How to Hit a Driver (Hit it Further and Stop Slicing!)

[Jeremie Boop]

9 minutes ago, mvmac said:

From PING

I'm confused, didn't I read somewhere that Taylormade was saying 17* launch and 1700 spin was optimal? Now I'm all screwed up. I've been fighting to get driver spin down to 1700-2000.

[mvmac]

1 hour ago, Jeremie Boop said:

I'm confused, didn't I read somewhere that Taylormade was saying 17* launch and 1700 spin was optimal? Now I'm all screwed up. I've been fighting to get driver spin down to 1700-2000.

I'm just sharing what PING has put out.

Yes TaylorMade talked about the 17/1700 but I don't know if they actually came out and said it was something they were trying to get golfers to achieve, I always got the impression it was something they were experimenting with or hinting at. Maybe optimal in terms of pure distance (but there is also a swing/ball speed consideration).

[saevel25]

I think those launch angles are a tad too low for high swing speeds. I always like to get in the 13-15 range with 2000-2250 rpm. That gives me a good consistent ball flight that I don't feel like will do stupid stuff due to super low spin rates. 

[MrDC]

One thing that's helped me a lot recently with driver is to make sure to setup with square shoulders to the ball, still a little spine tilt but avoid "facing the ball" at address which is a very easy mistake to make with the ball position so far forward, do this and sliding your hips toward the target on the downswing (don't spin out early) will put you in the slot and stop pushes and slices big time.

Edited July 19, 2016 by MrDC

[68begin]

This, as I'm sure others have said, is a very helpful thread. 

I'm a beginner (play righty) and have been slicing my drives consistently; sort of 200 yards out and 50 yards to the right.  I've reasoned that the only way that I could be doing that is to be hitting the ball down and across, but I haven't been successful in finding a way to correct that.  I've tried moving my feet relative to the ball, but that has resulted in either hitting under the ball; standing too far forward, or topping the ball; standing too far back. 

I know, in my mind, that with the arc the club makes, on the downswing it will be traveling down and out until it's at it's apex, where it will be down and square, and from that point on, it will be traveling down and across; hooks, straights and slices.  So, since I'm slicing, I've reasoned that I'm hitting the ball past the apex, when it's moving down and across.  I hadn't focused on the fact that moving the hips forward and pivoting the hips in place (instead of letting them drift back) is a means or moving the swing arc forward, while keeping the feet/ball position in place.  I'm dying to try this out at the driving range and on the course; I'm almost certain that it will make a big difference for me.  Thanks again for starting this thread.

I have a related question.  Why is it that I can get away with my old swing (hips drifting back during the backswing) with my irons, but not with my driver or fairway woods?  Are the irons, more or less, AoA insensitive for some reason?  Since a lot of us are taught to start off with the higher number irons to work on our swing, isn't it almost counterproductive when you're trying to develop a consistent, reproducible swing?  For me, clearly, a swing that works OK for my irons, is not working at all for my driver.

Allan

[Hacker James]

a lot of slicers try to compensate by setting up and aiming left which actually makes it worse in many cases. It took awhile for me to realize that paying attention to face angle and rightward path, although counter-intuitive, was the thing to do. In the case of driver, tee height can make a difference. Some tee it too high (having read that so often), while others not high enough. My ball position is the same for nearly every shot (just off left instep or with driver "slightly" nearer big toe). Although I maintain a weight a little forward, with driver, I look at the back of the ball.  I  control stance width by moving my right foot, but ball position stays the same except for "some" pitch/chip shots. With irons, it is said to have forward shaft lean, but that does not necessarily mean at address but rather  coming into impact with a forward shaft lean, hands leading.  That being said, "slight" forward shaft lean  at address with irons helps. Anyway, "my" thoughts.YMMV.

[mvmac]

6 hours ago, 68begin said:

I know, in my mind, that with the arc the club makes, on the downswing it will be traveling down and out until it's at it's apex, where it will be down and square, and from that point on, it will be traveling down and across; hooks, straights and slices.  So, since I'm slicing, I've reasoned that I'm hitting the ball past the apex, when it's moving down and across.  I hadn't focused on the fact that moving the hips forward and pivoting the hips in place (instead of letting them drift back) is a means or moving the swing arc forward, while keeping the feet/ball position in place.  I'm dying to try this out at the driving range and on the course; I'm almost certain that it will make a big difference for me.  Thanks again for starting this thread.

