Driver Loft vs Attack Angle

[SAGolfLuvr]

Good Day Club Fitters and those knowledgeable on this subject.

Question. My driver is 8.5 degrees and set to neutral. If my attack angle is 4 degrees up, then shouldn't my launch angle be close to 12.5 degrees?  My swing speed has decreased from 111 mph 14 years ago, (I blame my age and lack of fitness) to 102 mph. So I'm researching driver lofts. I want my launch angle to be between 12 -14 degrees to get the optimum carry and roll distance for my swing speed. (Yes I know shafts play into this as well, so I will comb this sight to see member reviews on shafts). I recently switched to the Byron Nelson 1 plane swing (as taught by Tom Saguto) to shallow out my driver to achieve a better attack angle. Yeah I know (just go get fitted) but I still want to do my research before dropping all that cash.  Thanks in advance for your time.  

[saevel25]

27 minutes ago, SAGolfLuvr said:

Good Day Club Fitters and those knowledgeable on this subject.

Question. My driver is 8.5 degrees and set to neutral. If my attack angle is 4 degrees up, then shouldn't my launch angle be close to 12.5 degrees?  

Your loft on the driver is not loft presented at impact. you could be presenting more loft or less loft. 

[Release]

1 hour ago, SAGolfLuvr said:

Good Day Club Fitters and those knowledgeable on this subject.

Question. My driver is 8.5 degrees and set to neutral. If my attack angle is 4 degrees up, then shouldn't my launch angle be close to 12.5 degrees?  My swing speed has decreased from 111 mph 14 years ago, (I blame my age and lack of fitness) to 102 mph. So I'm researching driver lofts. I want my launch angle to be between 12 -14 degrees to get the optimum carry and roll distance for my swing speed. (Yes I know shafts play into this as well, so I will comb this sight to see member reviews on shafts). I recently switched to the Byron Nelson 1 plane swing (as taught by Tom Saguto) to shallow out my driver to achieve a better attack angle. Yeah I know (just go get fitted) but I still want to do my research before dropping all that cash.  Thanks in advance for your time.  

Why not try put the golf ball an inch or two back in the stance ?  Think elongate the bottom of the swing a bit more toward the target.  Experiment the ball position to find the optimal spot to suit your want and need.

Yes, the shaft is important and so is the golf ball.  That will keep you busy for awhile.

 

[iacas]

1 hour ago, SAGolfLuvr said:

Good Day Club Fitters and those knowledgeable on this subject.

Question. My driver is 8.5 degrees and set to neutral. If my attack angle is 4 degrees up, then shouldn't my launch angle be close to 12.5 degrees?  My swing speed has decreased from 111 mph 14 years ago, (I blame my age and lack of fitness) to 102 mph. So I'm researching driver lofts. I want my launch angle to be between 12 -14 degrees to get the optimum carry and roll distance for my swing speed.

You probably want to launch it higher than that.

Keeping 2700 RPM, and allowing for a ball speed of 150 MPH (150/102 = 1.47 Smash)… in yards:

• 13°: 252.5 total (244.4 carry)
• 15°: 253.8 total (247.1 carry)
• 17°: 254.2 total (248.4 carry)

Now, that's not much, but 12-14 is a bit low.

---

And no, it's nowhere near as simple as 8.5 + 4 = 12.5. The shaft kicks, you can de-loft the face while still hitting up, etc. LOTS of stuff go into that. The ball doesn't launch directly 90° to the face, etc.

[colin007]

Can't lofts be measured differently depending where on the club face you hit also?

[boogielicious]

7 hours ago, colin007 said:

Can't lofts be measured differently depending where on the club face you hit also?

Absolutely. The face is curved (convex), so higher on the face is a higher static loft.

[Adam C]

Get some foot spray powder or dry erase marker and check your impact position on the face. Then start adjusting tee height before you start making swing or equipment changes. Always start simple and go from there.

