Lost Ball Rule is Stupid

[Osnola]

On ball obviously out of bounds off the tee, I hit a provisional.  Always thought you scored it "one in, two out, hitting 3", so the provisional is shot 3....

If I get down the fairway after 1st tee shot and cannot find the ball, I just make best estimate, drop one and hit it as 3rd shot...If I am doing it wrong let me know...

[Missouri Swede]

On ball obviously out of bounds off the tee, I hit a provisional.  Always thought you scored it "one in, two out, hitting 3", so the provisional is shot 3....

As to the first part: No, you're not hitting a provisional (rule 27-1b).  You're hitting a second ball with one-stroke penalty, and that is now the ball in play, not a provisional. (Hitting 3 is correct.)

[oudrees]

If I get down the fairway after 1st tee shot and cannot find the ball, I just make best estimate, drop one and hit it as 3rd shot...If I am doing it wrong let me know...

Technically, you should go back and rehit but if you are going to play it this way then it would be your 4th shot.  Your 3rd shot would be the tee shot you aren't rehitting.

[majorjongles]

There is a rule for this situation, it's called taking a provisional. Yes in your situation and we've all been there,you didn't realise how close you really where to the woods,it happens when you don't know a course, a member probably would have hit provo. If it was me playing a casual or Stapleford comp I would have scratched the hole.* if it was a stroke comp I would have had no choice but take the walk of shame. Funny though,I've scanned quickly through some of the responses and didn't notice anyone recommending you let the group behind you Play Thru. *we have different hcap process in Ireland(UHS). If a player records no score for a hole they would be awarded a double bogey just for hcap purposes not for the competition.

[Rulesman]

*we have different hcap process in Ireland(UHS). If a player records no score for a hole they would be awarded a net double bogey just for hcap purposes not for the competition.

[majorjongles]

Nett

[Elmer]

White clover + uncut grass = easy to lose a ball you clearly saw land in the fairway. Experience contrary to that has not been mine and everyone I have played with.

This is an amiable philosophy for casual play, and a preference for rounds at less than reputable courses. The caliber of which some here are clearly unaware of.

It's still cheating, but I'd rather do it and keep the mood upbeat than piss off a bunch of people on a hot day that tend to lose their patience for the 5 minute rule.

Upstate NY Fall golf!

Playing Yellow balls, right as the leaves are turning yellow and covering the fairway.

you can loose a ball in the fairway easy.

Also using a yellow ball in the spring when the dandelions cover the fairway!!!!

[DrvFrShow]

Trouble losing balls? You know I just did a little experiment this summer. When I replaced my sunglasses I got them made in this tint:

My optometrist was familiar with the lenses and we reused my Ray-Ban frames with lenses in this tint. I love them. This tint highlights white. I noticed this when i wore them while driving home. White lines on the road appeared to stand out. White cars stood out as well. Imagine if instead of yellow sun we had a white sun. That's the way the world would look.

Colors were definitely shifted slightly, but your brain does compensate so you know green is still green. When you take them off the world looks very yellow for a while. I haven't lost a ball that I haven't hit in the water since. Well one. I saw it sail clear through the trees and didn't bother to look - easier to re-hit. I can spot other people's white balls on the golden hard pan 200 yds away.

With my normal sunglasses or without sunglasses I would lose about one or two balls a round. The ball hit in the tall rough? Not a problem. In about two minutes, I'll find it.

Brown tints, while they make the world a happier place and are quite popular don't do this. I've had them and my eyes just aren't that sensitive.

So if you have a problem finding your ball on the fairway, rough, or in the woods, these might be worth a try.

[Jon Hoover]

I used to take provisional all the time if the shot was ever in question to the point where my friends would tease me about it calling it a Hoovisional, and insinuate that I'm taking practice shots during the round under the disguise of provisional shots, but back to the OP I've had the same situation happen where they are few and far between it still sucks that you hit a blind shot over a hill that should be right in the fairway and then its no where to be found, maybe a bird picked it up and flew away with it dunno, its just not very piratical to be going back and taking drops during your normal weekend play.

[natureboy]

Trouble losing balls? You know I just did a little experiment this summer. When I replaced my sunglasses I got them made in this tint:

My optometrist was familiar with the lenses and we reused my Ray-Ban frames with lenses in this tint. I love them. This tint highlights white. I noticed this when i wore them while driving home. White lines on the road appeared to stand out. White cars stood out as well. Imagine if instead of yellow sun we had a white sun. That's the way the world would look.

Colors were definitely shifted slightly, but your brain does compensate so you know green is still green. When you take them off the world looks very yellow for a while. I haven't lost a ball that I haven't hit in the water since. Well one. I saw it sail clear through the trees and didn't bother to look - easier to re-hit. I can spot other people's white balls on the golden hard pan 200 yds away.

With my normal sunglasses or without sunglasses I would lose about one or two balls a round. The ball hit in the tall rough? Not a problem. In about two minutes, I'll find it.

Brown tints, while they make the world a happier place and are quite popular don't do this. I've had them and my eyes just aren't that sensitive.

So if you have a problem finding your ball on the fairway, rough, or in the woods, these might be worth a try.

