Is Golf a Sport or a Game?

[dsc123]

I keep going back to baseball, but Bill Belichek always said that what he loves about baseball is that you can't run the clock.  You've got 9 innings, and if you're winning, you've still got to go get the other guys out.  Golf is similar.  You can't just get ahead and slow it down.  You've got to keep putting up scores.

[MbolicGolf]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Golf is exactly the same here.  The distance or timed sports require you to run a distance, and the golf equivalent is you are required to finish 72 holes.  There is no set score to reach, but there isn't a set time to reach in running and swimming sports either.  You simply have to do it faster (or is less strokes) than everybody else.

There's a finish line, in running and a finish line in swimming and you have to cross it faster than everyone else. The point of golf is to put the ball in the hole and if you do that 18 times you finish a round. you don't have to hole out faster than anyone else, time wise, and you don't have to hit it any farther. You do have to finish the round in less strokes, and again I see your point, I just think that theres less of a phsyical component and more of a mental component in furthrance of that goal.

I just realized that this whole Game v. Sport thing can be, and usually is coded labeling of games being not worth of the respect as sports. I don't feel that way at all. Golf is hard, I respect the Game and I love the game. I simply don't think of it as sport it's to mental.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by MbolicGolf

I just realized that this whole Game v. Sport thing can be, and usually is coded labeling of games being not worth of the respect as sports.

Hopefully not on here (everybody here loves and respects golf, right?), but when having this debate with non golfers that is totally the feeling I get as well.

[MbolicGolf]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Hopefully not on here (everybody here loves and respects golf, right?), but when having this debate with non golfers that is totally the feeling I get as well.

Actually, I just changed my mind. Golf is a sport.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by MbolicGolf

Actually, I just changed my mind. Golf is a sport.

Boo!  Why'd you do that?  We were having fun!

[ApocG10]

Golf is a sport. Those who disagree are wrong.

Auito racing is also 100% sport. Those who disagree are also wrong.

Anything that requires physical ability to compete is a sport. I have played a great many sports over my 30 years, some of them at very, very high level. Golf is one of the hardest I have ever been involved with.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by MbolicGolf

If lynchpin of a sport is physical excercise, then it stands to reason that that the contest be phsyical.

Who decided that? I don't know if I agree to that.

Competitive target shooting (maybe even with a bow and arrows) might be a sport, and if you don't like that, then I could say golf is a physical exercise. It's not entirely mental. You can't play actual golf purely via a computer or video game or something.

Originally Posted by MbolicGolf

Meaning you have to move a mass in a way that supersedes your opponent in spite of your opponents best efforts to stop you.

That rules out a lot of things 99% of people would call sports, you know. All forms of racing, for one. Runners can't block others (illegal) and swimmers can't either. High jumpers can't. Etc.

Heck, chess has a single opponent, and if you keep talking, chess is going to be more of a sport than the 4 x 100m relay on a track or a pool.

Originally Posted by MbolicGolf

The other thing is that there's no simultaneous activity in golf, when you perform the activity you are given a silent environment so you can make your shot. If golf was players scrambling to hit the same ball then I would call it a sport.

You're just digging yourself a bigger hole.

Originally Posted by MbolicGolf

The point of distance or timed sports is that everyone is given the same goal 100m, 200m, 5k, and you have to complete that goal faster than your opponent doing substantialy the same thing your opponents are doing. In golf there's no number or shots or time or distance that every golfer has to adhear too. The goal is to put the ball in the hold and you can do that in anyway you see fit with in the rules. In anycase I see your point but I still fall on the game side of the fence becasue there's not enough physical conteste between players to over come the induviduality.

18 holes. Or 72. That's your "distance." You have to complete that goal "fastest" (fewest strokes) than the other 153+ opponents.

Originally Posted by Gresh24

They were defined as strength, speed, agility, quickness, etc.   Look back a couple posts...

You haven't defined those things, and I say golf has strength, speed, agility, and quickness. Let's see you carry a ball 290 or wrench a 4-iron out of juicy rough and carry it 224 and land it on something the size of your kitchen without strength, speed, agility, or quickness.

