The Robin Mathews Williams Approach

[Hugh Jars]

I came across this guy as he was talked up by Golf Sidekick, who's videos on course management I'm getting a lot out of.

RMW advocates forgetting the complex technical analysis that leads to paralysis, and freeing up players from thinking too much about the swing. He does a lot of no look / or walk in drills with a bucket of balls. Its refreshing.

As someone who has got absolutely nowhere really hitting hundreds of balls, having lessons from "pros" and studying technical analysis, I thought the hell with it at the range and started trying his walk up technique, his one foot drill, eyes closed drill, breathing techniques and forgetting all swing thoughts and just hitting the ball. The one step drill which is likened to a hockey play swat I couldn't believe how much crap I hit out of the ball.

On the weekend I played a couple of rounds just walking up and hitting it for my full swing shots. Hit it the longest and purest I have in a while, maybe ever. 

Dont know if anyone follows this guy on Instagram and youtube, but he takes the absolute piss out of youtube and technical instructors and frankly its hilarious. Probably going against everything this site stands for, so no doubt with rub some people up the wrong way. Technical instruction is how most golf teaching pros make their money. I know Mark Crossfield had a huge spat with him.

Anyway - over to you. Ill grab the popcorn....

[billchao]

5 minutes ago, Hugh Jars said:

RMW advocates forgetting the complex technical analysis that leads to paralysis, and freeing up players from thinking too much about the swing. He does a lot of no look / or walk in drills with a bucket of balls. Its refreshing.

Name doesn't ring a bell, but the methodology does. I've seen it somewhere before.

9 minutes ago, Hugh Jars said:

As someone who has got absolutely nowhere really hitting hundreds of balls, having lessons from "pros" and studying technical analysis, I thought the hell with it at the range and started trying his walk up technique, his one foot drill, eyes closed drill, breathing techniques and forgetting all swing thoughts and just hitting the ball. The one step drill which is likened to a hockey play swat I couldn't believe how much crap I hit out of the ball.

I find that most people who complain about golf instructors being too technical are either bad at practicing what they're supposed to (and more specifically, how to practice properly in general) or have had bad instructors.

12 minutes ago, Hugh Jars said:

Probably going against everything this site stands for, so no doubt with rub some people up the wrong way. Technical instruction is how most golf teaching pros make their money.

That's funny, because all the technical instruction on this website is available for free.

[ChetlovesMer]

15 minutes ago, Hugh Jars said:

I came across this guy as he was talked up by Golf Sidekick, who's videos on course management I'm getting a lot out of.

RMW advocates forgetting the complex technical analysis that leads to paralysis, and freeing up players from thinking too much about the swing. He does a lot of no look / or walk in drills with a bucket of balls. Its refreshing.

As someone who has got absolutely nowhere really hitting hundreds of balls, having lessons from "pros" and studying technical analysis, I thought the hell with it at the range and started trying his walk up technique, his one foot drill, eyes closed drill, breathing techniques and forgetting all swing thoughts and just hitting the ball. The one step drill which is likened to a hockey play swat I couldn't believe how much crap I hit out of the ball.

On the weekend I played a couple of rounds just walking up and hitting it for my full swing shots. Hit it the longest and purest I have in a while, maybe ever. 

Dont know if anyone follows this guy on Instagram and youtube, but he takes the absolute piss out of youtube and technical instructors and frankly its hilarious. Probably going against everything this site stands for, so no doubt with rub some people up the wrong way. Technical instruction is how most golf teaching pros make their money. I know Mark Crossfield had a huge spat with him.

Anyway - over to you. Ill grab the popcorn....

Hey Hugh, thanks for the heads up on this guy. 

I went and watched a bunch of his videos and I've seen a lot of it before. I've seen bunches of it presented before in a program back in the 90's by a guy called David Lee called Gravity Golf. It also has a some of the principles that Tathata Golf teaches as well. 

