Haney ruined Tiger's swing?

[Zeph]

From what I've seen lately, the real problem is with his short game. Going from one bunker to another, flying greens by twenty or thirty yards with a wedge and missing the hole by six inches from inside five feet is something that we've never seen Woods do before. I'd hazard a guess that he those are things that he hasn't seen himself do since he was playing junior golf.

Didn't you see his scrambling on...the third round I believe it was? He hardly hit a single green, put the ball in terrible spots, yet still walked off with par all the time. His short game is there, it's just he doesn't focus as much when he hits it so poor off the tee and is not in contention. I'm sure those things are very related to eachother.

It's true that the greater part of 2000-2010, he's not been a very good driver of the ball, but why not try to fix that? Once tiger is in the fairway, and have the ability to hit long irons, he's deadly. Tiger has won a lot in spite of some swing flaws, but now he can't ignore them anymore, as they keep getting worse.

[iacas]

Bubba Watson would disagree.

Bubba's won one tournament. It's not an accurate comparison.

The bulk of Nicklaus's wins came during a 12 year period. Guess how long Woods current winning ways have now lasted?

And Jack won 4+ majors outside of that window, too.

From what I've seen lately, the real problem is with his short game.

His short game is fine. When your long game is off you putt a lot more pressure on your short game.

TEMPO! He had it back then. Now its just furious and angry. He just tries to swing as fast as he can.

As I said, when you're adding in bizarre compensations and finishing awkwardly and doing various things, your tempo will look off because your balance and things will look off. Tiger's tempo is roughly the same as it's always been. It just looks awkward.

[ohiolefty]

Hogan never had a swing coach. He had guys he consulted, guys who helped him along the way. Some of the Hogan comments in this thread have been laughable. But anway...

Iacas~~~~ Do you think that the loop maneuver comes from Haney trying to change his ballflight?!?

[bigoak]

Tiger has to do one of two things: 1. go back or turn the page and 2. go forward.

either go back to Butch and try to mold the swing as it once was.

or get a new coach, caddy and develop a new swing that will work with his added bulk and injury compensation.

right now he is in limbo and cannot go back or go forward.

He won tournaments, not because of Haney, but because he has a great deal of talent and a great practice routine.

[normdamarine]

His swing is not broken, he is just getting stuck on the inside that is all... I have just been hired to help him fix his swing and we will win all four majors next year... ;)

[Zeph]

either go back to Butch and try to mold the swing as it once was.

He's already found a new coach, if he just trust him and let him help out. I don't see what replacing Steve would help though.

[Easy]

I wouldn't say Haney ruined Tiger's swing but it didn't really help his game either.

Now that sh*ts hit the fan and he's playing like crap, suddenly Haney is to blame for all of it. He ruined Tiger's swing... laugh...

Cmon now, that's weak mate, Haney never took responsibility when Tiger played bad at the majors in 2009 (The open especially) not to mention he bailed on his pupil when the going got tough. Haney's weak as piss and if you're willing to ride on Tiger's coat tails when the good times roll you gotta be prepared to take the bad.

[JWL1957]

I wouldn't say Haney ruined Tiger's swing but it didn't really help his game either.

Why in the world would Haney even have to accept any blame for Tiger's performance? He is not the one hitting the pill around the course. Tiger must have hit thousands of golf balls correctly in Haney's presence, so why wouldnt he be successful out on the course? I do not understand the logic in blaming a swing coach.

[Plox]

Winning ways do not last forever, and some fans simply need to recognize this FACT.

Tiger is still young, he still has plenty of time to win a whole lot more. Stop stirring the sh1t and pretending he has absolutely no future, it's pretty pathetic on your part.

[golf junkie]

really...another one of these threads? to blame Tiger's downfall on Hank Haney is jsut downright silly. Its been said and I'll say it again, Tiger's swing is looking great. Even Harmon and many others have come forth and said its not the mechanics of his swing, its his brain. To undermine Haney and say he ruined Tiger's swing is just plain stupid. Like others have said, Tiger's career under Haney has been more successful with under Harmon.

Oh come on. Haney has to be a big boy. Credit for the good times, and blame for the bad. I see in sports- toss out the coach during times as this-golf is no different. Cant have it both ways-credit and no blame.

[Knucklefade]

Having played in a lot of junior tourneys in the Texas area with Haney students and (mostly) past Haney students my opinion is he is not a good coach. The "hands outside, roll the face open, get laid off" move is his system...I'm not a fan (not that he cares).

[majorchamp]

really...another one of these threads? to blame Tiger's downfall on Hank Haney is jsut downright silly. Its been said and I'll say it again, Tiger's swing is looking great. Even Harmon and many others have come forth and said its not the mechanics of his swing, its his brain. To undermine Haney and say he ruined Tiger's swing is just plain stupid. Like others have said, Tiger's career under Haney has been more successful with under Harmon.

I'll make one comment about this and then stay away because its like having a political or religious discussion with someone..never ends well.

Saying Haney ruined Tiger's swing is an incorrect statement, but Tiger, IMHO, was not as "good" a player under Haney as he previously was with his older swing. Yes, in the words of Tiger a "W" is a "W", but you can get a W by playing a C game and by playing an A game. The A game is more like what he carried in the early 2000's. Blaming haney for his golfing woes (even if he was winning) is flawed because he was married, had knee issues, his body changed over the years, etc... but, I do believe in my heart Tiger's swing struggled more under Haney. Tiger won tournaments because he is Tiger. For one thing, he had, at one point in his career, the intimidation factor. Like it or not, if he was in a tournament, whether he was hacking the ball or flushing it, his mere prescence probably gained him strokes on the field. His mental game is unlike any other player, so even if he isn't hitting it well, he knows how to score. Remove the mental piece, and now you have a player hitting it all over the place and struggles to recover..hence 2010 for him thus far. I believe pre-Haney, Tiger was more fundamentally sound in his swing. Combine that with his intimdation factor + his mental capacity and that is why he was unstoppable. Start removing those items one by one, and you have a shell of a good player. He has lost the intimidation factor for the most part. Most players KNOW that fearful player he once was is still in there, and will come out again..., and with better swing fundamentals will come more confidence and an increased mental capacity. Basically, you had an incredible player who was dominant (in terms of on the course, victories with large margin of strokes, etc..), went to go under Haney where his fundamentals began to deteriorate, but still good enough that his swing, mental capacity, and intimidation factor were enough to still gain victories. Combine personal life trauma and public humiliation his mental state began to break exposing his swing flaws even more, which in turn deteriorated his intimidation factor. Now he is finally moving in the right direction trying to get his fundamentals right, and I truly believe the post-humiliated Tiger we will see in 2011 or even 2012 could be as scary as the one we saw in 2000. He lost respect, he lost his swing, he lost his family, he lost his image, he lost his intimidation, and he has lost tournaments (if its not a W, its a loss)...he has everything to gain and he will. Ok, my 2 cent novel is all over :)