Paris Terror Attacks

[newtogolf]

  On 11/14/2015 at 4:15 AM, Gunther said:

This is the problem we've had these past 8 years, ISIS has been at war with us but our govt and media have been complicit in covering it up.  Choosing instead to distract us with such utter false minutiae like global warming and racism and any number of other insignificant non-issues.  It's time to wake up America.  There have been 80 ISIS arrests in the US over the past 12 months.  They are here and they want to kill us all.

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Exactly, and they aren't going away.  While some of the refugees may be innocents I also believe that along with them are ISIS members using the good will of other countries to develop cells within these countries.  ISIS is not like a hostile country you can easily identify and beat, it's a virus that lays dormant until they are told to act.

We need to lock down our borders and Obama needs to stop pretending ISIS isn't a threat.

[rkim291968]

It is going to take a ground war and EU, Syria/Iraq neighbors, US, and Russia are fooling themselves if they can win against ISIS with air and drone strikes alone.   Syrians and Iraqis have no will or resource to get rid of ISIS on their own.   ISIS is not Sadam's army.  They are willing to die for a cause albeit stupid/evil one, and they have boundless pool of volunteers.   They declared war against the rest of the world.  What would it take the world to rage serious war against ISIS?

[newtogolf]

  On 11/14/2015 at 5:06 AM, rkim291968 said:

It is going to take a ground war and EU, Syria/Iraq neighbors, US, and Russia are fooling themselves if they can win against ISIS with air and drone strikes alone.   Syrians and Iraqis have no will or resource to get rid of ISIS on their own.   ISIS is not Sadam's army.  They are willing to die for a cause albeit stupid/evil one, and they have boundless pool of volunteers.   They declared war against the rest of the world.  What would it take the world to rage serious war against ISIS?

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It's definitely a ground war, the problem is, where?  I doubt any foreign intelligence agency has any accurate information of how large ISIS is and where their cells are.  The mass exodus of Syrians into Europe could really be the next step of their overall plan to dominate the world.  We'll know soon as I'd expect Germany, The Netherlands or Sweden to be the next targets.

[rkim291968]

  On 11/14/2015 at 5:20 AM, newtogolf said:

It's definitely a ground war, the problem is, where?

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Iraq & Syria first.  Cut off the head and go after splinter groups.  Start by collaborating with everyone, even with Russian.  If Russia and US fought against the Nazis, they can do it again against the ISIS.  I'd even work with Syria/Asad, Iran governments.   It is not a time to pick and choose allies.   The entire world has to fight against the ISIS. 

[dkolo]

  On 11/14/2015 at 4:15 AM, Gunther said:

This is the problem we've had these past 8 years, ISIS has been at war with us but our govt and media have been complicit in covering it up.  Choosing instead to distract us with such utter false minutiae like global warming and racism and any number of other insignificant non-issues.  It's time to wake up America.  There have been 80 ISIS arrests in the US over the past 12 months.  They are here and they want to kill us all.

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Yeah! Instead of dealing with [problem], we've tried to deal with [other problems]. But I like to pretend [other problems] don't exist for no good reason, so now nothing gets done and I get to complain!

[jbishop15]

  On 11/14/2015 at 4:15 AM, Gunther said:

This is the problem we've had these past 8 years, ISIS has been at war with us but our govt and media have been complicit in covering it up.  Choosing instead to distract us with such utter false minutiae like global warming and racism and any number of other insignificant non-issues.  It's time to wake up America.  There have been 80 ISIS arrests in the US over the past 12 months.  They are here and they want to kill us all.

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Can you show me where there have been 80 ISIS arrest in the US over the past 12 months? I can't seem to locate that information.

As far as the idea of racism and climate change being a way to distract us, and also not real problems: Save your unhappiness with those topics for another thread instead of interjecting them into this one. 

Leftists are very concerned about ISIS and the impact it has on the Western world, and the US specifically. Considering that I am a leftist, I would know. 

 

On a much more important note: Paris, I believe in you. 

[Silent]

Shocking. Was just in Paris the other day. And again Paris victim of such attacks. It is suspected that the the plan of the bombers was to do it in the stadium so it could be even worse. Borders are closed now (Holland still open). For what it's worth, I dont't think that really matters. I wouldn't be surprised if the attackers were born and raised in France (like in the Hebdo attack). There is a very big group of angry, young, radical men in France (more than in other European countries). That raises the question if attacking IS over there will make things better (here), or worse? My thoughts are with the victims and their families.