The ONE thing he does that I do NOT like is he makes the claim in one of the videos I saw that Golf Instructors don't want you to improve, because then they won't make any money. (words to that effect)  I've heard that a million times from different sources and it's got to be the biggest PILE OF CRAP EVER!!!!

Of course golf instructors WANT you to improve. That's like saying math teachers don't want you to learn math. 

 

[iacas]

How is this not just trolling?

[boogielicious]

8 hours ago, Hugh Jars said:

I came across this guy as he was talked up by Golf Sidekick, who's videos on course management I'm getting a lot out of.

RMW advocates forgetting the complex technical analysis that leads to paralysis, and freeing up players from thinking too much about the swing. He does a lot of no look / or walk in drills with a bucket of balls. Its refreshing.

As someone who has got absolutely nowhere really hitting hundreds of balls, having lessons from "pros" and studying technical analysis, I thought the hell with it at the range and started trying his walk up technique, his one foot drill, eyes closed drill, breathing techniques and forgetting all swing thoughts and just hitting the ball. The one step drill which is likened to a hockey play swat I couldn't believe how much crap I hit out of the ball.

On the weekend I played a couple of rounds just walking up and hitting it for my full swing shots. Hit it the longest and purest I have in a while, maybe ever. 

Dont know if anyone follows this guy on Instagram and youtube, but he takes the absolute piss out of youtube and technical instructors and frankly its hilarious. Probably going against everything this site stands for, so no doubt with rub some people up the wrong way. Technical instruction is how most golf teaching pros make their money. I know Mark Crossfield had a huge spat with him.

Anyway - over to you. Ill grab the popcorn....

My instructor(s) have always had me focus on one thing at a time. That is not too technical at all. I've learned a lot of the technical side of golf swing mechanics on this site and from golf books, but my instructor never goes that route. They just give me one priority piece to work on and a method to work on it. They also never suggest I hit "hundreds" of balls at the range. They recommend simple, specific practices.

There are bad instructors out there, many on YouTube. I know nothing about the instructor in your post, but if you feel it is working for you, great. But it may not work for me. 

Best of luck and remember to have fun, even practicing.

[billchao]

9 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

The ONE thing he does that I do NOT like is he makes the claim in one of the videos I saw that Golf Instructors don't want you to improve, because then they won't make any money. (words to that effect)  I've heard that a million times from different sources and it's got to be the biggest PILE OF CRAP EVER!!!!

No kidding. If I was getting lessons from someone and wasn't improving, I'd stop getting lessons. Sounds like a sustainable business model to me 🙃

[iacas]

11 hours ago, Hugh Jars said:

RMW advocates forgetting the complex technical analysis that leads to paralysis

It doesn't always or even necessarily lead to paralysis. And the "technical" side of it is often completely the realm of the instructor. I don't think more than 3% of my students would use the word "technical" to describe my lessons, and that 3% are quite likely students who like to understand the "technical" aspects of the stuff, as it helps them buy in and understand the big picture… but they still aren't thinking about those when they practice. It's just a means of getting them to buy in.

So, just like those late-night infomercials, your dude is already starting off poorly by positing some thing which doesn't really exist.

Most good instructors aren't technical at all with their students. Most bad instructors don't know enough to get too technical. So who are these people out there being "paralyzed"?

You know who those people are, often, in my experience? People trying to learn themselves, and who watch YouTube videos, etc. THEY have to be technical because they're their own instructor, and often that can lead to this paralysis.

But heck, even the bad instructors I've seen aren't technical.

So his initial claim rings false to me.

11 hours ago, Hugh Jars said:

RMW advocates forgetting the complex technical analysis that leads to paralysis, and freeing up players from thinking too much about the swing. He does a lot of no look / or walk in drills with a bucket of balls. Its refreshing.

It's refreshing because golfers keep wanting to believe that there's some magical band-aid fix out there that will let them put in very little work and achieve wondrous results.