Happy to help! When the club reaches it's lowest point (downswing), it will start moving up and across. You can slice with a negative angle of attack or a positive one.

6 hours ago, 68begin said:

I have a related question.  Why is it that I can get away with my old swing (hips drifting back during the backswing) with my irons, but not with my driver or fairway woods?  Are the irons, more or less, AoA insensitive for some reason?  Since a lot of us are taught to start off with the higher number irons to work on our swing, isn't it almost counterproductive when you're trying to develop a consistent, reproducible swing?  For me, clearly, a swing that works OK for my irons, is not working at all for my driver.

With the irons, you can "get away" with a steeper angle of attack, fairway woods not so much. Fairway woods can tend to be the hardest clubs to hit for a lot of people.

[68begin]

Just now, mvmac said:

.

With the irons, you can "get away" with a steeper angle of attack

Thanks mvmac, but why is this the case with irons?  What is there about irons; particularly the steeper lofted irons, that makes them less sensitive to a swing that usually causes a slice with a driver off the tee?  By moving my hips forward and keeping my hip turn in place, will I decrease my angle of attack?  It's not clear to me why this would be the case since it seems to me that I would, mostly, be moving my whole swing arc forward.

8 minutes ago, mvmac said:

Happy to help! When the club reaches it's lowest point (downswing), it will start moving up and across. You can slice with a negative angle of attack or a positive one..

Sorry for the double post; being new to this forum leaves me with some posting things to learn. 

I assume that a negative angle of attack is one in which the club heel is forward of the tip and that a positive angle of attack is one in which the club tip is forward of the heel.  I can see how both angles could produce a slice if the slice is coming from the up and across motion of the club; up and across imparting a clockwise rotation to the ball for a righty; down and out imparting a counterclockwise rotation (hook).

[mvmac]

3 hours ago, 68begin said:

Thanks mvmac, but why is this the case with irons?  What is there about irons; particularly the steeper lofted irons, that makes them less sensitive to a swing that usually causes a slice with a driver off the tee?  

A lot of it has to do with the irons having more loft.

3 hours ago, 68begin said:

By moving my hips forward and keeping my hip turn in place, will I decrease my angle of attack?  It's not clear to me why this would be the case since it seems to me that I would, mostly, be moving my whole swing arc forward.

Maybe, I can't say for sure since I'm not familiar with your swing. In plenty of cases it can because the ability of turning in place creates depth with the body and arms which helps the path of the club on the downswing swing more outward/less inward. The act of sliding the hips back restricts the turn so the result is usually a lift with the arms and a "chop" across the ball. Turning the hips centered not give you a chance to hit the ball more solid (moving the arc forward like you said) but you'll swing less across it.

3 hours ago, 68begin said:

I assume that a negative angle of attack is one in which the club heel is forward of the tip and that a positive angle of attack is one in which the club tip is forward of the heel.  I can see how both angles could produce a slice if the slice is coming from the up and across motion of the club; up and across imparting a clockwise rotation to the ball for a righty; down and out imparting a counterclockwise rotation (hook).

Check this out.

 

[SG11118]

I read through several pages of this thread and didn't see this question asked.  Apologies if it has been:

I don't have any launch monitor experience, so am curious.  What is the advantage to making these driver swing modifications to shallow out the swing and hit the ball with a more positive attack angle versus simply choosing a driver with more loft?  Would a significantly smaller amount of spin be produced by hitting a 8 degree lofted driver with a +1 degree angle of attack than by hitting an 12 degree lofted driver with a -3 degree angle of attack?   

[cutchemist42]

Any reason why I hit my smaller head driver from the 90s better than my more  modern Ping. Picked up G5 off Kijiji and once again I cant figure out a 460cc driver. The distance stats from GG as well as knowing how many penalties I take is astonishing. However, for fun one round I pulled out my dads old Lynx Black Cat which is from 90s (no clue about head size) and iwhtout any range work, hit it a lot better a few rounds back except for two mishits(Sept 11th round in my GG) My friend kept saying I need a bigger driver to avoid the 1-2 mishits from the smaller driver.

