Chella Choi Cheating. What is the LPGA doing about it?

[Chris223]

Wow.

She should be suspended immediately. The WD should be changed to a DQ. Isn't it a rule that you have to provide a medical reason?

Why would you only be allowed to WD for a medical reason?  If that is a rule... Hunter Mahan wouldn't have been able to WD then from the RBC a few years ago when his wife had the baby right before I think it was his 3rd round was about to start.

[tristanhilton85]

She put it exactly on the opposite side of the marker. That also seems curious.

The question I still have is how much difference a 1 foot putt from 5 degrees counterclockwise would buy her? I still don't see the advantage?

However, from a rules perspective, she's wrong and needs to be DQ from this tournament for refusing to accept the ruling. She should have accepted the ruling immediately.

That's the thing, it's on the exact opposite side. You don't forget in a matter of a second while the ball is in your hand which side you marked the ball on. Whether or not it actually gave her an advantage doesn't matter. She obviously thought it did and so she cheated.

[Aguirre]

You don't forget in a matter of a second while the ball is in your hand which side you marked the ball on.

Of course you can.  Her mind could have been preoccupied with a million other thoughts, rather than what side of the ball she marked.  Could have been giving herself a pep talk about making the cut or trying to calm her nerves or wondering what it's like to be the 22nd ranked Korean in the world and the 23rd ranked player in the world.

[Lihu]

That's the thing, it's on the exact opposite side. You don't forget in a matter of a second while the ball is in your hand which side you marked the ball on. Whether or not it actually gave her an advantage doesn't matter. She obviously thought it did and so she cheated.

We can't really read her mind, but a rule is a rule. Whether by "intention to gain advantage" or by "accident", it's still a rules violation. The "accident" one is more concerning to me, because those are the ones that don't get self caught.

The club I'm joining has lots of cash prizes (on the order of $3000 per monthly tournament), and I'm not sure how they curtail cheating. I suppose I'll find out soon enough.

[tristanhilton85]

Of course you can.  Her mind could have been preoccupied with a million other thoughts, rather than what side of the ball she marked.  Could have been giving herself a pep talk about making the cut or trying to calm her nerves or wondering what it's like to be the 22nd ranked Korean in the world and the 23rd ranked player in the world.

You got to be kidding me. I just don't know what to say to that. Do you honestly think that's what happened? You really think in the matter of a second she actually forgot which side she maked the ball on? Really?

[Aguirre]

and I'm not sure how they curtail cheating.

They bring shorty in to call you a low life scumbag until you break down in tears and admit that you moved the ball off that root.

[Valleygolfer]

The more I see the video, the more I doubt it is intentional cheating. I have never seen anyone miss a 1 foot putt where there could have been a better lie and not missed. Does she have an attitude problem? Yes. Basically, I subscribe to the "lazy golfer theory". She already missed a critical putt, and in her laziness to place the ball properly on the follow up putt led to a rules violation. The fact that she misplaced the ball, could be purely from apathy. However, her reaction to the ruling is the main issue. She obviously still does not think she did anything wrong, and that is the root of the problem. The first mistake she made was that she didn't care enough to replace the ball properly after missing a critical putt. The second mistake was to deny that she made a rules violation.

I kinda wonder here too. Maybe she wasn't looking at the ball when replaced it and didn't remember where she had actually picked it up from. I don't think I have ever done that but everyone is different. Her reaction to it was completely incorrect.

[Aguirre]

You got to be kidding me. I just don't know what to say to that. Do you honestly think that's what happened? You really think in the matter of a second she actually forgot which side she maked the ball on? Really?

I don't know what happened.  I think a suspension is probably in order, based on what I've seen.  But I really don't care, because LPGA lol.

If you're searching for what to say to that, give me the lyrics to Jamie's Crying.

[Lihu]

They bring shorty in to call you a low life scumbag until you break down in tears and admit that you moved the ball off that root.

ROFL.

Actually, I would really like to play a round with @Shorty . He seems like a very knowledgeable and skilled golfer.

[MS256]

I almost did the same thing last Saturday (well sort of the same).

I was going to mark my ball that was in somebody's line and I asked him if the mark was going to be in his way.

He said "just mark it on the left side and it will be alright."

After he putted and missed and then finished I started to put my ball down as if I had marked behind the ball like I normally do. Caught myself at the last minute.

Whew! I'm glad I caught it because I would have hated to be a low life, cheating, scum bag.

I would like to hear what her explanation is. If there is a spike mark the explanation is obvious and she cheated. If there isn't a spike mark I don't know what to think because nothing would make sense.

[Lihu]

I almost did the same thing last Saturday (well sort of the same).

I was going to mark my ball that was in somebody's line and I asked him if the mark was going to be in his way.

He said "just mark it on the left side and it will be alright."

After he putted and missed and then finished I started to put my ball down as if I had marked behind the ball like I normally do. Caught myself at the last minute.

Whew! I'm glad I caught it because I would have hated to be a low life, cheating, scum bag.

I would like to hear what her explanation is. If there is a spike mark the explanation is obvious and she cheated. If there isn't a spike mark I don't know what to think because nothing would make sense.

At least you were conscious of it.

I see so many people instinctively kick their balls out of divots and tree roots. IDK if they even know they are doing it. It's almost like their foot automatically does it. The ones who do it subconsciously or by accident are the scariest ones, because they have no idea they are doing anything wrong. You can't fix that.

[Aguirre]

At least you were conscious of it.

I see so many people instinctively kick their balls out of divots and tree roots. IDK if they even know they are doing it. It's almost like their foot automatically does it. The ones who do it subconsciously or by accident are the scariest ones, because they have no idea they are doing anything wrong. You can't fix that.