11 hours ago, Hugh Jars said:

As someone who has got absolutely nowhere really hitting hundreds of balls, having lessons from "pros" and studying technical analysis

Why is "pros" in quotes?

And why were you "studying technical analysis"? That's not your job.

11 hours ago, Hugh Jars said:

I thought the hell with it at the range and started trying his walk up technique, his one foot drill, eyes closed drill, breathing techniques and forgetting all swing thoughts and just hitting the ball. The one step drill which is likened to a hockey play swat I couldn't believe how much crap I hit out of the ball.

Were they Vice balls? That would explain it.

But seriously… uhhh, you're being a bit of a sucker.

11 hours ago, Hugh Jars said:

On the weekend I played a couple of rounds just walking up and hitting it for my full swing shots. Hit it the longest and purest I have in a while, maybe ever.

Quite possible you're just in the honeymoon phase.

People often see a bit of a reprieve when they are able to, in some way, clear their minds and just make swings. I agree that some people get too technical.

Good lessons actually boil that away. It's usually people who are self-taught or who aren't regularly seeing someone who are "too technical."

I can ask any of my students what they're working on, and they'll tell you one, maybe two things. They're all feelings. Some will be able to tell you why that works, some won't. It depends on the type of student they are. Very few will give you anything "technical."

11 hours ago, Hugh Jars said:

Dont know if anyone follows this guy on Instagram and youtube, but he takes the absolute piss out of youtube and technical instructors and frankly its hilarious.

So he sets up a straw man and then takes them down.

11 hours ago, Hugh Jars said:

Probably going against everything this site stands for, so no doubt with rub some people up the wrong way.

And this is why I think you're just trolling.

You're also incredibly, incredibly off base. You're wrong. You couldn't be much further from the truth if you tried.

11 hours ago, Hugh Jars said:

Technical instruction is how most golf teaching pros make their money.

Again, quite wrong.

---

I'd just like to add, too, that I gave one of my better lessons recently, and it was to a guy who was playing horribly. I had him swinging all sorts of things - throwing the medicine ball, swinging a club the wrong way around, swinging a rope, etc. He was getting too technical (all on his own) and forgot to actually SWING the club with some speed.

A great lesson and the next day over nine holes he took 15 strokes fewer than he had the last time he played. His swing isn't perfect, but he bound himself up quite a bit (all on his own - he came with about five or six things that I hadn't ever talked to him about), and I had to remind him that golf is an athletic activity and if you try to "steer" into the ball and think about all these things you'll hit it worse.

So, again, I don't think you know at all what "this site stands for."

[iacas]

This video's a bunch of bull. People can't and don't just "learn" from the finish, they don't just "learn" from their mistakes. The golf swing is not a baby learning to walk. Walking is a TON easier than hitting a golf ball.

---

Furthermore, you're one to talk about golf instruction here, and "everything this site stands for" when THIS was the last post I made in your Member swing topic (bold added by me):

On 9/2/2019 at 8:15 PM, iacas said:

They're pull-hooks, and pulls, which means your path is to the left. Sometimes the face is square to that path (pull), and sometimes it's closed to that path (pull-hook).

Put an alignment stick in front of you, on the target line, and learn to start the ball to the right of it while hitting pushes and draws.

My hunch is you'll do well to learn to use your lower body, too. You're very flat footed there.

My my! What do we have here?

• Nothing all that technical besides showing you that your perception of your draws is wrong (they're pull-draws).
• Me giving you a simple, visual drill to help you.
• Me telling you to do that simple thing and learn for yourself what it feels like to make the ball miss the stick to the right.

That drill will change your path. It will improve your club face awareness. And it'll probably help you get your weight forward a bit more, too.

 

[ChetlovesMer]

I tried to give this guy a chance. But I reached my limit on his videos because of how much profanity he uses. I'm not being a prude or offended in any way. It's just that it actually gets tiresome hearing the F word and the S word over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over etc...…..

