Are you ready for some NFL Football? 2014 Edition.

[CarlSpackler]

Look at the source.

It's being discussed in the media so I posted it here. Apparently the NFL is investigating. I'm not saying it happened or not. Just posting for discussion.

How would this even be possible?

So during the game, the Patriots would somehow obtain possession of the balls out of play while the attendants should have them and deflate them?  That seems a bit absurd that they would actually risk getting in trouble for something so inconsequential.

And never mind the fact that the totality of the information is 7 tweets from an Indianapolis beat writer and his source.

I'm no Patriots fan, but color me skeptical on this one.

And then there is this story: http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story/_/id/12193345/nfl-investigating-whether-new-england-patriots-deflated-footballs-indianapolis-colts

which contains a bit more information regarding typical game procedures including this nugget that the original story conveniently left out:

"Officials check balls as they go into the game, and if the ball doesn't feel perfect, they can throw it out," Daopoulos said. "There is always the possibility that balls can lose air due to the conditions."

Gonna venture a guess that nothing is discovered and this whole "controversy" turns out to be complete nonsense.

Or that could be the latest NFL cover up. Nothing to see here folks. Move along.

[DrvFrShow]

I just hope Seattle wins. I hate the Patriots.

[boogielicious]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boogielicious

Look at the source.

It's on NFL.com. That's a pretty good source as to what the NFL is investigating.

The source is an Indy beat reporter.  The only deflated balls in that game were on the Indy sideline.

[phan52]

I just hope Seattle wins. I hate the Patriots.

I despise my NFL East rival Giants and still rooted for them against the Patriots. Go Seahawks!

[boogielicious]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrvFrShow

I just hope Seattle wins. I hate the Patriots.

I despise the Giants and still rooted for them against the Patriots. Go Seahawks!

I guess that has nothing to do with the Eagles loss to the Patriots then?

[dsc123]

The source is an Indy beat reporter.  The only deflated balls in that game were on the Indy sideline.

Do you honestly believe that the NFL is not investigating this?

[Golfingdad]

Do you honestly believe that the NFL is not investigating this?

Not to speak for Scott, but yes, I absolutely believe that the NFL is investigating this.  But at this point, I'm also open to the possibility that it's not even necessarily abnormal that a ball loses some air during the course of the game and I don't even know how often this sort of thing happens.  "Investigating" might mean that there is be a ball or two per game all season long that lose a little air and the NFL double checks them, for all I know.

The idea that this has only come to light because of an Indy reporter certainly isn't lost on me.

[Gunther]

Belichek doesn't cheat, he's trying to achieve a competitive edge.

[dsc123]

Not to speak for Scott, but yes, I absolutely believe that the NFL is investigating this.  But at this point, I'm also open to the possibility that it's not even necessarily abnormal that a ball loses some air during the course of the game and I don't even know how often this sort of thing happens.  "Investigating" might mean that there is be a ball or two per game all season long that lose a little air and the NFL double checks them, for all I know. The idea that this has only come to light because of an Indy reporter certainly isn't lost on me.

Sure, but Scott denied the report, which simply says that the NFL is investigating the issue, and says the only deflated balls were on the Colts sideline. I was responding to the blind homerism. I'd normally agree with you that we should look to the reasonable explanations before calling someone a cheat. But here we have a history of cheating. six years without being caught cheating doesn't earn my trust back. It wasn't that long ago that the NFL fined belicheck a cool half million and first round draft pick for cheating. Nobody has been caught deflating footballs since.... Oh wait, now I get why your defending the guys accused of deflating footballs... ;) I'm just messing with you. :) What can I say, I have no sympathy for cheaters.

[Golfingdad]

Sure, but Scott denied the report, which simply says that the NFL is investigating the issue, and says the only deflated balls were on the Colts sideline. I was responding to the blind homerism.

I'd normally agree with you that we should look to the reasonable explanations before calling someone a cheat. But here we have a history of cheating. six years without being caught cheating doesn't earn my trust back. It wasn't that long ago that the NFL fined belicheck a cool half million and first round draft pick for cheating.

Nobody has been caught deflating footballs since.... Oh wait, now I get why your defending the guys accused of deflating footballs... ;) I'm just messing with you. :)

What can I say, I have no sympathy for cheaters.

I didn't see his comment as any different than mine.  We both originally noticed that the first person to make a deal out of this was an Indy reporter.  Then he happened to follow it up with a joke - I don't think he was saying he believes that the NFL is not investigating.

