Short Play Tips Please

[Fourputt]

23 minutes ago, iacas said:

Please don't do this. "Keep your head down" may be the single worst advice for several areas of the game: the full swing, the short game… it's okay for putting, but that may be about it.

 

17 minutes ago, 9wood said:

Since it works well for me, it very well may be of help to someone else, and BTW, it was taught to me by someone with a 2 HC

 

14 minutes ago, Lihu said:

Good this works. Pulling through feeling might just control your swing speed better.

Also, take a look at the quickie pitching video posted above. That has been pretty invaluable for improving my short game.

 

It's not really good advice, steady head works better and it's not the same thing.

It's the thought that counts.   I think "Keep your head down, Dummy!", but what I'm really doing is making sure that I'm seeing the ball at impact, not letting my head rotate to follow my shoulders until after the ball is gone.  My head may move a little but my eyes have to stay on the ball.

[nevets88]

30 minutes ago, iacas said:

Please don't do this. "Keep your head down" may be the single worst advice for several areas of the game: the full swing, the short game… it's okay for putting, but that may be about it.

Yeah, you'll see in many videos from well regarded instructors, like Martin Chuck, they repeatedly say, "Worse... advice... ever" to keep your head down. In good swings, it does look like the head stays "down", when it's more your body is staying in its inclination. When people take keep your head down to heart, they lock up a whole bunch of other body parts other than their head - I think that's what people who say it's the worse advice are implying.

[iacas]

4 minutes ago, 9wood said:

So you're saying the golfer with the 2 HC that taught it to me opinion doesn't count?

No. I didn't say any thing of the sort. I said it's up to the OP to weight the opinions expressed here.

• A professional instructor who has written posts and filmed videos many cite as core parts of their game.
• A 19 handicapper.
• A 2 handicapper nobody has met nor heard from except via the same aforementioned 19 handicapper's summary of his "tip."

The OP gets to choose to whom he listens. That's all I've said.

And Steady Head is a full swing Key, not a short game one, and it really doesn't care much about rotation of the head/neck.

2 minutes ago, nevets88 said:

Yeah, you'll see in many videos from well regarded instructors, like Martin Chuck, they repeatedly say, "Worse... advice... ever" to keep your head down. In good swings, it does look like the head stays "down", when it's more your body is staying in its inclination. When people take keep your head down to heart, they lock up a whole bunch of other body parts other than their head - I think that's what people who say it's the worse advice are implying.

Yep.

[Patch]

I still like Paul Runyon's chipping method which can also work on shorter  pitch shots. It's basically the same as my putting grip, set up, and stroke. This said, I still do use other chipping methods depending on different situations. Runyon's stuff can be found on U-Tube. 

As for keeping one's head down, I never really give it any serious thought. On short game stuff I tend to watch the club head hit the ball. I also like to see the "blurr" of the club head on the correct path into the ball.  I do this with my eyes looking down more so than actually having my head tilted down. Long game stuff, I don't know. It is what it is. 

The fewer things one has to worry about in a golf swing the better/easier their swing will work when playing for a score. 

[Lihu]

28 minutes ago, 9wood said:

I keep my head down and it doesn't move. Is that steady enough?

I predict another injury thread as @9wood learns to swing faster. Unless, he means steady head by "head down".

[9wood]

All I know is that on shots from 100 yds. in, keeping my head down produces good results for me. When I do, my ball flight is so often right at the pin. It might be short at times, or it might be long at times, and other times my ball hits the pin. Now when I get further out than 100 yards or on my drive shots that require more power, then I don't keep my head down because it indeed does limit other parts of my body and reduces my distance. Yet FOR ME on the shorter shots where not as much power is required, keeping my head down, even after the ball is gone works really good FOR ME.

1 minute ago, Lihu said:

I predict another injury thread as @9wood learns to swing faster. Unless, he means steady head by "head down".

My head stays down on short shots, not on my drive shots. After all according to the OP, this post is all about the short game rather than the long game which is what I have been commenting on.