Plus, sometimes I like to watch golf videos with my kids and I obviously can't do that with this guy. 

[boogielicious]

27 minutes ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I tried to give this guy a chance. But I reached my limit on his videos because of how much profanity he uses. I'm not being a prude or offended in any way. It's just that it actually gets tiresome hearing the F word and the S word over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over etc...…..

Plus, sometimes I like to watch golf videos with my kids and I obviously can't do that with this guy. 

When I was coaching youth soccer, I switched to "fudge" and other harmless substitutes. 

[Patch]

I never heard of this RMW guy, until this thread, or don't remember his instruction. 

I looked him up on You Tube to see what he was doing.

Off hand I'd give him a 50/50 rating. Some good. Some not so good. That could change with a revisit to his instruction, and more understanding on my part.. 

I did like his no technical approach to golf swing instruction. This, especially for amatures. 

I tend to think golf swing instruction has it's own lingo, that is sometimes tough to understand by the average player wanting to learn.  

 

Edited September 23, 2019 by Patch

[ChetlovesMer]

3 hours ago, iacas said:

This video's a bunch of bull. People can't and don't just "learn" from the finish, they don't just "learn" from their mistakes. The golf swing is not a baby learning to walk. Walking is a TON easier than hitting a golf ball.

---

 

I have to agree with @iacason this one. 

A lot of RMW's videos are kinda like this. (I've watched a bunch now). In one video he actually says (this is a quote) "Just experiment and figure out what f***ing works for you..." in another he says (another quote) "If you balls going to the right just figure out how to make it go straight..." 

How is that coaching????

The more videos of this guy I watch the less I like him. 

I'm down with the no technical thoughts part and some of his drills are great. But IMO he's not revolutionary and he's NOT the FIRST guy to tell people not to think about technical stuff on the teebox because it paralyzes you. --> Tathata Golf calls that keeping your mind out in front. Performance golf center calls it eliminating mental bees buzzing around in your head. Gravity Golf calls it visualizing ball flight not your swing. The book Mastering Golf's Mental Game calls it getting out of your own way. Zen Golf … do I need to go on? 

Any golf coach worth anything will tell you (with a few exceptions) not to focus on the technical aspects of your swing during the swing. 

And again, there are a couple of his videos in which he implies or states directly that other golf instructions don't want you to improve... That is freaking asinine! 

I understand there are different coaches for different students. If this guy's helping your game, that's great. What ever it takes to grow the game and for more people to enjoy it. But I think I'm done with him.

@Hugh JarsI'm glad you got something useful from him. He's just not for me. 

[boogielicious]

I prefer this Robin Williams as a coach.

 

[NDavis]

What He teaches is based upon triangulaid/flowmotion +other variation called Zen golf (I think) - got it from I think two teachers one in Nottingham and another teacher called Marcus? 

So in fact it is based upon a Methodology taught by professional teachers and his slant on not using pros is therefore disingenuous. 

The idea I think of this methodology is essentially to simply swing the club through the ball with a rythm natural to you & to eliminate the hit impulse. 

E. G The walk in practice method is to establish a rhythm for the swing - and forget about the ball. 

 

 

[NDavis]

Ah - ideas based on  a chap called Bill Owen here is link to YouTube video of him teaching a group of beginners - a bit long

 

Spanish but Bill speaks in English! Oops link starts at 6 min - please rewind to start

Edited October 17, 2019 by NDavis
Addition

[NDavis]

If interested - starts with is no look drills then the walk in drill is at about 17  minute mark. 

[rehmwa]

On 9/24/2019 at 6:42 AM, boogielicious said:

I prefer this Robin Williams as a coach.

 

I admit I read the subject as Robin Williams and clicked on it because of that.

Imagine my letdown upon seeing the McLesson topic.  Thanks for the video - improved the thread considerably.