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Trans Athletes

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9 hours ago, JonMA1 said:

It is a complicated subject to be sure. But how would you make it better... even slightly? 

We can assume that the very best solution is going to be unfair to someone and imperfect, correct? So why not make incremental changes and build upon those with a long-term goal of make it reasonably fair to everyone involved?

The saying "don't make perfect be the enemy of better" comes to mind when I think about subjects like this.

I would set the initiation of hormone therapy relative to puberty based on the medical report of a treating physician. Is there is eventually a blood test or other measurement that would be a more fair value I'd prefer that. For me the goal would be help these people integrate as much as possible given the difficulty they have  to start with. As a geneticist I don't think that external genitals are any realistic measure nor is chromosome makeup. This is fundamentally a question of the effects of hormones on the body so we should use that measurement. And XX who don't get hormones before puberty will not catch up. XY who get therapy after puberty will always be physically more male.

My best solution but I'd be happy to hear a more informed opinion.

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11 minutes ago, criley4way said:

I would set the initiation of hormone therapy relative to puberty based on the medical report of a treating physician. Is there is eventually a blood test or other measurement that would be a more fair value I'd prefer that. For me the goal would be help these people integrate as much as possible given the difficulty they have  to start with. As a geneticist I don't think that external genitals are any realistic measure nor is chromosome makeup. This is fundamentally a question of the effects of hormones on the body so we should use that measurement. And XX who don't get hormones before puberty will not catch up. XY who get therapy after puberty will always be physically more male.

My best solution but I'd be happy to hear a more informed opinion.

I don't know, starting hormone therapy on kids that young... That's already a super confusing time of life, not exactly the best time to start making life changing decisions.

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9 minutes ago, Jeremie Boop said:

I don't know, starting hormone therapy on kids that young... That's already a super confusing time of life, not exactly the best time to start making life changing decisions.

Jeremie

I am not advocating one way or the other, I leave that decision to the individual and family. And this is not the forum for that debate. 

I am simply suggesting that therapy before puberty is a possible line to determine athletic participation at a high level. I am not offering it because I think it is perfect but rather because there needs to be criteria and chromosomes or gender at birth are flawed as are identified gender.

As i said I don't claim to have answers, these are just my thoughts.

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1 minute ago, criley4way said:

Jeremie

I am not advocating one way or the other, I leave that decision to the individual and family. And this is not the forum for that debate. 

I am simply suggesting that therapy before puberty is a possible line to determine athletic participation at a high level. I am not offering it because I think it is perfect but rather because there needs to be criteria and chromosomes or gender at birth are flawed as are identified gender.

As i said I don't claim to have answers, these are just my thoughts.

Technically, yes, I agree that would be the correct time frame in order for the therapy to effect the most change and make it so that the individuals would have physiological make ups closer to that gender which they associate with.

I'm confused as to your last comment though, but I'd rather ignore it than go into a discussion about it.

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3 hours ago, criley4way said:

My best solution but I'd be happy to hear a more informed opinion.

I'm not informed at all. Not only do I have a very limited knowledge of genetics, I don't have any personal experience with transgender individuals and the treatment they undergo.

The article in the OP is about titles being won and records set by transgender high school athletes with some parents wanting them banned. I suppose that makes my posts and opinions a bit off-topic. My only concern is that all kids have access and an opportunity to participate in team sports if they so desire. Records and titles are not a concern of mine, even though I recognize that they are important to most others. My suggestion was to allow a transgender female immediate access to competition by allowing her to compete against males. Will she win? Probably not often, if at all. But at least she could compete.

If creating a criteria based on hormone treatment (or whatever is logical), and testing individuals can be accomplished easily, then I would concede that to be a better, more fair option. Again, I'm very ignorant about the science.

3 hours ago, criley4way said:

For me the goal would be help these people integrate as much as possible given the difficulty they have  to start with.

It's nice to read through these posts and see that attitudes have changed a bit over what they were 20 or 30 years ago. I don't generally care as much about adults, but it's not that difficult to remember how crappy high school could be for those of us who didn't have something like this to deal with. I can't imagine what a day in the life of a transgender kid would be like. 

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Good grief. I think I’ll crawl back into my hole and pretend that stuff like this isn’t going on. 

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