And I don't get your joke.  Did this happen before with the Chargers or something?  (Apologies, because I'm probably sounding like I'm being a stick in the mud by pretending not to understand the reference - but I actually really don't)

And I get your last point.  Hard to refute that.  I don't really think they're cheaters but I recognize I'm in the minority so I won't waste breath arguing that for too long.

[dsc123]

I didn't see his comment as any different than mine.  We both originally noticed that the first person to make a deal out of this was an Indy reporter.  Then he happened to follow it up with a joke - I don't think he was saying he believes that the NFL is not investigating. And I don't get your joke.  Did this happen before with the Chargers or something?  (Apologies, because I'm probably sounding like I'm being a stick in the mud by pretending not to understand the reference - but I actually really don't) And I get your last point.  Hard to refute that.  I don't really think they're cheaters but I recognize I'm in the minority so I won't waste breath arguing that for too long.

The guy reported that the refs took a ball put of play and that the NFL is investigating whether the pats cheated. If you question that story on an ad hominem basis, what can you be suggesting other than that those two things are not true? We know that they are. And I was just making a joke because I thought you were a usc fan and they got fined for doing the same in 2012.

[Golfingdad]

The guy reported that the refs took a ball put of play and that the NFL is investigating whether the pats cheated. If you question that story on an ad hominem basis, what can you be suggesting other than that those two things are not true? We know that they are.

Not necessarily.  Without questioning whether those two things are true or not, I can also question how much importance I give it based on the lack of other information.  I.e., how often does this happen?  Is this the first time in a long time that anybody had ever noticed a ball slightly deflated?  If so, then it would probably garner a little more attention than if it were simply a routine part of a game that happens once or twice every week.  (And if it was frequent, let's check the Giants - that would help explain how the hell Odell Beckham caught that ball ;))

It would be like if an uninformed reporter made a big deal of how Dale Earnhardt had his car impounded after a big NASCAR win and they were measuring it to see if he "cheated."  In reality, that is a regular part of every single race for the top finishers.

That is where the source of the story comes in.  The fact that it's given so much attention by only an Indianapolis beat reporter leads me to be a little skeptical of its importance.  When the Patriots beat the Chargers in 2008, half of the stories in San Diego were about how the Patriots were a-holes for dancing on the logo (or whatever it was that upset Ladainian Tomlinson).  But really, it was that we were all just hurt that our team lost and were kind of being sore losers - reaching for whatever excuse we could get our hands on.  If there was ANYTHING out there that happened during or before the game that we could have pointed to, we'd have jumped at that chance.

Lastly, I don't like the blanket statement type usage of the word "cheater."  It really diminishes things like using PED usage, or paying off refs, or bounty systems for intentionally injuring players, when you call them cheaters for allegedly having a ball that may have been slightly under-inflated.  Heck, maybe Vince Wilfork just sat on it.

And I was just making a joke because I thought you were a usc fan and they got fined for doing the same in 2012.

Oh, sorry, I didn't remember that.  I'm not an SC fan but would have still found the humor if I was properly informed.  OK, who am I kidding, I probably was informed at one time and have just since forgot cuz I'm getting old.

[dsc123]

Hmm... I don't think this is a situation like you describe with the chargers. First, it didn't start with the beat writer. The beat reporter was just the guy with the source that told him the NFL was investigating. The NFL was already looking into it. The refs took the ball off the field. Also, everyone is making a big deal out of this, not just this reporter. It's on ESPN and nfl.com. Hell, I heard it on NPR today. I'm sure someone will come out and claim everyone does it, just like last time. But that won't carry much weight with me unless it comes from reputable sources outside the team that's been caught red handed. I add Boston sports teams to the list of that get liberal treatment of the word "cheater". I get that after years of ineptitude you'll take what you can get, whether they are world series championships on the back of a couple of juicers or super bowls aided by the knowledge of what plays the other team are calling. But it's like elementary school curriculum in the area just skips over the whole "cheaters never win" thing and moves right on to "if you ain't cheating you ain't trying." at least I'm honest, right? I try to stick to facts and logic with these discussions though.:) Edit: sorry for the lack of multi quote but I'm posting from my phone and it's a pain. And that last paragraph was in jest if that isn't clear.

[Golfingdad]

Hmm... I don't think this is a situation like you describe with the chargers. First, it didn't start with the beat writer. The beat reporter was just the guy with the source that told him the NFL was investigating. The NFL was already looking into it. The refs took the ball off the field.

Also, everyone is making a big deal out of this, not just this reporter. It's on ESPN and nfl.com. Hell, I heard it on NPR today.

