Why are the men (PGA Tour) so much better than the women (LPGA)?

[nick1998bunker]

You brought the CR (72) up, so perhaps you can find the right CR for the tee and for the gender. Women and men have different CR and slope ratings on same tee.

Why are they different? That's not fair?

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by luu5

You brought the CR (72) up, so perhaps you can find the right CR for the tee and for the gender. Women and men have different CR and slope ratings on same tee.

Why are they different? That's not fair?

The USGA has the definitions for scratch for both male and female. The main differences are the distances.

http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Handicap-System-Manual/Rule-02/#ScratchGolfer

[mvmac]

The USGA has the definitions for scratch for both male and female. The main differences are the distances.

http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Handicap-System-Manual/Rule-02/#ScratchGolfer

Yes and when I referred to a legit scratch, I was talking about a guy that can play different courses and shoot his handicap, also plays in tournaments throughout the year.

I think if a player like that played in 20 LPGA events, he might not make half the cuts but I think he would be close.  Again we're talking about playing from 6,400-6,500 yards, rough isn't that penal, greens aren't scary fast.

[acerimusdux]

Quote:

Everyone agrees that the women's tour needs better exposure, more buzz and bigger stars in order to thrive. Yet the tour isn't giving its players their best chance to create buzz and turn in star-making performances. The talent is there, but most weeks, the courses are set up too long.

The average driving distance on the LPGA Tour in 2012 is 253 yards. According to the PGA of America's "Tee It Forward" chart , a player who drives the ball 250 yards should be playing from tees that measure 6,200 to 6,400 yards. Yet the average tournament course length on the LPGA Tour is 6,550 yards. Before you say, "Sounds close enough," consider this: The PGA Tour driving average is 287 yards, and if you calculate where the same chart would put a player with that distance (the chart actually ends at 275 yards, but the math is pretty simple to figure out), he would land right around where the average PGA Tour layout does: just north of 7,300 yards. So the men are playing courses that suit their driving distances perfectly, while the women are playing from courses that are too long. Why? Because even at 6,500-plus yards, the girls are fighting a stigma that their courses are skimpy compared to the guys'.

link

So some of it is actually the distance.

[luu5]

Why are they different? That's not fair?

Have you noticed that CR is not necessarily par either? Perhaps you should study handicapping little bit more.

[nick1998bunker]

Have you noticed that CR is not necessarily par either? Perhaps you should study handicapping little bit more.

all I know is the back tees I shoot lower scores and gives me a better differentials. CR ranges from 70-73

[luu5]

CR ranges from 70-73

Is it fair?

[jvalhalla]

as has been previously stated, i think it is due to the competition/interest on the men's side vs. the women's. When I think back over my last 27ish years playing golf in Arizona, Texas and Florida, it occurs to me just how few women I've ever actually seen playing. I'm not even talking about playing well, just playing. Then when I think about how many I've played with/seen that I thought "she's pretty good", I can only think of ONE (a college golfer).

I'm not saying women aren't or can't be talented golfers, but there are just very few females who seem to have a passion to play golf. Maybe I've led a sheltered golf life, but women seem outnumbered 500 to 1 on the golf course.

[MS256]

as has been previously stated, i think it is due to the competition/interest on the men's side vs. the women's. When I think back over my last 27ish years playing golf in Arizona, Texas and Florida, it occurs to me just how few women I've ever actually seen playing. I'm not even talking about playing well, just playing. Then when I think about how many I've played with/seen that I thought "she's pretty good", I can only think of ONE (a college golfer).

I'm not saying women aren't or can't be talented golfers, but there are just very few females who seem to have a passion to play golf. Maybe I've led a sheltered golf life, but women seem outnumbered 500 to 1 on the golf course.

I would say that "500 to1" would be pretty close around here also. I definitely could count on one hand the ones that I consider "pretty good".

There is a course we used to go to occasionally in Auburn where women (that all appeared to be Asian) outnumbered the men, but that was the exception.

[nick1998bunker]

Is it fair?

what do you mean?

