Why Isn't It OK To Drive Your Push Carts or Trolleys Through The Green?

[No Mulligans]

Here is the article about the Australian way of taking "Buggies" (hand carts) on the green:  http://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf-in-australia-geoff-shackelford

Excerpt:

Quote

DON'T PAMPER THE GREENS

Here's the best part: heftier-wheeled manual carts have been around Aussie links forever and are even considered part of the maintenance plan. At every elite club I pulled into, you're not met by a pretty-boy Disneyland greeter, but instead by a row of free buggies. Very few golfers Down Under carry their bag, and caddies appear almost nonexistent. (Motorized carts are discouraged, though sadly they're appearing at more and more courses.) Most of the standard buggies feature a small sand bucket dangling from the center rod for filling divot holes. And when golfers approach the greens, they're encouraged to push the unit right on across. That simple act--which never feels right to an American no matter how many times you do it--toughens and smooths the greens in the thinking of Australian superintendents. And in a practical sense, it saves an immense amount of pushcart time avoiding the annoying circumvention of what Americans coddle: the putting surface. With less of the chemical dependence that can lead to thatch build-up and the need for frequent aerification, it's no coincidence that Australians sport firmer, faster, smoother and more disease-resistant putting surfaces that are a fraction of the American price to build and maintain.

Then there's the overall lack of turfgrass wear and tear typically induced by motorized golf carts, a dreadful, understudied and not-fully understood agronomic side effect that Americans consider minor because cart revenue is believed to be essential to sunrises and sunsets.

"There's always been this sense that owners and operators liked motorized carts because of the revenue," Davis says, "but what they don't account for is how much extra wear and tear they put on the golf course, and how that increases the cost of maintaining a course."

 

[iacas]

http://www.golfdigest.com/story/golf-in-australia-geoff-shackelford

http://www.myusualgame.com/2012/08/22/push-carts-on-tee-boxes-on-greens/

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php?topic=20156.20

[mcanadiens]

I saw some guy doing this a few months ago and I darn near crapped myself. Of course I was already steaming because I had waited 15 minutes following him on this particular hole.

As soft as the greens can get at my home courses, no trolleys ought come closer than the fringe. Spike marks and dead ball marks are enough of a problem as it is.

[natureboy]

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"There's always been this sense that owners and operators liked motorized carts because of the revenue," Davis says, "but what they don't account for is how much extra wear and tear they put on the golf course, and how that increases the cost of maintaining a course."

This.

[ScouseJohnny]

Quote

there are carts with a 3rd wheel which is smaller and narrower.

 

I guess I'm still not sold on push carts on the green, but I think the 3 (or 4) wheel push carts would be the only type to really be acceptable for this.

As a walking golfer (and trolley puller/pusher) of some 30 years, I remember the old two-wheeled pull carts very well. Although the wheels were very wide, the bit of metal below where the base of your bag sat (the bit that connected with the ground, in other words, when you set the cart down) tended to become sharp and scuffed from contact with gravel paths, asphalt car parks, etc. An accident waiting to happen on the surface of a green...

The Caddytek 3 wheel push cart I use these days doesn't suffer from that design problem, so I suppose the modern carts might make a case for having a place on the green...

[Golfingdad]

1 minute ago, natureboy said:

This.

is off topic because we're not talking about 1500 pound (or whatever) motorized carts.  We're talking about 50 pound push carts.

[natureboy]

If a hand cart has wide, large wheels like the pic below it isn't going to mark up a green by itself. Add 25-40 pounds for a bag with set of clubs, I would say that the toe-heel walking gait of an average adult (with spikes esp), let alone a plus size person will damage the greens much more.

Besides, we can all carry a bag on our back across the green without violating this custom, but are likely doing similar damage if the extra weight through carried over our feet is that significant.

Edited December 29, 2015 by natureboy

[Coronagolfman]

On 12/29/2015 at 8:40 AM, Golfingdad said:

Think about this not uncommon scenario:  A golfer hits his approach onto the front of the green with a back pin, where the next tee is just beyond the green.  Typically, what I'm assuming most would do, is walk and push their cart around the green to the back, near the next tee, then grab their putter and walk through the green (obviously careful to avoid others lines) back towards their ball and then go through their putting routine, whatever it may be.

So, throwing out the persons putting routine, since everybody is different, what we have is a person effectively walking the length of the green twice, right?

Now, consider if that person was allowed to push their cart through the green.  I would presume that they'd just park it next to their ball like they do on the rest of the course.  Again, throwing out the putting routine, now what we have is a person walking the length of the green once and pushing their cart the length of the green once, correct?

Clearly, this could do nothing but speed up play, right?  Slightly, at best, in the cases of quick players with decent etiquette, but likely more for slow players or those with poor etiquette and no foresight, who may have left their cart in front of the green in my original scenario.

"But, duh, it's not really a good trade off here when we're sacrificing course conditions for faster play.  Who wants to play fast on chewed up greens?!?!"

That's certainly the first reaction of most, but does it make sense?  What does an average golfing male weigh?  200 pounds?  OK, so think about it.  A 200 pound man, walking the length of the green twice versus a 200 pound man walking it once while pushing his cart once as well.

In the first scenario, each step is exerting something close enough to 200 pounds of pressure, often through shoes with spikes of some kind on the bottom of them, for two runs of the green, whereas in the second, he's doing it once and the cart is doing it once.  Well, how much does a cart weigh?  Certainly nothing close to 200 pounds.  50, maybe?  If its soaking wet.  AND the pressure is even distributed over THREE wheels that are always on the ground.  So, maybe at most, we're talking about 20 pounds of pressure exerted on the ground through smooth wheels.  I'm thinking that the cart is doing a heck of a lot less damage to the green than the man.  Not to mention that with the cart there is no risk of feet-dragging either.

