• Announcements

    • iacas

      Create a Signature!   02/05/2016

      Everyone, go here and edit your signature this week: http://thesandtrap.com/settings/signature/.
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
pusher

Hack Golf Initiative

114 posts in this topic

Bill Fields of Golf World wrote this week about Taylor-Made’s Hack Golf initiative designed to solicit new thoughts on how to entice more people to the game. At the PGA show Hack Golf introduced an oversized set of non-conforming clubs and a bigger ball designed for a larger hole. They believe golf is just too hard and complex and needs to be dumbed down in order to attract more participants. This disturbs me. I think dumbing down the game distorts the game itself. Yes, golf is hard. Yes, it is complex. If you want easy there’s always checkers or fishing. I don’t believe the game is keeping people away. It’s the fact that it takes time to learn and time to play and people do not have enough time anymore. Besides, where would this distorted game be played? I’m curious to hear your thoughts on this.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Want to get rid of this advertisement? Sign up (or log in) today! It's free!

Are these the same guys (Taylor Made) that claim (like most other manufacturers) that each new iron release adds 10 yards.... And are "the most forgiving yet".... Surely the game can't be that hard if we can hit a PW 180 yards with a 3/4 swing that is off center!!! (Slight hint of sarcasm) If we were to that this initiative seriously for a moment, I wonder how they think it will attract more players to the game. People that haven't played golf generally don't realise how difficult it is, thus it's not a barrier to entry.
1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are these the same guys (Taylor Made) that claim (like most other manufacturers) that each new iron release adds 10 yards.... And are "the most forgiving yet"....

Surely the game can't be that hard if we can hit a PW 180 yards with a 3/4 swing that is off center!!!

(Slight hint of sarcasm)

If we were to that this initiative seriously for a moment, I wonder how they think it will attract more players to the game. People that haven't played golf generally don't realise how difficult it is, thus it's not a barrier to entry.

You should get 200 out of the newer, faster, hotter, longer model.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey! Fishing isn't easy!

Checkers, yea that's pretty easy.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey! Fishing isn't easy!

Checkers, yea that's pretty easy.


Don't tell me that!

My mother used to whip my butt at checkers every single night. My dad used to let me win at different things (which I didn't know at the time) but my mom had no mercy.

I'm a pretty good fisherman though.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have no issue with dumbing it down if it makes it easier for people to play, I just won't be participating in that version of the game!
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards and Achievements

I have no issue with dumbing it down if it makes it easier for people to play, I just won't be participating in that version of the game!


I agree. Can't see myself playing an easier version. But I must admit there was a time when I could never picture myself playing softball or flag football and I ended up playing a lot of both.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The down side to it is that a new player picks up the game under these rules and thinks that they are playing golf.  Then they join a club or serious league and have to start over again.  Or they find out that they don't like the real game and quit again, and TM has made some money by promoting a false pretense.  Every time TM makes a public policy statement any more, they lose more esteem from serious and semi-serious players.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think almost anything that gets more people into the game is a good thing. The game is in a decline and while that can be good (less crowds, lower cost), overall it is a negative. I also disagree that they will "start over" Rick. They won't. That's the point.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards and Achievements

I struggle with this. I really don't like it, but if it is something that can save some courses out there...
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards and Achievements

There has been Goofy Golf for years. In my opinion, TaylorMade is shooting themselves in the foot. I personally will NEVER play their dumbed down game (I will NOT use the word golf in refering to that bastard version of the game they envision) and while I'm at it I will give up even considering equipment made by that company that is intended for use in the actual game. Yes, perhaps golf isn't growing the way it was ten years ago when the economy was better and there was more optimism for the future, but golf will survive even if it isn't dumbed down to the level of tic tac toe.
0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think almost anything that gets more people into the game is a good thing. The game is in a decline and while that can be good (less crowds, lower cost), overall it is a negative.

I also disagree that they will "start over" Rick. They won't. That's the point.


I agree, what some people on this thread ( and lurkers) are not getting is there has been over 5 million walk away from this game since 2008,meanwhile other sports have flourished and grown.  On Golfs age back side older players 55+ due to age & badly damaged financials and retirement have greatly impacted them, especially the middle class. More and more are dropping out or at very least playing fewer and fewer times. On the front side 18-30 years, the tiger factor never ever happened, very few schools if any teach golf in gym class- nothing sustainable has worked.  The first tee isn't working and EA sports is not compelling enough to have them try the real thing. This age group has the fewest participants EVER.