Anyhow, I think why I honestly like the smaller clubhead is because to me it looks more like my hybrid at address and I feel I dont have to change anything to hit it the same way I would my hybrids. It feels like exactly the same swing.

I guess what I wonder is why is this happening? After two range sessions and multiple rounds, I still cant hit a 460cc driver as well as a smaller driver I picked up without any prior use and hit better?

[SoggySog]

spent over two hrs reading this topic this morning.....great stuff

[68begin]

I'm back with another question.  I still slice my drives, frequently.  An instructor was watching me the other day at the driving range and he said: "you hit long, but when you go off, it always goes to the right - right?"  I replied yes.  He said, "It's because your right arm is too strong; try a stronger left hand position on the club grip."  So, I rotated my left hand clockwise on the grip; so that the crease formed by my left index finger and my left thumb pointed towards my right shoulder, and it helped quite a bit.  Why is this?

 

I've reasoned that on the downswing, with a weaker left hand grip; say one where that crease is pointing towards the button of my jaw, when the club head is striking the ball, the bones of the lower left arm are aligned so that they point back at your body, instead of pointing in the direction of travel of the hit ball.  With a left hand grip that is stronger; rotated clockwise on the grip, the bones of the lower left arm are somewhat more aligned with the direction of travel of the ball and this may contribute to equalizing the effort of both hands when the ball is struck since a righty generally has more power in his right arm than in his left.  It certainly makes your left arm/hand feel stronger on the grip at the time of impact.

 

I realize that the bones of the right arm are also aligned so that they point perpendicular to the line of travel of the ball at the point of contact, but since the right hand is getting ready to supinate, it is in the process of moving into a much stronger position than the left.

 

I also find that when I apply the power in my swing primarily from the rotation of my hips and shoulders, I tend to slice far less often.  I'm reasoning that this is also because I'm coming closer to equalizing the power in both hands at the point of impact, due to the fact that I'm deemphasizing my arms on the downswing.

 

Am I anywhere close to describing why a stronger left hand grip can help remove the slice for a righty golfer?

 

68begin

[mvmac]

5 hours ago, 68begin said:

Am I anywhere close to describing why a stronger left hand grip can help remove the slice for a righty golfer?

Funny, I just posted this today

 

[Mark Robertson]

Hey,

Came across this post and just reading and watching the video I've got some good info that I can take and try on the range. 

My season started on Sat 25 March Scotland. I was struggling with my driver, the issue was I was hitting the ball bang in the centre but my shot was going right. My friend said my club face was open at impact! My set up was good well I think? Ball just off left heel.

Does anyone have any good tips they could share if they've experienced the same problem.

[mvmac]

6 hours ago, Mark Robertson said:

My friend said my club face was open at impact! My set up was good well I think? Ball just off left heel.

Does anyone have any good tips they could share if they've experienced the same problem.

Best thing would be to start a swing thread so we can see what you're doing. There could be numerous reasons you're hitting it off the heel.

[Mark Robertson]

3 hours ago, mvmac said:

Best thing would be to start a swing thread so we can see what you're doing. There could be numerous reasons you're hitting it off the heel.

Thanks Mike I'll get that started sometime this week. 

[Howling Coyote]

On 9/18/2014 at 8:29 AM, mvmac said:

"Why can I hit my irons ok but slice my driver off the planet?" OR "Why does my 3 wood go farther than my driver?"

mvmac

That's a really long and complicated post.  The reason why I hate the driver and don't like hitting it, is because I can make progress (learn quickly) with the 3-wood, but can't with the driver.  Just using the 3-wood more frequently in no time I begin to hit it 200 yds.  The driver is like a that sailboat so many have joked about.  A hole in the ground, where an infinite amount of time can be spent with no progress.  I'll hook it, pull it left, then slice it and all way much shorter than the 3-wood.

BTW. I am still digesting your post.

Edited March 27, 2017 by Howling Coyote