Claim Chowder: Rory has another Decade (or has to change his swing)

[iacas]

Very simply put, I'm putting up my own claim chowder. This is based on, ahem, very little research and I'm mostly posting it for discussion.

Here it is:

Rory McIlroy has a choice. He can either:

• Compete for ten years, playing well and then poorly (winning at Quail Hollow, MCing at BMW), and win a bunch of tournaments, majors, etc. or
• He can change his swing to compete longer. Maybe he isn't as dynamic when he's on, but he's probably also less "lost" when he's not.

Why? Again, I'm calling this claim chowder myself , but here goes…

Rory's right elbow gets so far behind him that he has to have those incredibly fast hips . He can't keep those hips that fast forever, ergo… the two things above.

Thoughts?

P.S. I may be playing devil's advocate in a few days. :)

[saevel25]

Why? Again, I'm calling this claim chowder myself, but here goes…

Rory's right elbow gets so far behind him that he has to have those incredibly fast hips. He can't keep those hips that fast forever, ergo… the two things above.

Thoughts?

I am kinda thinking he can be pretty dynamic and get better sync'd up, and not rely on that move he has. I am not entirely sure how much he gains with a stuck right elbow and driving through the ball with insanely fast hips. There are a lot of powerful players who don't  have this move. It might be the only way he can get his dominant distance advantage with his body size.

Though he could go all Jim Furyk on us. Guy with not fast hips, but has his elbow in his right pocket at impact ;)

[billchao]

Rory McIlroy has a choice. He can either:

Compete for ten years, playing well and then poorly (winning at Quail Hollow, MCing at BMW), and win a bunch of tournaments, majors, etc. or

He can change his swing to compete longer. Maybe he isn't as dynamic when he's on, but he's probably also less "lost" when he's not.

I would think that he'd have to be incredibly disciplined at self-assessment to consider his problems are due to his swing rather than writing them off as a bad day, sore wrist, toothache, etc., because the swing is what allows him to be great in the first place. He has to make a major compensation, but he also seems to have no lack for talent. I see no reason (barring injury) to believe he won't ride that on his way to more major wins and a HoF career.

Phil comes to mind as a sort of parallel.

[SavvySwede]

Would he really need a major swing change. I would think that with the amount of time he puts in on the range his swing would evolve a little bit and change as his body changes.

[Lihu]

One question I have is if it does not inherently hurt any joints or tendons and such, what would prevent him from being as dynamic up through his 40s? Another, but similar topic question is can Bubba also with really dynamic swing keep his swing into his 40s as well?

[NuckandCup]

Sounds like you are a proponent of the Somax School of Thought

[Abu3baid]

Sounds like you are a proponent of the Somax School of Thought

Haha.. They are more on the extreme side though.. Didn't they say he won't win anything or something like that.. He is saying he will win but basically go down hill at 36 or so... Didn't tiger go through a whole bunch of swing changes? Now he is almost at 40 and his body is giving up on him.. So what is the difference between him and RM? If it is true that his swing won't hold up he would have avoided making swing changes and still be where Tiger is now.. In that case don't do anything.

[acerimusdux]

Would he really need a major swing change. I would think that with the amount of time he puts in on the range his swing would evolve a little bit and change as his body changes.

This. I imagine he'd make adjustments if/when he needs to. I think everyone's swing probably has some changes as they age.

[saevel25]

Didn't tiger go through a whole bunch of swing changes? Now he is almost at 40 and his body is giving up on him.. So what is the difference between him and RM? If it is true that his swing won't hold up he would have avoided making swing changes and still be where Tiger is now.. In that case don't do anything.

About 15 years of age and no swing changes yet. Rory's swing now isn't much like Tiger's in 2000. Tiger's swing always look overly aggressive at sometimes. He really snapped and turned on that front knee. Rory's swing just doesn't have that fast torque move that Tiger's did. I am not sure Rory would see any health issues with the swing.  I think Erik's point is at some point the hips will slow down and when that happens that position in the downswing will not work for him.

No one knows if Tiger's 2000 swing would cause him issues later on. Tiger made a pro-active change in his swing that he thought was for the better. Heck he won a ton of majors after that first swing change.

---

I am not entirely sure this would be a big swing change. Its really more of a timing issue with how his hips move and his arms just tend to get laid off and stuck behind him. He just gets away with it because of his hips and good timing.

Wouldn't the fix be get the arms down faster with a little less lay off dropping of the club inside? Basically make his swing more neutral, less inside to out. This way he could gain some arm speed to compensate for some hip speed lost.

[ChrisP]

He would definitely have to adjust his swing, but I'm not sure it would be a major adjustment. He'd just have to put in a lot of work to adjust to it but I think he'll be fine. Only time will tell if he'll be as dominant. A lot of people said Tiger couldn't compete again, either, after his knee problems and he had to take a lot of torque off that knee. He was able to do that and still win a lot of tournaments, even if he hasn't won a major since his two knee surgeries. Phil also went through a big swing change in the mid-2000s where he shortened his swing considerably under Butch Harmon. Both those players put in a ton of work and it paid off.