[Lugowskins]

Mickelson's short game DVD has helped me a lot I love the technique. You can find quite a few clips on youtube but I'd say just buy the DVD. I use the hinge and hold on all my chips except for when I'm on the fringe and don't want to putt ill use my 60 and take a putter stroke I feel I have good distance control that way.

[boogielicious]

34 minutes ago, 9wood said:

So you're saying the golfer with the 2 HC that taught it to me opinion doesn't count?

I keep my head down and it doesn't move. Is that steady enough?

He is saying the "advice" doesn't mean anything specific and if people take it literally it will hurt your swing and even possibly your neck. I guarantee that if you took a video of that 2HC swing, he would not "keep his head down" the way you think. His head would move like a good golfer's head should move. David Duval and Annika Sorenstam had their faces looking toward the target at impact. That is not "keeping their head down." Both Major winners.

Regurgitating old golf advice quips does not really help anyone. It is 2016 and golf instruction has come a lot further than 150 year old sayings.

[Lihu]

1 hour ago, 9wood said:

All I know is that on shots from 100 yds. in, keeping my head down produces good results for me. When I do, my ball flight is so often right at the pin. It might be short at times, or it might be long at times, and other times my ball hits the pin. Now when I get further out than 100 yards or on my drive shots that require more power, then I don't keep my head down because it indeed does limit other parts of my body and reduces my distance. Yet FOR ME on the shorter shots where not as much power is required, keeping my head down, even after the ball is gone works really good FOR ME.

That's what you should have stated earlier. What works for you might not work for everyone. Different people feel different things.

 

1 hour ago, 9wood said:

My head stays down on short shots, not on my drive shots. After all according to the OP, this post is all about the short game rather than the long game which is what I have been commenting on.

Strange that your swing differs that much for long game versus short? To each his own, I guess?

In interacting with you on swing thoughts, it has become very clear that you do stuff that you think works for you no matter what anyone else says. I'm very surprised you would take advice from a local 2 handicap. I'm also surprised that a 2 HC who is not an instructor (unless you add this to your list of "facts" not yet presented) would give any kind of advice like that?

I don't know a single 2HC or better player who would tell you to keep your "head down". That's purely bogey advice.

[9wood]

1 hour ago, Lihu said:

That's what you should have stated earlier. What works for you might not work for everyone. Different people feel different things.

 

Strange that your swing differs that much for long game versus short? To each his own, I guess?

In interacting with you on swing thoughts, it has become very clear that you do stuff that you think works for you no matter what anyone else says. I'm very surprised you would take advice from a local 2 handicap. I'm also surprised that a 2 HC who is not an instructor (unless you add this to your list of "facts" not yet presented) would give any kind of advice like that?

I don't know a single 2HC or better player who would tell you to keep your "head down". That's purely bogey advice.

From my first reply I stated, "at least that's what works for me"

The 2 HC golfer is one of my best friends. He lives in Florida and has a home on the golf course. Last year he was listed just below Fred Couples on the senior tours. I'm not sure where he is on the list this year since he was in a car accident and injured his back. The last time I had a chance to get on the course with him was last August when he came up here and visited me.  I went down and visited him a couple of times in Florida and he helped me with my short game more than any other person or video. And being one of my best friends there was no charge.

Like I said, what he taught me works for me

[Lihu]

2 minutes ago, 9wood said:

From my first reply I stated, "at least that's what works for me"

The 2 HC golfer is one of my best friends. He lives in Florida and has a home on the golf course. Last year he was listed just below Fred Couples on the senior tours. I'm not sure where he is on the list this year since he was in a car accident and injured his back. The last time I had a chance to get on the course with him was last August when he came up here and visited me.  I went down and visited him a couple of times in Florida and he helped me with my short game more than any other person or video. And being one of my best friends there was no charge.

