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Stack and Tilt's Future

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Originally Posted by Keep It Simple

I believe S&T; Rev. 1 is dead.  No more reverse pivot transistioning into a reverse-C.  S&T; Rev. 2 is alive and doing well.  Rev. 3 will replace the hip slide with a knee slide (oh wait, that is Foley's swing).  I kid...I kid...


There never was a reverse pivot or a reverse C, so, I guess we started at 2. Which is odd, since as a computer guy, I start counting at 0. :)

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Originally Posted by iacas

There never was a reverse pivot or a reverse C, so, I guess we started at 2. Which is odd, since as a computer guy, I start counting at 0. :)


Well, there are 10 kinds of people in this world . . .

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Hey Isacc, This entire S&T; discussion is making my "instruction in the golf world is lousy" argument.  Nothing consistent. Stack & Tilt, Natural Golf, Swing the Handle, Havey Penick's little red book, Hogans swing, Reverse C, - heck why don't we all just jump into the" orgasmatron" from the Woody Allen movie Sleeper, maybe that would make our golf swing better.

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There's so much S&T; on this forum that I'm not sure where to put this comment, so it landed here - as good a place as any. Probably not worth a new thread.
There is a current article in Golf Digest about Baddeley, S&T; and post-S&T;, that's much more detailed than their previous ones.
Maybe it's just more of the same, I don't know. Golf swing analysis at this level is way beyond me.
Anyway here it is:
http://www.golfdigest.com/golf-instruction/blogs/theinstructionblog/2011/02/whats-the-future-of-stacktilt.html

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Those that understand binary and those that don't!

Correction: Those that know binary, those who don't, and those who knew this was a ternary joke. ;-) Anyhooooow.... :whistle:

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What amazes me is that so many people seem to be mostly interested in taking position of absolute good or evil then defending it, usually with what passes for wit these days.  Even if you don't agree with S&T;, and I don't accept it completely, the ideas about weight shift, ball flight, use of the legs in a golf swing and the analysis of top swings in the past is a real contribution.  Hardy identified a way that athletic golfers could control their power, Hogan an anti hook swing with exceptional accuracy. Attempts  to analyze golf swings and identify complementary elements is a valuable contribution.  Recognizing a valuable contribution and discussion of fundamental things that have to happen during a swing is all good.  I question people who make statements based on poor reasoning.  S&T; prevents golfer from hitting the ball long etc. How many people tried to copy Nicklaus in his prime? How many of them became long hitters? The truth is long hitters are born not made.  In my prime I could consistently run 800 meters in under 1:48.  Most people could  train like demons and would still be lucky to get under 2 minutes. Talent matters.  My guess it that at most different swing styles make at most a 5-10 yard difference on your driver. It is up to us to decide which trade offs make sense to us.  No matter how hard I work out, or what swing style I emphasize I will never be a long hitter.  If I feel S&T; enhances my short iron contact and consistency and gives me a more consistent ball flight that is probably worth more than 5-10 yards.  Moving the emphasis in golf from an only distance matters mantra is I feel likely to benefit the majority of people taking up golf, most of whom will never be able to reach par 5s into without a hurricane.

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I don't think 1 good or bad week by any player, whether or not they've ever been associated with S&T;, is necessarily proof of anything. Phil just won again. Is Butch the best coach again? For the guys he coaches, maybe he is?!?

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I think S&T; is going to have an overhaul in the near future. Not due to the lack of success from the players on tour but because of the way its presented and defended by its followers.  I heard rumblings that a new book and DVD's are on the way with a revamped driver and long iron move.

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Originally Posted by The Recreational Golfer

Baddeley T4 at Houston.

Another nail in the S&T; coffin?


I was hoping he'd win so I could see even more posts like that. ;-)

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Geez, Phil won using a Callaway ball.  Does that mean it's the end of Titleist?  AB's swing still has a lot of S&T; in it because S&T; teaches a lot of what every good pro golfer uses.  Why is it so hard for the detractors to get this?

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Originally Posted by boogielicious

Geez, Phil won using a Callaway ball.  Does that mean it's the end of Titleist?  AB's swing still has a lot of S&T; in it because S&T; teaches a lot of what every good pro golfer uses.  Why is it so hard for the detractors to get this?



It will never go out of fashion to to be against something popular so as to feel that one is unique.

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Stack and Tilt cannot be dead.  At least until I get the hang to hitting the driver with the S&T.;  I like hitting hybrids and irons but the driver still has me baffled.  When I get the hang of this then you can kill S&T.;  Until then the game is still on.

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It's a numbers game.

How many active PGA pros use S&T;? 2-5% if that?

How many active PGA pros use a "traditional" swing? 80-85%?

How many active PGA pros use a "different" swing? 10-15%?

How many pros use Jim Furyks swing? 1

So if there are 120 players in a tournament and 100 use a traditional, 4 use S&T;, 15 use different swings, and 1 Jim Furyk,,,

The numbers outnumber greatly outweigh the rest. If a certain player doesn't win a certain week, is that play not as good as the rest? no.

Now if you took 100 S&T; players, and paired them up with 5 traditional swingers, and 15 different swings? Who would be on top? Would you consider the traditional swing dead just because the S&T; players won 80% of the time in that pairing? No.

If that player is good enough to get to the Big Leagues using S&T; he deserves to be there, same as the rest. It doesn't matter HOW you get the ball in the hole, as long as it involved contact with a club and the basic physics of a golf swing.

It's incredibly ignorant to bag on anothers swing because you A) Don't understand it, B) Have never tried it, or C) jumping on the bandwagon with the others...

Stack and tilt will never be dead as long as people keep using it.

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Note: This thread is 3279 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

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