[Golfingdad]

I would say that "500 to1" would be pretty close around here also. I definitely could count on one hand the ones that I consider "pretty good".

There is a course we used to go to occasionally in Auburn where women (that all appeared to be Asian) outnumbered the men, but that was the exception.

Wow ... that is a ridiculously lopsided ratio.  Around here, I'd say (and obviously "around here" still only applies to the actual courses I've played, not all of Socal) I'd estimate the ratio of men to women playing as something around, oh I don't know ... 20 to 1, maybe?

Currently, most courses around here start sending people out at 7am, and the last groups that hope to finish 18 have to head out around 1pm.  If they are sending out groups every 8 minutes (pretty average, I think) and I'm doing my math right, then that means that I could sit on the practice putting green and watch everybody come through all day long ...

and I'd see, on average, 1 woman every 3 1/3 days.  Is that really how few women golf in Alabama (and Florida)?  I find that hard to believe.

[MS256]

Wow ... that is a ridiculously lopsided ratio.  Around here, I'd say (and obviously "around here" still only applies to the actual courses I've played, not all of Socal) I'd estimate the ratio of men to women playing as something around, oh I don't know ... 20 to 1, maybe?

Currently, most courses around here start sending people out at 7am, and the last groups that hope to finish 18 have to head out around 1pm.  If they are sending out groups every 8 minutes (pretty average, I think) and I'm doing my math right, then that means that I could sit on the practice putting green and watch everybody come through all day long ...

and I'd see, on average, 1 woman every 3 1/3 days.  Is that really how few women golf in Alabama (and Florida)?  I find that hard to believe.

I wouldn't say "in Alabama" (and certainly not in Florida) because I wouldn't have a clue. I've probably played at 10 or 12 courses in Alabama (edit: well now that I think about it a few more than that) and none in Florida. When I said "around here" I actually meant more locally and "500 to 1" was certainly not meant to be a literal statement (even though it could be close for all I know).

There is one woman where I work that plays a couple of times a week and my wife joins her when she's not working, except in the summer when she works 7 days a week and doesn't play. Other than them it wouldn't be unusual to not see any women on the course for weeks (maybe even months). Their complaint is always that they don't know any other women that want to play.

At the club where I was a member there was one woman that played regularly with the men in the daily money game. Other than her I didn't see a woman on the course more than a few times a year.

There are a couple more courses that I play occasionally and I wouldn't have a good idea how many women play those courses but I've never seen any at all when I've been there.

I don't know what the ratio is but it's got to be pretty high or I would see them out there.

[Golfingdad]

I wouldn't say "in Alabama" (and certainly not in Florida) because I wouldn't have a clue. I've probably played at 10 or 12 courses in Alabama (edit: well now that I think about it a few more than that) and none in Florida. When I said "around here" I actually meant more locally and "500 to 1" was certainly not meant to be a literal statement (even though it could be close for all I know).

There is one woman where I work that plays a couple of times a week and my wife joins her when she's not working, except in the summer when she works 7 days a week and doesn't play. Other than them it wouldn't be unusual to not see any women on the course for weeks (maybe even months). Their complaint is always that they don't know any other women that want to play.

At the club where I was a member there was one woman that played regularly with the men in the daily money game. Other than her I didn't see a woman on the course more than a few times a year.

There are a couple more courses that I play occasionally and I wouldn't have a good idea how many women play those courses but I've never seen any at all when I've been there.

I don't know what the ratio is but it's got to be pretty high or I would see them out there.

Gotcha.  :)  (And Florida was only in reference to the guy you quoted ... jvalhalla.)

It's also highly possible I just live in an area that has a lot of women that play golf. :)

[MS256]

Gotcha.  :)  (And Florida was only in reference to the guy you quoted ... jvalhalla.)

It's also highly possible I just live in an area that has a lot of women that play golf. :)

I've wondered for years why the guys that have daughters don't have them out there playing. Especially the ones that are club members and it wouldn't be an extra cost. The girls play softball, basketball and soccer but not much golf.