Like I said, what he taught me works for me

 

So, you know and got advice from Tom Pernice Jr. and are stating that he is a 2HC? Strange, because everyone on the Champions Tour is usually much better than scratch?

http://espn.go.com/golf/moneylist/_/tour/champions

Quote

1	Woody Austin	6	$770,165
2	Bernhard Langer	7	$594,050
3	Duffy Waldorf	7	$451,215
4	Tom Lehman	6	$394,979
5	Billy Andrade	7	$364,833
6	Miguel Angel Jimenez	3	$360,950
7	Esteban Toledo	7	$348,630
8	Wes Short, Jr.	7	$341,428
9	Michael Allen	7	$339,475
10	Scott Dunlap	6	$319,875
11	Jeff Sluman	7	$287,249
12	Kenny Perry	7	$268,626
13	Joe Durant	7	$267,647
14	Colin Montgomerie	7	$253,110
15	Jeff Maggert	6	$252,267
16	David Frost	7	$229,969
17	Paul Goydos	7	$229,642
18	Fred Couples	2	$215,800
19	Tom Pernice Jr.	7	$212,293
20	Roger Chapman	4	$204,920
21	Kevin Sutherland	6	$202,840
22	Mark O'Meara	6	$187,630
23	Jerry Smith	7	$183,884
24	Corey Pavin	7	$183,192

 

[9wood]

7 minutes ago, Lihu said:

 

So, you know and got advice from Tom Pernice Jr. and are stating that he is a 2HC? Strange, because everyone on the Champions Tour is usually much better than scratch?

http://espn.go.com/golf/moneylist/_/tour/champions

 

No not Tom Pernice. It was some other list my friend show me that he took me to on the internet where they had rankings for senior men's tournaments. I remember my friend going to some PGA web-site and opening the page up. I couldn't tell you anymore what the site was.

[Fourputt]

Just pegged the needle on my BS meter.

[9wood]

I don't know if any of you have ever tried this. I never have seen anyone do this nor did I ever hear of this being done. I wouldn't be surprised if it already has been done by others, it's just that no one taught me this, and I didn't see any video about it. I learned it without any ones help by simply messing around. Anyways, I was experimenting today with my short chip shots. I was using a 9 iron and I bent over my ball until the the butt of the shaft of my 9 iron was pushing into my belly just above my belt buckle. This acted like a fulcrum for my short back swing to about the 8 O'clock position and swing to the 4 O'clock position. I noticed this method produced some really accurate results on short chip shots.

[pumaAttack]

7 minutes ago, 9wood said:

I don't know if any of you have ever tried this. I never have seen anyone do this nor did I ever hear of this being done. I wouldn't be surprised if it already has been done by others, it's just that no one taught me this, and I didn't see any video about it. I learned it without any ones help by simply messing around. Anyways, I was experimenting today with my short chip shots. I was using a 9 iron and I bent over my ball until the the butt of the shaft of my 9 iron was pushing into my belly just above my belt buckle. This acted like a fulcrum for my short back swing to about the 8 O'clock position and swing to the 4 O'clock position. I noticed this method produced some really accurate results on short chip shots.

So you anchored the club and made an illegal swing on the ball.  And are happy with the accurate results?!

[Ernest Jones]

3 minutes ago, pumaAttack said:

So you anchored the club and made an illegal swing on the ball.  And are happy with the accurate results?!

Yep, illegal swing. No anchoring as of 2016. 

[9wood]

6 minutes ago, pumaAttack said:

So you anchored the club and made an illegal swing on the ball.  And are happy with the accurate results?!

I noticed a couple of the the pros are still anchoring their putters in tournaments

Edited April 26, 2016 by 9wood

[iacas]

3 minutes ago, 9wood said:

I noticed a couple of the the pros are still anchoring their putters in tournaments

No, they're not.

5 hours ago, 9wood said:

No not Tom Pernice. It was some other list my friend show me that he took me to on the internet where they had rankings for senior men's tournaments. I remember my friend going to some PGA web-site and opening the page up. I couldn't tell you anymore what the site was.

Let's stick to the topic. A 2 handicapper is not regularly competing in Champions Tour events.

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Both of those are off topic. So, back to the actual topic, please.