The middle 31-54 is also in decline, partly due to the recession but more so the game is complicated, strict rules that are misunderstood and rounds that take too long. This is usually a time where careers flourish and family's are started etc

I commend Mark King for taking a stand, funding hack golf and drawing attention to a real problem, that is only getting worse as time goes on. His view is to get more people on the course and interested in any golf. Once there maybe some will aspire to play the real game and rules.  I disagree with people that feel its just a way of making money. Hack golf is website for the exchange of ideas of how to promote, better and get people interested in playing & keep playing golf- from people like us. . A very high number of people that walk away for a year- are gone for good..

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There has been Goofy Golf for years. In my opinion, TaylorMade is shooting themselves in the foot. I personally will NEVER play their dumbed down game (I will NOT use the word golf in refering to that bastard version of the game they envision) and while I'm at it I will give up even considering equipment made by that company that is intended for use in the actual game.

Yes, perhaps golf isn't growing the way it was ten years ago when the economy was better and there was more optimism for the future, but golf will survive even if it isn't dumbed down to the level of tic tac toe.


The highest level of participation of golf,was in 1998, since then there has been a steady decline and in the last 5years a steep decline.
The so called  dumb down version is not for you at all, it's for people who don't play golf, or gave it up....its not intended to weaken the game but rather increased peoples awareness, have fun and maybe get them to play.   now do you understand it?

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well said Spitfisher.

This is not the first time there has been a attempt to reverse the decline. A few years ago The Masters called for ideas and then there was Golf 2.0.

I own a 9 Hole Par 3 golf course (all about 130yds), the first thing I did when I started it up was to use oversize cups (8 inch), the golf course is low maintenance, popular with the younger demographic and I take pride that I have introduced so many non-golfers to the game. I have seen many golfers start playing at my course, learn for 12 mths, then move onto and join an 18 hole full size course.

Four years ago, I became part of a golf "think tank". The guys involved have varying levels of golfing skill, we've looked at the entire structure of the golf industry. Whilst we are excited to have developed a totally new concept/ product that will be coming to market in a few months, there have been some other eye opening discoveries.

My advice to anyone in the golf industry.......learn Mandarin!

If China's participation rate approached that of it's neighbours (Japan and Korea) they would have to build in excess of 50,000 golf courses (currently there are approximately 35,000 golf course in the World).

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The highest level of participation of golf,was in 1998, since then there has been a steady decline and in the last 5years a steep decline.

The so called  dumb down version is not for you at all, it's for people who don't play golf, or gave it up....its not intended to weaken the game but rather increased peoples awareness, have fun and maybe get them to play.   now do you understand it?

While I agree that golf needs to be looked at in terms of stopping the decline/increasing participation, creating a new game is not the answer imo.

This initiative skrikes me a being akin to solving the problem of a leaking dam by deciding to start to remove water from the resevoir with a cup.

Will it help, probably.

Is it the real solution, no.

Yes, it may attract new people to something that resembles golf.... but it isn't golf.

There are plenty of areas where "Golf" can address the decline.... participation among younger generations, increased availability of low cost options etc.

I would be far happier to see them address the issues that sit within the confines of the game at present rather than looking to create something different, something that isn't golf.

When does golf stop becoming golf...

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The highest level of participation of golf,was in 1998, since then there has been a steady decline and in the last 5years a steep decline.

The so called  dumb down version is not for you at all, it's for people who don't play golf, or gave it up....its not intended to weaken the game but rather increased peoples awareness, have fun and maybe get them to play.   now do you understand it?

Oh, I understand it.  I simply do not agree with the concept nor do I believe that it will be good for the game.  Only time will tell for that of course.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not having read the article referenced in the OP,  can someone explain, is this supposed to be played in conjunction with real golf on existing courses, or does it require it's own, dedicated course?