It's ENTIRELY possible, and perhaps even quite likely, that it would have been a story regardless.

But at this point its also possible that its a complete non-story ... if, like I suggested, balls are routinely removed from games because something happened to them.  Do we know, yet, how often balls are removed from games by referees?

And the only reason "everybody" is making a big deal out of it is because it's the Patriots.  If we found out tomorrow that the Cleveland Browns intentionally deflated footballs to win games, our reaction would probably be closer to "aww, that's cute.  At least they are trying."

Its the same reason we froth at the mouth to take down the Yankees or the Lakers (before they sucked) or Kobe, or Lebron and of course, especially, Tiger Woods.

---

The only facts currently seem to be:

1. Ball was taken out of game by ref.

2. Ball(s) is being looked at by NFL.

Nothing about how or who deflated said ball(s).  Nothing but speculation as to why.  Heck, no actual confirmation that ball(s) were deflated.  It's a big jump at this point from the facts to "the Patriots are being investigated for cheating" but it's such an easy one for most people to make.

[meenman]

It's a big jump at this point from the facts to "the Patriots are being investigated for cheating" but it's such an easy one for most people to make.

Of course it is - spygate makes the patsies the equivalent of felons.

Would you let a convicted rapist date your daughter?

[dsc123]

It's ENTIRELY possible, and perhaps even quite likely, that it would have been a story regardless. But at this point its also possible that its a complete non-story ... if, like I suggested, balls are routinely removed from games because something happened to them.  Do we know, yet, how often balls are removed from games by referees? And the only reason "everybody" is making a big deal out of it is because it's the Patriots.  If we found out tomorrow that the Cleveland Browns intentionally deflated footballs to win games, our reaction would probably be closer to "aww, that's cute.  At least they are trying." Its the same reason we froth at the mouth to take down the Yankees or the Lakers (before they sucked) or Kobe, or Lebron and of course, especially, Tiger Woods. [rule]The only facts currently seem to be: 1. Ball was taken out of game by ref. 2. Ball(s) is being looked at by NFL. Nothing about how or who deflated said ball(s).  Nothing but speculation as to why.  Heck, no actual confirmation that ball(s) were deflated.  It's a big jump at this point from the facts to "the Patriots are being investigated for cheating" but it's such an easy one for most people to make.

I definitely agree that it's a bigger story because it's about the pats. As for the last part, do you think they would be conducting an investigation of the ball taken off the field was the proper weight? And if they're not investigating whether the pats did it, what else would they investigate? That doesn't mean they're guilty, but I think I don't think we're jumping to conclusions to say the pats are being investigated for wrongdoing here. Unfortunately, there's little chance of getting to the bottom of it. I doubt there's anyway to tell what happened unless someone cops to it.

[Jakester23]

So who's going to win the Super Bowl?  I was so pissed after the packers game I couldn't even bring myself to watch the AFC championship game.   I hope its Seattle.  I think I will be even more upset if New England wins knowing GB would most likely have beat them again.  Brady is a beast but Seattle might have the only safety in football who can somewhat cover the Gonk.  I also don't think Wilson can play that bad again.  Maybe weather was a factor considering both Rodgers and Wilson threw multiple Int's when they both very rarely make mistakes.  I hope its a good game unlike last years blowout.  I feel like Seattle's D will decide the game.  If New England gets ahead like GB they will win.  I know Belichek isn't afraid to keep his foot on the gas when he has a team on the ropes.

[boogielicious]

Wilfork to the rescue

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000460864/article/vince-wilfork-helps-pull-woman-from-wrecked-vehicle

I met Vince a few years ago at work.  Really nice man and big, but not tall.  He seemed so gentle.  We're lucking in that a Patriot comes to the plant every year for the United Way.  I've met Nate Solder, Mat Slater, who are on the current team.  My all time favorite was Troy Brown.

Quote:

New England Patriots defensive tackle Vince Wilfork went from helping wreck the Indianapolis Colts on Sunday night to helping a woman from out of her wrecked vehicle.

On his way driving home from Gillette Stadium at around 12:45 a.m., the 325-pound Wilfork stopped to the aid of a 38-year-old woman who was trapped in her Jeep Wrangler which had rolled over, the Massachusetts State Police said in a statement .

A trooper arrived and held open the side door as Wilfork reached in and helped the woman out of the vehicle with "one hand," per the police report.

"I just wanted to get her to safety," Wilfork told reporters Monday, per NFL Media's Jeff Darlington .