[SAGolfLuvr]

Saevel and Iacas I watched so many pro swing analysis videos using Trackman and GC2 where the launch angle of these bombers where "always" around 14 degrees. What you both said is making me rethink the other trend I see with these pros which is the 8-9.5 degree driver heads they use. Iacas Thank you for taking the time to explain launch angle vs swing speed. I was compelled to think 14 degrees would be optimum launch for carry and roll. Now I understand why faster swingers can have 10-12 degree driver heads. I'm trying to avoid the dreaded ballooning and lack of roll that I experienced with my old 2 plane swing. So I'm shopping for a driver that works well with my current swing. Thanks again gentlemen for your time!  

[SAGolfLuvr]

On 8/23/2020 at 10:01 PM, iacas said:

You probably want to launch it higher than that.

Keeping 2700 RPM, and allowing for a ball speed of 150 MPH (150/102 = 1.47 Smash)… in yards:

• 13°: 252.5 total (244.4 carry)
• 15°: 253.8 total (247.1 carry)
• 17°: 254.2 total (248.4 carry)

Now, that's not much, but 12-14 is a bit low.

---

And no, it's nowhere near as simple as 8.5 + 4 = 12.5. The shaft kicks, you can de-loft the face while still hitting up, etc. LOTS of stuff go into that. The ball doesn't launch directly 90° to the face, etc.

Mr. Iacas,

Inspired by your post, I tested 2 drivers that I have always wanted to test. Ping i20 with stiff flex shaft and Ping i25 with a regular flex shaft (Graphite Design YS-6+ R). My ego took a hit when my launch monitor showed me my carry distances are better with the regular flex shaft. The loft was set to 8 degrees so I know that if I hit a 10 degree driver, I would get somewhere around the carry distances my launch monitor showed me. I included my shortest carry (more typical) and impact pattern. My longest was 270 carry, 104 swing speed, 155 ball speed.  I plan on trying a driver at 12 degrees with both shaft flexes next. Thanks again for the inspiration.  

Shout out to Ben at Polo Field Used Golf Seller and Fitter (Brackenridge Park 1st Tee) San Antonio, TX

[TourSpoon]

Ego be damned as I would put a putter shaft in my driver if I could get a 270 carry out of it with a 100-105 swing speed. Not sure what your dispersion looked like but carry on! 

[saevel25]

On 8/27/2020 at 7:38 AM, SAGolfLuvr said:

Now I understand why faster swingers can have 10-12 degree driver heads. I'm trying to avoid the dreaded ballooning and lack of roll that I experienced with my old 2 plane swing.

Don't hit down on the ball. Hitting up will increase launch and reduce spin rate. What causes this ballooning is not launch angle, but spin rate. 

I have a clubhead speed of 115-120 mph. I hit a 10 degree driver, and probably launch it around 12-13 degrees with sub 2200 spin rate. I try to hit up 2-3 degrees. For me, it's not really beneficial to be overly precise with the numbers. The angle of attack can vary +/- a degree. The dynamic loft can change. My spin range is probably 1900 to 2500. 

[RFKFREAK]

11 hours ago, SAGolfLuvr said:

Mr. Iacas,

Inspired by your post, I tested 2 drivers that I have always wanted to test. Ping i20 with stiff flex shaft and Ping i25 with a regular flex shaft (Graphite Design YS-6+ R). My ego took a hit when my launch monitor showed me my carry distances are better with the regular flex shaft. The loft was set to 8 degrees so I know that if I hit a 10 degree driver, I would get somewhere around the carry distances my launch monitor showed me. I included my shortest carry (more typical) and impact pattern. My longest was 270 carry, 104 swing speed, 155 ball speed.  I plan on trying a driver at 12 degrees with both shaft flexes next. Thanks again for the inspiration.  

Shout out to Ben at Polo Field Used Golf Seller and Fitter (Brackenridge Park 1st Tee) San Antonio, TX

264 carry at 103 MPH swing speed is impressive.  Didn't think that swing speed would produce that result. 

 

[SAGolfLuvr]

13 hours ago, TourSpoon said:

Ego be damned as I would put a putter shaft in my driver if I could get a 270 carry out of it with a 100-105 swing speed. Not sure what your dispersion looked like but carry on! 