[Mr. Desmond]

  On 11/14/2015 at 4:15 AM, Gunther said:

This is the problem we've had these past 8 years, ISIS has been at war with us but our govt and media have been complicit in covering it up.  Choosing instead to distract us with such utter false minutiae like global warming and racism and any number of other insignificant non-issues.  It's time to wake up America.  There have been 80 ISIS arrests in the US over the past 12 months.  They are here and they want to kill us all.

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Can we keep it to the terrorist attacks?

Thanks.

[nevets88]

Worst attacks since 9/11.

[nevets88]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/14/paris-attacks-what-we-know-so-far

  Quote

• President François Hollande says the Islamic State group is to blame for terror attacks across Paris that have left at least 127 dead. He says the attacks were an “act of war … prepared and planned elsewhere, with outside involvement which this investigation will seek to establish”. Hollande adds that France will be “ruthless in its response” and declares three days of national mourning.

• Islamic State releases a statement claiming responsibility for the attacks on Saturday and threaten s further attacks against France. The group says the killings were in response to airstrikes against its militants, adding France would remain a “key target”.
• The state of emergency declared across France on Friday night remains in place on Saturday. The measure means that most public spaces can be shut down and there is heightened police and military presence across the country. The French police stress that no public demonstrations are to be held in Paris.
• David Cameron is to chair an emergency meeting of government ministers and security officials to discuss the British response. A senior Met police officer raises the prospect of increasing the threat level to the UK to its highest possible.
• The French government also convenes an emergency meeting on Saturday morning to formulate its response to the attack. An international investigation is launched overnight and officials have said “accomplices” are still at large.
• The injury count currently stands at about 200, 99 of whom are seriously. wounded.

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http://theweek.com/speedreads/446139/france-says-name-isis-offensive-call-daesh-instead

  Quote

The Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) is a bit of a misnomer, says France, as it lends the imprimatur of Islam to a group that the vast majority of Muslims finds despicable. "This is a terrorist group and not a state. I do not recommend using the term Islamic State because it blurs the lines between Islam, Muslims, and Islamists," France's Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius said in a statement. "The Arabs call it 'Daesh' and I will be calling them the 'Daesh cutthroats.'"

The name Daesh, according to France24, is a "loose acronym" for "Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant" (al-Dawla al-Islamiya al-Iraq al-Sham). The name is commonly used by enemies of ISIS, and it also has many negative undertones, as Daesh sounds similar to the Arabic wordsDaes ("one who crushes something underfoot") and Dahes ("one who sows discord"). Samantha Rollins

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[Gunther]

  On 11/14/2015 at 5:45 AM, jbishop15 said:

Can you show me where there have been 80 ISIS arrest in the US over the past 12 months? I can't seem to locate that information.

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/national/isis-suspects/

Messed that up from my phone; regardless, that article says 66, I heard 80 from an analyst on Fox News last night.  Either way, this is the issue of our times and my point that the govt and media have created other false narratives to distract from this is valid.  Hell, Obama said yesterday morning that ISIS is under control.

[jbishop15]

  On 11/14/2015 at 1:06 PM, Gunther said:

Messed that up from my phone; regardless, that article says 66, I heard 80 from an analyst on Fox News last night.  Either way, this is the issue of our times and my point that the govt and media have created other false narratives to distract from this is valid.  Hell, Obama said yesterday morning that ISIS is under control.

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Thanks. I guess I couldn't locate it because of the earlier misstated figure. I would also advise caution when it comes to relying on Fox News; they have a very clear agenda that they are pushing and have been known to distort figures for their own gain.

As far as the media creating false narratives, you are wrong. The vast majority of scientists believe that climate change is a real threat, and racism against African-Americans is very much alive and well. It doesn't take much research to verify that.

Obama said that ISIS was contained, not under control; there is a big difference between the two. ISIS is mostly contained, as well. They've taken advantage of political instability to take whatever land they have, and have lost several major Iraqi cities over the last few months. The situation is certainly dire, and certainly still requires advanced military action, but the prognosis is much more positive now than it was before.

