returns sort of things here. A hack can become a 25 with a single lesson, a 25 can become a 15 if he takes one more club (instead of two more balls), but then it gets harder to make improvements. From 15 to 5, I'd say it's consistency with driving and ballstriking, as well as decent short game, but from there on in, it gets harder and harder.

[FIJIGolf23]

Being a 2.3 handicap, I have to agree 100% with what iacas just said. I tried out for my high school golf team my Sophomore year and shot 95+. 2 years later I was the #2 man on my team with a 77 in tryouts. Just over 3 years later and I am slowly getting the consistency and knowledge to work my way down towards scratch. A goal I want to acheive by next summer.

[P3R3]

I jealous of all you guys that have the time/money to play golf more than once a week. :'(

I was a ~20 for like 7 years (14-17), then quit till I was 19.5, now I am a ~13 1.5 yrs later. I am just so damn inconsistant its not even funny. Hopefully when I get back to college I will be able to make some strides in my game since I'll be having group lessons once a week and hopefully play once a week.

[NM Golf]

3 to scratch was the most difficult for me. Actually it was more like 4 to scratch. I found that the difference for me was at a 4, I did not really have to practice all that much. A bucket or 2 a week, some minor short game practice, and playing 5-6 times a month and I could shoot 75-78 pretty much every time I teed it up. This summer I set a goal to finally shave those last few strokes and become a player who can contend in some of the bigger tournaments. It was hard work. I practiced 4-5 times a week, played 18 holes at least 2-3 times a week, and threw in some late evening and early morning 9 holers as well. Plus I had to learn to practice better and harder. Some of my practice sessions were 5-6 hours long with a huge majority of the time being spent on the short game. I feel that in order to play at a scratch level you have to put in so much time that it is unrealistic for most people to do so. My wife and family are very understanding of my goals, plus I share a great deal of the money I win with them.

But anyway I think its those last few strokes which are the hardest because of the amount of time and effort that is needed to shave them off.

His theory is that going from 6 to 3 is usually driven by preventing mistakes, eliminating doubles and course management, while moving from 3 to 0 is about making more birdies

I don't make really more birdies now than I did. In my case I make fewer bogeys.

[Finn07]

Im going to vote 3 to scratch, but its really tough to say because since Ive never been either I have no idea what its like to get down there. Im currently an 8.0, (with my next revision on Wed., hopefully get lower) and I know if I could probably could putt better I can get down to a 6, other then that my opinion may be a little off until I can get down to the next level.

[mcecki]

I voted 24-12 cause that is the only thing I am near lol. But in the past few days I've really set my mind to improving my game. My 3 days ago terrible slice is nearly gone, and I know that the transition from 28-15ish won't be nearly as hard as shaving those strokes when my handicap is lower.

24-12ish I guess you are learning the game, and figure out what you are doing wrong and fix it.

12ish-0 you kind of have to take what you are doing right and perfect it.

am I right?

[CG031]

3 to scratch. Sometimes it takes rebuilding your swing that you spent your whole life with, or maybe just getting some putting tips, lol. But, I think it's really hard to get to scratch.