The player's swing I'd want to have is Jordan's Spieth's. He has the kind of swing that probably won't need to be changed at all much during his career. Very simple with not much torque required on his body parts.

[RayG]

What I see is his penchant for using one club for a VAST number of yardages. Last week(?) or maybe the week before- 4 different holes and 4 different yardages from 140 something to 187, he used his 9 iron. Sure some different lies and winds, but essentially the same shot- having to adjust constantly to hit one club those numbers will come back and haunt him. I'm sure most players have a particular club or two for a perceived yardage. This makes it simpler to have the same swing for each situation. Not having to try and dial in a specific swing for the yardage and one club. Most of us might have 3 yardages with one club depending on pin location or ball flight. For example: I know a standard 7 is 150(or so) for me. But if I want to get it to a tucked pin on the right, a slight cut would bring me to 145 if that's the yard to the pin. Conversely- if the pin is stuck back left, a bit of a draw will bring out to 155. One swing, little different setup for each and that's it. I don't have to remember to add a few newton meters to get it to 154 or crank up the nm's to get it to 180(not likely) and risk spraying half the county with balls. That's my opinion, anyway. He's still young- and maybe someone will wean him off of those "hero" type shots gently. Not radically change the swing, but adapt the swing he has with figuring a way to being more consistent with club selection to not have to think too much for each swing.

[disco111]

Anybody that goes after the ball with a lot of physical determination (hard swings), will have to either adjust the swing, as the body will most often deteriorate from wear, and adjust their equipment accordingly also. Tiger went / goes after the ball very hard and his body paid the price, Rory goes after the ball hard, but not as hard as Tiger, but it's still a more physical approach, then most of those playing. It only takes one wrong move against the back, for something to go wrong and when you swing violently, your rolling the dice and it's only a matter of time until snake eyes pops up. Look at all the senior player, VJ comes to mind right away, I have watched them for all of their careers, and I can't remember anyone of them, swinging at the ball with the gusto of Tiger or Rory. Now grunt or full contact golf, may be the order of the day for today's young guns, but the body can only take so much and there seems to be more and more players on the regular tour, that are having health issues from injuries.

I remember learning the game and the biggest information past on was, each club is designed to move the ball a specific distance. Let the club do the work and don't over swing.

[iacas]

I think Erik's point is at some point the hips will slow down and when that happens that position in the downswing will not work for him.

That is the point I'm putting up for discussion, yeah… ;)

[dkolo]

I'd say he should cross that bridge when he gets to it. As good as he is right now, he should get while the gettin' is good.

[NuckandCup]

Haha.. They are more on the extreme side though.. Didn't they say he won't win anything or something like that.. He is saying he will win but basically go down hill at 36 or so...

Didn't tiger go through a whole bunch of swing changes? Now he is almost at 40 and his body is giving up on him.. So what is the difference between him and RM? If it is true that his swing won't hold up he would have avoided making swing changes and still be where Tiger is now.. In that case don't do anything.

HA! Thought you'd like that!

IMO, Rory isn't nearly as stubborn as Tiger...I think he's the type of person/player that will evolve with the game, HIS game and move towards what works, and not get locked into specific swing positions.

[ChrisP]

One discussion I always have with my friends is the fact that very few golfers are able to win tournaments and contend every week in their 20s, 30s and 40s. The golfers who come to mind in the modern era who were are Phil Mickelson, Jim Furyk, Davis Love, Fred Couples, Vijay Singh (although he bloomed in his late 20s) and a few others. One thing those guys have in common, though, is that they all have pretty easy going swings. That's why I think Jordan Spieth is built more for the long haul. Players who swing hard and fast through the ball haven't had as much success down the road. Names come to mind include Seve Ballesteros, Greg Norman and Jose Maria-Olazabal. Tiger Woods might be going down that same path.

Rory will definitely have to adjust to a swing down the road that parallels with his age. His game is built around power. Sergio Garcia has made some adjustments the last few years and it seems to be panning out okay so far as he is heading into his late 30s. Rickie Fowler is another one who will have to adjust, probably moreso than Rory. That being said, he seems like a guy who is willing to put in the work. If you are willing to do that, that's the hardest part of the battle.

[nevets88]

I thought I read somewhere, forget where and how accurate it is but it raised my eyebrows, that he is working out the to stave off a "degenerative"' something. I specifically remember the word degenerative. If this is accurate, it seems he is looking into the future and taking preemptive measures. Maybe he's already looked into potential swing changes who knows or he thinks a swing change is too preemptive. I wonder if we got to see the x-rays of every pro golfer, if they all have some form of scoliosis?

[saevel25]

Quote:

“It's about longevity, injury prevention, trying to prolong my career as much as I can,” McIlroy said. “That's the reason I got into working out, because I had a bad back and there were reasons for that, because I didn't go in the gym, and I didn't have the core strength, and I didn't have the stability that I need. I would hit 10 drivers on the range, and I would feel it. It enables me to practice more and it enables me to play better, to feel more stable over the ball.”

According to PGATour.com, McIlroy learned he has a degenerative condition in his spine and has worked to strengthen the area around it.