I want to use these as lost balls in tall grass is an issue, but is there any chance that the use of the glasses to aid in locating the ball makes them an 'aid to play'? No idea if this has been ruled, but I could see how the activity of looking for the ball might be considered part of normal 'play' since there is so much about it in the rules.

a. That might assist him in making a stroke or in his play;

I hope not.

I used to take provisional all the time if the shot was ever in question to the point where my friends would tease me about it calling it a Hoovisional, and insinuate that I'm taking practice shots during the round under the disguise of provisional shots, but back to the OP I've had the same situation happen where they are few and far between it still sucks that you hit a blind shot over a hill that should be right in the fairway and then its no where to be found, maybe a bird picked it up and flew away with it dunno, its just not very piratical to be going back and taking drops during your normal weekend play.

As far as I know under the rules, if it's not in plain sight from the point your hit it and you have a reasonable doubt, the provisional is legit. If it clearly rolled into a massive bunker but you can't see it, I think it might be deemed a 'Hoovisional'.

[DrvFrShow]

No those are perfectly legal sunglasses. Nike makes them for golfers - Na Yeon Choi wears them on the tour as do several others. They're no different than choosing to wear Oakley sunglasses of your choice. They do not assist one in making a stroke. If they did, my scores should have dropped. The only thing that has dropped has been the number of lost balls.

http://www.nikevision.com/sunglasses/golf/

[natureboy]

No those are perfectly legal sunglasses. Nike makes them for golfers - Na Yeon Choi wears them on the tour as do several others. They're no different than choosing to wear Oakley sunglasses of your choice. They do not assist one in making a stroke. If they did, my scores should have dropped. The only thing that has dropped has been the number of lost balls.

http://www.nikevision.com/sunglasses/golf/

Good news. But how does not losing balls not help your scoring? I find S&D; elevates my score pretty quickly.

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrvFrShow

No those are perfectly legal sunglasses. Nike makes them for golfers - Na Yeon Choi wears them on the tour as do several others. They're no different than choosing to wear Oakley sunglasses of your choice. They do not assist one in making a stroke. If they did, my scores should have dropped. The only thing that has dropped has been the number of lost balls.

http://www.nikevision.com/sunglasses/golf/

Good news. But how does not losing balls not help your scoring? I find S&D; elevates my score pretty quickly.

They may help you to avoid penalty strokes, but they don't assist you in making a stroke, and that is what the rules are concerned with.

[ColinL]

They may help you to avoid penalty strokes, but they don't assist you in making a stroke, and that is what the rules are concerned with.

Rule 14-3  is also concerned with devices which might assist [the player]  ........... in his play, not just in making a stroke.

Decision 14-3/14 needs to be considered here, I'd suggest.  The implication is that finding a ball more easily as a realist of a device does assist you in your play.

http://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-decisions.html#!decision-14,d14-3-14

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourputt

They may help you to avoid penalty strokes, but they don't assist you in making a stroke, and that is what the rules are concerned with.

Rule 14-3  is also concerned with devices which might   assist [the player]  ...........in his play, not just in making a stroke.

Decision 14-3/14 needs to be considered here, I'd suggest.  The implication is that finding a ball more easily as a realist of a device does assist you in your play.

http://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-decisions.html#!decision-14,d14-3-14

I disagree that this is the same as the RF chip.  With the glasses the ball must still be visible for the glasses to work, so it would still be possible, if not probable, that the player would see the ball even without the glasses.  The RF chip would allow the player to "see" the ball even if it was completely hidden from sight.  I don't see this as offering enough help to really assist the player enough to warrant prohibition.

[ColinL]

I disagree that this is the same as the RF chip.  With the glasses the ball must still be visible for the glasses to work, so it would still be possible, if not probable, that the player would see the ball even without the glasses.  The RF chip would allow the player to "see" the ball even if it was completely hidden from sight.  I don't see this as offering enough help to really assist the player enough to warrant prohibition.

I didn't say it was the same as the chip, just that the Decision needs to be considered because of the implication that making it easier to find a ball as a result of using a device is accepted as  assisting your play.  And you've considered it and come up with a valid point of view based on an essential difference between the devices.

[DrvFrShow]

The glasses are allowed on the PGA and LPGA tours. They had to be submitted to the golf organizations and approved. They're polarized sunglasses. They reduce glare. The only difference is the spectrum of light they filter.

Some people wear brown tint because brown makes the world a happier place. These glasses make the ball easier to follow against a blue sky. Do these sunglasses aid a person in making a stroke? Are they considered artificial devices?

Some people wear grey tint. It could be argued that wearing something that reduces glare can assist in making a stroke.

If they ban one type of sunglasses they have to ban all of them.

I think we're really splitting hairs. Finding your ball and actually making a stroke at your ball are two entirely different things. An artificial device that aids one in making a stroke at the ball is the issue.

[jlbos83]

I guess my regular glasses help me find the ball, or even give me some idea of which direction to go to look!  I don't think the rules have a problem with them.

I would say as long as your eyes remain the only "sensor" with only standard optical enhancements (glasses, binoculars, spotting scope, whatever?) there's no issue.  If there were aided by some sort of enhanced image processing that specifically enhanced finding balls one might start to have an issue.  Though even then I would differentiate  a device that enhanced vision of any ball from one (RFID) that could particularly sense your ball.