Originally Posted by ApocG10

Anything that requires physical ability to compete is a sport.

Just curiosu then: is darts a sport? Billiards? Bocce? Horseshoes? Just curious.

[MbolicGolf]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Boo!  Why'd you do that?  We were having fun!

Well, even though golf is less physical, it's certainly not analagous to chess or any other game. It was fun, I love to argue as well trust me, but even though I could distinguish golf from other sports I could not liken it to any game in so as to create more than a marginal connection. So I concluded since it has more atributes of a sport than it does a game it's a sport.

[tiger187126]

golf is a sport if i'm doing well and just a game if i'm sucking it up.

honestly i've always thought of it as a sport, and people who decry that usually can't play it themselves. a running theme with people who decry things is that they cannot do said thing themselves. i mean car racing and horse racing are still sports and they seem to be more on the fringe than golf does.

it was funny reading people's reactions to phil being upset with cellphone pictures though. from the couch a lot of people are experts on how easy it is to compete against the rest of the top 1% in your sport/game.

[MbolicGolf]

Originally Posted by iacas

Who decided that? I don't know if I agree to that.

Competitive target shooting (maybe even with a bow and arrows) might be a sport, and if you don't like that, then I could say golf is a physical exercise. It's not entirely mental. You can't play actual golf purely via a computer or video game or something.

That rules out a lot of things 99% of people would call sports, you know. All forms of racing, for one. Runners can't block others (illegal) and swimmers can't either. High jumpers can't. Etc.

Heck, chess has a single opponent, and if you keep talking, chess is going to be more of a sport than the 4 x 100m relay on a track or a pool.

You're just digging yourself a bigger hole.

18 holes. Or 72. That's your "distance." You have to complete that goal "fastest" (fewest strokes) than the other 153+ opponents.

You haven't defined those things, and I say golf has strength, speed, agility, and quickness. Let's see you carry a ball 290 or wrench a 4-iron out of juicy rough and carry it 224 and land it on something the size of your kitchen without strength, speed, agility, or quickness.

Just curiosu then: is darts a sport? Billiards? Bocce? Horseshoes? Just curious.

What do you mean I'm digging my self a bigger hole?

[Gresh24]

Originally Posted by iacas

You haven't defined those things, and I say golf has strength, speed, agility, and quickness. Let's see you carry a ball 290 or wrench a 4-iron out of juicy rough and carry it 224 and land it on something the size of your kitchen without strength, speed, agility, or quickness.

Yeah, cuz nothing defines speed, strength, agility, and quickness like a 4 iron out of the rough...

[Jimdangles]

I still can't believe this is really an argument still. Golf is very much a sport.

Dictionary.com (first result)

Sport: an athletic activity requiring skill or physical prowess and often of a competitive nature. as racing, baseball, tennis, golf , bowling, wrestling, boxing, hunting , fishing, etc.

Before you say Dictionary.com also defines golf as:

Golf - a game in which clubs with wooden or metal heads are used to hit a small, white ball into a number of holes, usually 9 or 18, in succession, situated at various distances over a course having natural or artificial obstacles, the object being to get the ball into each hole in as few strokes as possible.

It says golf is a game but the same website says Ice hockey is defined as.

Ice Hockey - a game played on ice between two teams of six skaters each, the object being to score goals by shooting a puck into the opponents' cage using a stick with a wooden blade set at an obtuse angle to the shaft.

Definition of game. Third Definition

Game - a competitive activity involving skill, chance, or endurance on the part of two or more persons who play according to a set of rules, usually for their own amusement or for that of spectators.

I think the answer lies in here. A game is a sport but a sport is not neccesarily a game. Golf is both a game and a sport . I think maybe that depends on what level it is being played at.

[scottyjoe145]

Who gives a rats ass if its a sport or a game?  It is however, the best one ever!!

[ApocG10]

Originally Posted by iacas

Who decided that? I don't know if I agree to that.