LOL!! Man you nailed it. Tomorrow, I take it to the golf course for the 1st time to see if I can bring the driving range to the golf course. PLEASE wish me luck as this driver is affordable.

8 hours ago, RFKFREAK said:

264 carry at 103 MPH swing speed is impressive.  Didn't think that swing speed would produce that result. 

 

More to come... I test it on the course tomorrow

[SAGolfLuvr]

12 hours ago, saevel25 said:

Don't hit down on the ball. Hitting up will increase launch and reduce spin rate. What causes this ballooning is not launch angle, but spin rate. 

I have a clubhead speed of 115-120 mph. I hit a 10 degree driver, and probably launch it around 12-13 degrees with sub 2200 spin rate. I try to hit up 2-3 degrees. For me, it's not really beneficial to be overly precise with the numbers. The angle of attack can vary +/- a degree. The dynamic loft can change. My spin range is probably 1900 to 2500. 

YOU SIR is "why I am chasing" the 14 degree launch angle. Iacas took the time to show me that higher launch angles WILL produce longer carry at my swing speed. I switched to the one plane swing to do like you say and hit up instead of the 2 plane hit down like VJ Singh. Sadly I don't have the swing speed like you but I am FOR REAL concentrating on that smash factor for my slow swing speed.  I can't use my launch monitor during play tomorrow but I will let you all know how it went. 

[SAGolfLuvr]

On 8/28/2020 at 7:24 AM, TourSpoon said:

Ego be damned as I would put a putter shaft in my driver if I could get a 270 carry out of it with a 100-105 swing speed. Not sure what your dispersion looked like but carry on! 

 

On 8/23/2020 at 10:01 PM, iacas said:

You probably want to launch it higher than that.

Keeping 2700 RPM, and allowing for a ball speed of 150 MPH (150/102 = 1.47 Smash)… in yards:

• 13°: 252.5 total (244.4 carry)
• 15°: 253.8 total (247.1 carry)
• 17°: 254.2 total (248.4 carry)

Now, that's not much, but 12-14 is a bit low.

---

And no, it's nowhere near as simple as 8.5 + 4 = 12.5. The shaft kicks, you can de-loft the face while still hitting up, etc. LOTS of stuff go into that. The ball doesn't launch directly 90° to the face, etc.

The on course experiment did not go very well with the regular flex shaft and the 8 degree club head combo. I did hit it between 260 and 270 yards like my launch monitor said,  but I only hit 3 out of 14 fairways, and lost 3 balls. Punching out of trees and hitting out of rough is not what I practice during the week. I will try a stiff shaft with the Ping i25 head next because being "distance drunk" today clearly forced me to sober up when it comes to dispersion.   

[DrvFrShow]

I have a 94-95 mph swing speed and have a 16 degree launch angle. I get about 2500 rpm spin with a Srixon Z-Star. When I connect it goes. Unfortunately it doesn't always go where I want. 😞

[SAGolfLuvr]

2 hours ago, DrvFrShow said:

I have a 94-95 mph swing speed and have a 16 degree launch angle. I get about 2500 rpm spin with a Srixon Z-Star. When I connect it goes. Unfortunately it doesn't always go where I want. 😞

I feel you. I was very lucky to have been gifted a sleeve of Kirkland balls from Costco and I bought an old Titleist D2 driver. Seems to have solved my problem. I broke 80 today for the 1st time in years. 

[cnl390]

On 8/29/2020 at 6:38 PM, SAGolfLuvr said:

 

The on course experiment did not go very well with the regular flex shaft and the 8 degree club head combo. I did hit it between 260 and 270 yards like my launch monitor said,  but I only hit 3 out of 14 fairways, and lost 3 balls. Punching out of trees and hitting out of rough is not what I practice during the week. I will try a stiff shaft with the Ping i25 head next because being "distance drunk" today clearly forced me to sober up when it comes to dispersion.   

Trees & Rough.  Sounds like Cedar Creek. LOL