[nevets88]

A lot of disinformation out there - this piece says 4 officers reported dead not true,  no shootings at Les Halles, Belleville or Republic, no support rally in Germany, misleading photos, Trump quoted out of context, Calais camps not on fire, ESB not red/white/blue.

http://www.lemonde.fr/les-decodeurs/article/2015/11/14/attaques-a-paris-les-rumeurs-et-les-intox-qui-circulent_4809992_4355770.html

  Quote

1. Non, quatre policiers n’ont pas été tués

Les chaînes d’information et quelques sites ont diffusé durant la nuit une information erronée évoquant quatre policiers tués en neutralisant les assaillants au Bataclan, qui s’est répandue comme une traînée de poudre. Elle n’a pourtant pas été confirmée par les autorités. Un policier serait blessé, mais aucun n’aurait perdu la vie.

En revanche, un policier en civil, qui n’était pas en service, a été tué rue de Charonne. Un commissaire a également été blessé au Bataclan. Il assistait au concert des Eagles of Death Metal.

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[Gunther]

  On 11/14/2015 at 1:26 PM, jbishop15 said:

Thanks. I guess I couldn't locate it because of the earlier misstated figure. I would also advise caution when it comes to relying on Fox News; they have a very clear agenda that they are pushing and have been known to distort figures for their own gain.

As far as the media creating false narratives, you are wrong. The vast majority of scientists believe that climate change is a real threat, and racism against African-Americans is very much alive and well. It doesn't take much research to verify that.

Obama said that ISIS was contained, not under control; there is a big difference between the two. ISIS is mostly contained, as well. They've taken advantage of political instability to take whatever land they have, and have lost several major Iraqi cities over the last few months. The situation is certainly dire, and certainly still requires advanced military action, but the prognosis is much more positive now than it was before.

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I do appreciate your optimism but you are dead wrong on every single thing you wrote.  You're young, indoctrinated your entire life.  But, I think you're smart so I believe you will learn how the world actually works over time.  Keep fighting the good fight and watch how things evolve.  

[jbishop15]

  On 11/14/2015 at 9:22 PM, Gunther said:

I do appreciate your optimism but you are dead wrong on every single thing you wrote.  You're young, indoctrinated your entire life.  But, I think you're smart so I believe you will learn how the world actually works over time.  Keep fighting the good fight and watch how things evolve.  

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I'm not sure what you mean by indoctrinated. My father is a Republican. and my mother is a moderate. I've grown up in the south, in a traditionally religious household. None of my family is even remotely liberal or atheist. How does one become indoctrinated, exactly? 

I don't call believing in climate change as a threat or racism being alive and well as a 'optimistic', nor would I call what I said about ISIS and President 'optimistic'. It's simply reality, backed up by academic study and statistics.

If your source of information is Fox News, then your news is slanted conservative. That is a fact. I can give you numerous examples of their conservative bias. I also find it condescending and more than a little revealing that you call me 'indoctrinated' and that I will 'learn how the world actually works over time'. 

 

[Gunther]

  On 11/14/2015 at 1:26 PM, jbishop15 said:

Thanks. I guess I couldn't locate it because of the earlier misstated figure. I would also advise caution when it comes to relying on Fox News; they have a very clear agenda that they are pushing and have been known to distort figures for their own gain.

As far as the media creating false narratives, you are wrong. The vast majority of scientists believe that climate change is a real threat, and racism against African-Americans is very much alive and well. It doesn't take much research to verify that.

Obama said that ISIS was contained, not under control; there is a big difference between the two. ISIS is mostly contained, as well. They've taken advantage of political instability to take whatever land they have, and have lost several major Iraqi cities over the last few months. The situation is certainly dire, and certainly still requires advanced military action, but the prognosis is much more positive now than it was before.

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You've been indoctrinated through your education, probably most through college but it's happened since 1st grade.  If your dad is a republican, you probably didn't speak with him much about politics through school.

My son graduated college in '14.  He had a solid conservative foundation but required my guidance to filter out the liberal bullshit he had to endure through his education and most particularly through those 4 years of college.  He's not fully clean yet but now fancies himself a Libertarian, which I can accept, somewhat reluctantly.  Smart kid, Cum Laude, but a frat boy too.  I'm proud of him as I'm sure your folks are of you.

Global warming is a ruse, the facts don't support anything more than that.  The "majority" of scientists you cite involves 75 of 77 scientists among the 18,000 originally surveyed.  It was a bogus study, well documented as such, yet somehow the media still quotes it:  97%, blah, blah.  It's bogus and completely untrue.