Competitive target shooting (maybe even with a bow and arrows) might be a sport, and if you don't like that, then I could say golf is a physical exercise. It's not entirely mental. You can't play actual golf purely via a computer or video game or something.

That rules out a lot of things 99% of people would call sports, you know. All forms of racing, for one. Runners can't block others (illegal) and swimmers can't either. High jumpers can't. Etc.

Heck, chess has a single opponent, and if you keep talking, chess is going to be more of a sport than the 4 x 100m relay on a track or a pool.

You're just digging yourself a bigger hole.

18 holes. Or 72. That's your "distance." You have to complete that goal "fastest" (fewest strokes) than the other 153+ opponents.

You haven't defined those things, and I say golf has strength, speed, agility, and quickness. Let's see you carry a ball 290 or wrench a 4-iron out of juicy rough and carry it 224 and land it on something the size of your kitchen without strength, speed, agility, or quickness.

Just curiosu then: is darts a sport? Billiards? Bocce? Horseshoes? Just curious.

At the higest level they are. They require physical precision and effort. I dont like darts, but that shit is HARD. Horseshoes, not so much, more of a game imo. Are there Horseshoe championships? Shooting sports are in the olympics. They are definitely sports, and are precision based.

I saw someone who said anything with judges was not a sport. That means boxing is not a sport, when in fact its the oldest sport in the world. Older than wrestling, which goes back to the greeks.

Everyone tries to make their own definition, when it very clearly has an exact one.

[Kapanda]

Originally Posted by Harmonious

Sounds like your definition of athleticism is "I can do it" and your definition of skill is "I can't do it". You must view yourself as an athlete. You suck at golf, so it must not be an athletic endeavor. So long as it makes sense to you, I guess.

BTW, ever tried walking 18 holes in 95 degree/99% humidity, while swinging a golf club?  I guess that only requires skill, not athleticism.

If that's how it sounds, then maybe I'm not expressing myself properly.

I love football, and I used to play it. I never made the big leagues because I wasn't athletic enough AND I wasn't skilled enough. I'm never going to be a a pro MMA fighter neither, because I'm not athletic or skilled enough. Golf, however, requires a lot more skill than I currently have, but not much more (if at all) athletic ability.

This is so weird, because I keep parroting the same thing, and I really don't see how you can misinterpret it as much as you guys are!

Originally Posted by iacas

No. I think we agree that you've yet to provide your definition in a way that's not entirely ambiguous.

Then define them. Because from where I'm sitting, golf requires a mix of athleticism, physical ability, and skill.

I don't think you realize how dumb that sounds.

I'm not the starting QB for the Steelers because I don't have the skill, not because I don't have the physical ability.

I'm not the starting shortstop for the Pirates because I don't have the skill, not because I don't have the physical ability.

I'm not playing on Sidney Crosby's wing because I don't have the skill, not because I don't have the physical ability.

Give me a break.

Yep.

And you've not offered a single thing to say otherwise, including a simple definition for "athleticism."

Uhhhh... no.. but see above.

[Kapanda]

Here's me thinking that me quoting wikipedia, which also says that the definition of sports is ambiguous, would've settled all this.

We're not going to settle this.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by MbolicGolf

Well, even though golf is less physical, it's certainly not analagous to chess or any other game. It was fun, I love to argue as well trust me, but even though I could distinguish golf from other sports I could not liken it to any game in so as to create more than a marginal connection. So I concluded since it has more atributes of a sport than it does a game it's a sport.

This is why we here at my work have so much trouble making the "rules" for what is and what isn't a sport.  Every time you make one that seems to make sense, you rule out something you don't mean to.

Of course, that's why it makes these kind of debates fun ... because they are, in the end, completely meaningless and all in good fun.

[Kapanda]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

This is why we here at my work have so much trouble making the "rules" for what is and what isn't a sport.  Every time you make one that seems to make sense, you rule out something you don't mean to.

Of course, that's why it makes these kind of debates fun ... because they are, in the end, completely meaningless and all in good fun.

Unless you're me.