With a different sized hole, it would seem to be the latter.  If that's the case, it seems like the real challenge in executing the concept will be convincing developers that the hack golf concept will make them more money than a standard golf course will.  That's gonna be an uphill battle.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards and Achievements

Well, they could reform the game's rules to simplify them. One could have two holes on a green, identified with different colored or shaped flags - on opposite sides of the green for an 8 inch hole and regulation hole... I'd like to see more pitch and putt courses to get people interested in a quicker game. But I'd like them more picturesque. I have a 18 hole, more or less, pitch and putt not far from me -- it's always busy, but it's flat and treeless, which is probably good for its target market - fast play ... or as fast as possible.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Awards and Achievements

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0



  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • 2016 TST Partners

    GAME Golf
    PING Golf
    Lowest Score Wins
  • Posts

    • How do I organize a charity tournament to be a raging success?
      26 and a stroke? Holy smokes. Very sorry to hear that.  I have no idea how to organize a tournament but I have played in my share. The best ones are scrambles where you can organize your own team. The outcome has rarely ever mattered to us as long as we were well fed. Find a local restaurant (usually a bbq place) that wants to help you out and give a discount for advertising and spend your money there. Everyone will love to come for a good meal. Some nice prizes and maybe a raffle with some local companies offering you something if you are able to convince them it is worth it to give something to the cause.  Another thing I have seen work well is a silent auction at the end with donated items. I donated airline miles of which I have tons and 100,000 miles went for $205. Free gift for me and the cause got $205. 
    • How to eliminate blowup holes
      Haha - I get a couple of reputation points for a post and then go and have a blow up hole. Good drive, left myself 145 in down hill (8i), aimed #deadcenter, pulled 2 shots 25 yards left out of bounds, made 9 (+5) in a 9 hole round of (+11). A better way to avoid blow up holes - play stableford!
    • Donald Trump for president?
      Come on now, that's a bit uncalled for in Bernies case.  His political ideals might be way left, but he is at least honest and virtuous.
    • Jack or Tiger: Who's the Greatest Golfer?
      I'll have to examine your other post closer. That's a good point to consider about the expansion to Continental Europe. Largely explains the poor showing of UK & Ireland in the 60's with many top tier European players not eligible. But considering the 200 million U.S. population base to 63 million in the U.K. & Ireland at the time, the latter did surprisingly well if population base was all that matters. IMO an established competitive golfing culture matters in producing elite players too. Those same European players excluded from Ryder Cup were always eligible for the Majors. The Ryder Cup is also a limited field event. It concentrates the 12 top players of the European Tour. From what I've read, depth of field is still stronger for the 'typical' PGA event, though some non-major Euro events are now stronger than some of the 'minor' PGA events. That is a significant change in Euro competitiveness from the 60's. To some extent that 30% drop sounds like it could be due to simply more international players occupying slots in the fields. If the period you mention covers when majors started to use OWGR for automatic qualification that has some not insignificant inherent issues in terms of strength of field. Having a guaranteed start rather than having to qualify would certainly make for an easier decision to travel to the event. But I'm not arguing against the policy decision facilitating international competition with a little points boost just trying to point out that field strength may not have been as weak in Jack's day as you seem to think. Compared to his peers, which is really the only thing I think you can do without speculative nuance I agree there's no question he's the best golfer. I'm really just arguing that standouts of their caliber (so many more wins so many more majors) than typical players among already elite fields are so rare, that I expect they both represent near the achievable human pinnacle in golf talent, which I don't think really differs within a few generations. The nuances of comparison across eras is interesting to me so I'll debate relative points, but I'm against arguments undervaluing Jack's achievements against 'weak fields'. They both faced very stiff competition.   I'm not dissing Jack. I think his achievements are amazing. I also think the same of Tiger's record. IMO winning percentage per start in the Majors is a very significant stat and Tiger has that in his favor (they are both top 10 and within ~ 2% of each other's number). That number is not the official one for Jack though, I truncated his Major starts to end at age 47, which I think is a reasonable cutoff for competitiveness. If Tiger competes as long as Jack did his major win % (up to age 47) might stay about the same, increase, or decrease (more likely), but he certainly won't match the 18 Majors if he doesn't get like 22+ more major starts between now and age 47.
    • Wedges, Bounce, and Ground Conditions
      Typically more bounce (or a "healthy" amount of bounce) helps in any condition.  
  • TST Blog Entries

  • Images

  • Today's Birthdays

    1. glinks
      glinks
      (43 years old)
  • Blog Entries