So why is the idea of carts/trolleys on the green shunned so easily?  I think we should reconsider.

 

Go play Chambers Bay in Tacoma - the course is so firm there that they allow you to take your trolley right across the greens and tess.

By the way, they only allow electric carts on the course for those who can provide medical evidence of need (be it a player or a caddie!) - all others walk.  So bring a small bag and put it over your shoulder or on one of the complimentary trolleys.

[Golfingdad]

43 minutes ago, Coronagolfman said:

 

Go play Chambers Bay in Tacoma - the course is so firm there that they allow you to take your trolley right across the greens and tess.

By the way, they only allow electric carts on the course for those who can provide medical evidence of need (be it a player or a caddie!) - all others walk.  So bring a small bag and put it over your shoulder or on one of the complimentary trolleys.

Lol, that makes sense.  We saw during the Open that there is almost no way to discern between the fairways and greens (and tees) so it stands to reason that it would be allowed there. And I would love to play there someday!

[WUTiger]

Due to my programming as a caddie in the 1970s, my first reaction was "never - never"! But, the thread responses bring up interesting points.

The no-trolley rule would mesh with the old law of not carrying the golf bag onto the green - the idea being that the bag on the back of the golfer or caddie increased the weight concentrated on the green by the feet. Also, you never placed the bag on the green, you could leave dents or gouge the green with brads, hard base, etc.

And, trolleys with narrow wheels might rut the greens, especially in wet weather.

The Australian example shows the difference in turf and weather conditions. If you soil drains quickly - and hearty turf on the greens - the rutting problem would be much less.

Point taken, but my 50-year-old programming would still make me balk at rolling a trolley across the green.

[mchepp]

There are places like Bandon Dunes (@Golfingdad you need to plan your trip) where due to the massive green sizes they recommend you drive your trolley through/on the green. There is no negative effect from doing this on the putting surfaces. So some places design for it. 

At my home club they not only say no trolleys on the green but none even on the grass between the bunkers and the green. Means sometimes pushing the trolley quite some distance away from the pin/green to get the trolley near the next tee.

At our home club we still play pretty fast so not sure either way has any effect on pace of play. 

[BaldTexan]

One of the biggest problems I see with this idea is that a lot of people who play golf are not overly intelligent about etiquette.  Now if a course were to allow pull carts on the green here's what I foresee happening:

Player A driving a cart sees sign "Pull carts allowed on green."

Player A reads sign as "Carts on green"

Player A happily drives his cart on the green to save time putts his ball and drives off leaving a mess behind. 

As silly as this may sound, consider some of the things you've seen people do when playing golf and the possibility of this occurring is not as silly as it seems.

If I were physically capable of walking with a pull cart I would be all for this except for the very real possibility of seeing someone locking the brakes up while driving up to their golf ball on the freshly watered green.

 

[iacas]

On December 29, 2015 at 2:38 PM, natureboy said:

If a hand cart has wide, large wheels like the pic below it isn't going to mark up a green by itself. Add 25-40 pounds for a bag with set of clubs, I would say that the toe-heel walking gait of an average adult (with spikes esp), let alone a plus size person will damage the greens much more.

I think you mean heel-toe.

10 hours ago, BaldTexan said:

One of the biggest problems I see with this idea is that a lot of people who play golf are not overly intelligent about etiquette.  Now if a course were to allow pull carts on the green here's what I foresee happening:

Player A driving a cart sees sign "Pull carts allowed on green."

Player A reads sign as "Carts on green"

Player A happily drives his cart on the green to save time putts his ball and drives off leaving a mess behind. 

I don't know that you'd see that. Seems like a bit of a stretch, no? I know you said "as silly as this may sound" but it sounds awfully darn silly.

[natureboy]

7 minutes ago, iacas said:

I think you mean heel-toe.

I don't know that you'd see that. Seems like a bit of a stretch, no? I know you said "as silly as this may sound" but it sounds awfully darn silly.

Good catch. Absolutely correct. Sloppy wording on my post.

That would look funny, thought wouldn't it. I guess you could do a backwards moonwalk onto the green to accomplish it. But that would be unlikely to help speed up play.

[iacas]

1 minute ago, natureboy said:

Good catch. Absolutely correct. Sloppy wording on my post.

That would look funny, thought wouldn't it. I guess you could do a backwards moonwalk onto the green to accomplish it. But that would be unlikely to help speed up play.

Indians hunted this way, toe-to-heel (often not really even letting their heel touch) because it was quieter. They could feel a twig or branch or whatever better with their toes or the ball of their feet.

[Golfingdad]

10 hours ago, BaldTexan said:

One of the biggest problems I see with this idea is that a lot of people who play golf are not overly intelligent about etiquette.  Now if a course were to allow pull carts on the green here's what I foresee happening:

Player A driving a cart sees sign "Pull carts allowed on green."

Player A reads sign as "Carts on green"

Player A happily drives his cart on the green to save time putts his ball and drives off leaving a mess behind. 

As silly as this may sound, consider some of the things you've seen people do when playing golf and the possibility of this occurring is not as silly as it seems.

If I were physically capable of walking with a pull cart I would be all for this except for the very real possibility of seeing someone locking the brakes up while driving up to their golf ball on the freshly watered green.

 

I might advocate for them to not forbid push carts across the green but I don't think it would be a good idea to post signs.

[natureboy]

12 minutes ago, iacas said:

Indians hunted this way, toe-to-heel (often not really even letting their heel touch) because it was quieter. They could feel a twig or branch or whatever better with their toes or the ball of their feet.

Did not know that. I suspect the ball is unlikely to bolt so stalking it wouldn't help me hit it any better and I don't weigh that much so it wouldn't save the greens noticeably.

[Lihu]

One advantage of carrying clubs I guess?