I don't hit out of divots and I don't two ****s if it's against the rules.  Playing on public courses, I also declare my own GUR rules at times when it clearly should be marked.  I'll rake and place in bunkers that should have been raked.  And I stamp down spike marks before I putt.

Roots, on the other hand, I simply don't hit off.  I either take an unplayable or chip out.  Don't mess with roots.  A wholesaler of mine is just getting back to golf after missing a YEAR because of hitting a root.

[RJH999]

I don't hit out of divots and I don't two ****s if it's against the rules.  Playing on public courses, I also declare my own GUR rules at times when it clearly should be marked.  I'll rake and place in bunkers that should have been raked.  And I stamp down spike marks before I putt. Roots, on the other hand, I simply don't hit off.  I either take an unplayable or chip out.  Don't mess with roots.  A wholesaler of mine is just getting back to golf after missing a YEAR because of hitting a root.

Well yeah. That's because you're just an average duffer not a Pro.

[Aguirre]

Well yeah. That's because you're just an average duffer not a Pro.

According to charts, I'm in the top 5% of golfers in skill level, which seems hilarious to me.  I mean, PEOPLE MUST SUCK AT GOLF.

I look at it this way:  The clubs I play regularly cannot afford to carefully mark all GUR areas, or rake the bunkers properly all the time.  If I belonged to a decent private club, this wouldn't be an issue, because it never is when I do play them.  The spike mark and divot rules are dumb.

I should add that I do play out of divots off the fairway.  I'm in the rough.  You don't want a bad lie?  Don't hit it in the rough.  But if I'm on the green, I shouldn't have my 3 foot par putt affected by some fat 12-sandwich eating slob who can't walk correctly.  And if I hit the fairway, I deserve a good lie.

I extend all those privileges to any competitors in our friendly games, of course, even if they don't (and most do) play by those kinds of rules.  But sometimes I get the feeling around here that ignoring the letter of the USGA law gets you viewed as some sort of cheat, even if it's only affecting my handicap.

[Lihu]

I don't hit out of divots and I don't two ****s if it's against the rules.  Playing on public courses, I also declare my own GUR rules at times when it clearly should be marked.  I'll rake and place in bunkers that should have been raked.  And I stamp down spike marks before I putt.

Roots, on the other hand, I simply don't hit off.  I either take an unplayable or chip out.  Don't mess with roots.  A wholesaler of mine is just getting back to golf after missing a YEAR because of hitting a root.

This is pretty common, and if I see an orange cone take 1 club. When you end up ankle deep in wet mud, it's standing water.

However, I just played one of those wrap your self around a tree backwards shots, and landed a green side bunker. It was more because I had fun trying to push my limits. Saved myself a stroke for an unplayable. Got a sand save on that hole for a bogey.

I like playing golf by the rules because without those rules it wouldn't be as "interesting".

[Fourputt]

As I recall, the rule states that you place your mark immediately behind the ball.  So both the mark and subsequent replacement were clearly wrong.  I don't know if doing the slightly to the side mark is considered acceptable on tour (I suspect that it's not).  If it is, I guess I could I can see how she possibly brain farted.  But I don't think the side mark is under the rules of golf and I sincerely doubt that it's considered acceptable on professional tours.

I think a suspension is warranted but I can't bring myself to get all worked up because nobody gives a shit about the LPGA.

When a rule requires a player to replace a ball, it must be replaced on the same spot from which it was lifted.  Where the mark is placed is not specified under the rule.  What Choi did was so blatant that it boggles my mind.  Her casual attitude toward this action just confirms her intent to change the line of her putt, yet it's as if she somehow thought that there was nothing wrong with that.  Has she never heard of the penalties handed out for a ball that moves just 1/16 of an inch?  Crazy.

Then Judy Rankin getting all PC about it.  Bull!  She is in a position of being a semi-reporter, yet she tries to excuse it as an honest mistake.  More bull!  I really think that the LPGA is in such dire straits that they thought it would be best if the incident just quietly went away.  Instead they are going to be hurt far more if they continue to simply ignore it.  They need to act or the entire Tour gets a black eye from it.

[iacas]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris223

Why would you only be allowed to WD for a medical reason?  If that is a rule... Hunter Mahan wouldn't have been able to WD then from the RBC a few years ago when his wife had the baby right before I think it was his 3rd round was about to start.

I was half right (and half wrong): http://www.golfchannel.com/news/jason-sobel/strategy-behind-withdrawing-becoming-epidemic/

Quote:

Competitors who withdraw during a tournament round must, eventually, provide a valid medical excuse. Those who withdraw after posting a score need no explanation.

I remembered Rory WDing from Honda or whatever a year or so ago, then giving the "my toof hurt" excuse.

P.S. A family illness or medical situation would count as a "medical excuse" in my book.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourputt

Then Judy Rankin getting all PC about it.  Bull!  She is in a position of being a semi-reporter, yet she tries to excuse it as an honest mistake.  More bull!  I really think that the LPGA is in such dire straits that they thought it would be best if the incident just quietly went away.  Instead they are going to be hurt far more if they continue to simply ignore it.  They need to act or the entire Tour gets a black eye from it

Judy's speech was almost as bad as the act that prompted it. You don't have to stick up for someone who was just shown cheating.

Say something like "Well, that's unfortunate, and I hope she can overcome that in the future because she's going to quickly regret being careless there, and let's hope that's all it was: a player being careless."

[Aguirre]

They need to act or the entire Tour gets a black eye from it.

And oh boy, the LPGA tour doesn't need any bad publicity, with all non-publicity they get on a regular basis.