This isn't exactly a golf hot spot anyway. It was headed more in that direction until every sock mill in the county shut down and about half of the people in the county lost their jobs and their main skills were to work in an industry that went to South America.

[David in FL]

I've wondered for years why the guys that have daughters don't have them out there playing. Especially the ones that are club members and it wouldn't be an extra cost. The girls play softball, basketball and soccer but not much golf.

This isn't exactly a golf hot spot anyway. It was headed more in that direction until every sock mill in the county shut down and about half of the people in the county lost their jobs and their main skills were to work in an industry that went to South America.

Mine is 14 now and just isn't interested.  She's been to a couple summer day-camps and has had some group lessons.  I'll take her to the range, putting green, and to ride around on the course when I can, but if you've seen my swing video, you'll understand that I'm not going to try to teach anyone how to hit a golf ball.  Right now it's just not her thing and I don't want to push her to the point that she hates the game.  I'm hoping that she'll come to it in her own time.

[inthehole]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jvalhalla

as has been previously stated, i think it is due to the competition/interest on the men's side vs. the women's. When I think back over my last 27ish years playing golf in Arizona, Texas and Florida, it occurs to me just how few women I've ever actually seen playing. I'm not even talking about playing well, just playing. Then when I think about how many I've played with/seen that I thought "she's pretty good", I can only think of ONE (a college golfer).

I'm not saying women aren't or can't be talented golfers, but there are just very few females who seem to have a passion to play golf. Maybe I've led a sheltered golf life, but women seem outnumbered 500 to 1 on the golf course.

I would say that "500 to1" would be pretty close around here also. I definitely could count on one hand the ones that I consider "pretty good".

There is a course we used to go to occasionally in Auburn where women (that all appeared to be Asian) outnumbered the men, but that was the exception.

I play about 50% of the time with my wife & we often seem to get paired with random couples ... I see alot of women playing golf in PA.     Got paired with a young lady last year that started to walk to the blue tee's on hole #1, and I just about told her the ladies tee's were about 25 yards in front of her ... turned out she was an ex-collegiate player and BEAT me (in my defense, it was close) - after I saw her drive, I sure was glad I held my tongue & didn't mention the ladies tee's (she drove it a bit farther than me - about 250 yds, a few times significantly longer).    It was also the first time I've played the blue tees in a while - ego forced me to - LOL !!

Come to think of it, that was the only time I've ever been paired with a single lady player.     Every other time, it's been a couple.    I don't think very many women play golf alone (unless they have serious game as I witnessed) ... I think it's more social for them - with friends or as a couple.

[RayG]

500 to one? That's a bit steep, but I guess it depends on your course. The local 9 hole that I frequent is almost guaranteed to have a 4some of ladies every 4 or 5 groups or so. And in the other groups, maybe 1 or 2 ladies in 1 out of 3. The other county 18 holer is less likely to have ANY women- especially earlier on weekends, with a few showing up later in the afternoon as the course is less crowded. On the recent trip to Myrtle Beach back in June, I saw NO women at all on any of the courses I played. The courses I play in Florida are similar to the 9 holer scenario. Plenty of ladies out there, but I've only played with 2 or 3 that are likely to tee it up from the whites, much less the blues.

[MS256]

I don't think very many women play golf alone (unless they have serious game as I witnessed) ... I think it's more social for them - with friends or as a couple.

I think there's a whole lot of truth in that statement. Probably why some areas have almost no women golfers and others have a lot. It probably wouldn't even take much to start that ball rolling.

There has never been a single time that my wife ever went to the course alone to play golf, but she always gets excited when her friend calls her and asks if she wants to play. I'm sure both of them would play many more rounds of golf if there were a few more women that wanted to play.

In contrast I used to go to the course every day that I didn't work and play all day long, and every afternoon on the days I did work. If somebody showed up and wanted to play that was great but if nobody showed up I still played all day long anyway.

It's sort of like why most women would much rather go shopping with a bunch of girlfriends than to sit in a deer stand alone all day long.