There is no institutional racism in this country anymore, especially not on college campuses. Again, a ruse perpetrated by George Soros who is funding it, along with Occupy (fake), Ferguson (fake), minimum wage (ridiculous), and many other false narratives that permeate our media.

Fox news does not slant heavily right.  The are right of center but firmly entrenched with Republican establishment which is far left of where we need to be in America to continue the success we've have these 240 years or so.  Liberalism does not work, which is why Obama has been such an abject failuree.

Anyway, I ventured far off topic but the fact is, I believe this event should strengthen our resolve to shed this false racism narrative and begin the hard work of eliminating those terrorists among us and abroad to secure our future.

[jbishop15]

  On 11/14/2015 at 10:20 PM, Gunther said:

You've been indoctrinated through your education, probably most through college but it's happened since 1st grade.  If your dad is a republican, you probably didn't speak with him much about politics through school.

My son graduated college in '14.  He had a solid conservative foundation but required my guidance to filter out the liberal bullshit he had to endure through his education and most particularly through those 4 years of college.  He's not fully clean yet but now fancies himself a Libertarian, which I can accept, somewhat reluctantly.  Smart kid, Cum Laude, but a frat boy too.  I'm proud of him as I'm sure your folks are of you.

Global warming is a ruse, the facts don't support anything more than that.  The "majority" of scientists you cite involves 75 of 77 scientists among the 18,000 originally surveyed.  It was a bogus study, well documented as such, yet somehow the media still quotes it:  97%, blah, blah.  It's bogus and completely untrue.

There is no institutional racism in this country anymore, especially not on college campuses. Again, a ruse perpetrated by George Soros who is funding it, along with Occupy (fake), Ferguson (fake), minimum wage (ridiculous), and many other false narratives that permeate our media.

Fox news does not slant heavily right.  The are right of center but firmly entrenched with Republican establishment which is far left of where we need to be in America to continue the success we've have these 240 years or so.  Liberalism does not work, which is why Obama has been such an abject failuree.

Anyway, I ventured far off topic but the fact is, I believe this event should strengthen our resolve to shed this false racism narrative and begin the hard work of eliminating those terrorists among us and abroad to secure our future.

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It appears I've misjudged you. I thought you were a conservative who simply disliked liberals, a type I have met before and talk to regularly as they comprise a large majority of the people around me, including family. 

But you believe that George Soros is funding 'false narratives', and that is a bridge much further than the political debate I thought we were having. I am kind of stunned, to be quite honest. To be frank: I don't deal in conspiracies. 

And for the record, my father and I talk politics every day. 

You keep doing you, dude. 

[SavvySwede]

  On 11/14/2015 at 10:20 PM, Gunther said:

You've been indoctrinated through your education, probably most through college but it's happened since 1st grade.  If your dad is a republican, you probably didn't speak with him much about politics through school.

My son graduated college in '14.  He had a solid conservative foundation but required my guidance to filter out the liberal bullshit he had to endure through his education and most particularly through those 4 years of college.  He's not fully clean yet but now fancies himself a Libertarian, which I can accept, somewhat reluctantly.  Smart kid, Cum Laude, but a frat boy too.  I'm proud of him as I'm sure your folks are of you.

Global warming is a ruse, the facts don't support anything more than that.  The "majority" of scientists you cite involves 75 of 77 scientists among the 18,000 originally surveyed.  It was a bogus study, well documented as such, yet somehow the media still quotes it:  97%, blah, blah.  It's bogus and completely untrue.

There is no institutional racism in this country anymore, especially not on college campuses. Again, a ruse perpetrated by George Soros who is funding it, along with Occupy (fake), Ferguson (fake), minimum wage (ridiculous), and many other false narratives that permeate our media.

Fox news does not slant heavily right.  The are right of center but firmly entrenched with Republican establishment which is far left of where we need to be in America to continue the success we've have these 240 years or so.  Liberalism does not work, which is why Obama has been such an abject failuree.

Anyway, I ventured far off topic but the fact is, I believe this event should strengthen our resolve to shed this false racism narrative and begin the hard work of eliminating those terrorists among us and abroad to secure our future.

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And you were raised on a magical cloud far above us all were you can view the world unfiltered? There is nothing worse than listening to someone who believes they are somehow uninfluenced and above it all, be they liberal or conservative.