Joe Paterno and Penn State

[stealthduffer]

Two observations here:

1) While Paterno may (or may not - we'll see as the facts unfold) did what was legally required I believe he failed his moral obligation.  He was the ONE person at PSU who could have escalated this to almost any level without fear of repercussion.  I'd bet that the Governor (and probably the President) would take or return a call from Joe Paterno.

2) I also believe that this will grow to a magnitude that will possibly destroy not only the football program but all athletics (and potentially the University itself) at PSU for years to come.  If, in fact, it is proven that members of the athletic department and the general administration covered up these crimes sponsors, donors, grantors, professors, and students will view PSU with a wary eye.  Very unfortunate but see my point above - one person who could have stopped this.  Not only without fear of repurcussion but almost guaranteed to enhance a stellar reputation.

[Gresh24]

  stealthduffer said:

Originally Posted by stealthduffer

2) I also believe that this will grow to a magnitude that will possibly destroy not only the football program but all athletics (and potentially the University itself) at PSU for years to come.  If, in fact, it is proven that members of the athletic department and the general administration covered up these crimes sponsors, donors, grantors, professors, and students will view PSU with a wary eye.  Very unfortunate but see my point above - one person who could have stopped this.  Not only without fear of repurcussion but almost guaranteed to enhance a stellar reputation.

Not to mention the civil law suits against the university that will (or can) be filed by all victims.

[clubchamp]

  Gresh24 said:

Originally Posted by Gresh24

Not to mention the civil law suits against the university that will (or can) be filed by all victims.

I'm not sure how the civil suits would play out because since PSU is a state funded university it could end up being immune from tort liability. I'm guessing the Commonwealth court will probably rule in favor of allowing the civil suits since PSU operates independently from the state. Now if PSU was part of the PASSHE then it could not be sued over any civil matter.

[mdl]

Not on Paterno, but McQueary (sp?).  I heard he once broke up a knife fight between two players.  You've got the fortitude to step into a knife fight but you come upon a 60-something guy raping a 10 year old boy and you look them both in the eyes and then walk away and assume it's stopped since you saw them? (That's the gist of the latest version I've read, but correct me if that's not the latest version).

I mean, we can all bluster about how we would have just killed Sandusky on the spot or whatever, and who knows exactly what you might do yourself, but I'd like to think for myself at least that whether or not I exacted immediate retribution on Sandusky that I'd get the damn kid out of there!  Think about it from the boy's perspective.  He's being raped, another adult comes in, looks him in the eye, and walks away?!

[Gresh24]

  mdl said:

Originally Posted by mdl

Not on Paterno, but McQueary (sp?).  I heard he once broke up a knife fight between two players.  You've got the fortitude to step into a knife fight but you come upon a 60-something guy raping a 10 year old boy and you look them both in the eyes and then walk away and assume it's stopped since you saw them? (That's the gist of the latest version I've read, but correct me if that's not the latest version).

I mean, we can all bluster about how we would have just killed Sandusky on the spot or whatever, and who knows exactly what you might do yourself, but I'd like to think for myself at least that whether or not I exacted immediate retribution on Sandusky that I'd get the damn kid out of there!  Think about it from the boy's perspective.  He's being raped, another adult comes in, looks him in the eye, and walks away?!

McQueary said he did stop it.

[jamo]

  Gresh24 said:

McQueary said he did stop it.

I could be wrong, but I don't think he said he did anything physical to stop it, all I've heard is the eye contact.

[Gresh24]

  jamo said:

Originally Posted by jamo

I could be wrong, but I don't think he said he did anything physical to stop it, all I've heard is the eye contact.

He said he stopped it.  Here are his words:

I did stop it, not physically ... but made sure it was stopped when I left that locker room

[iacas]

Joe Paterno has lung cancer, I heard. Quick Google search seems to indicate that's true.

[allin]

I have read through these posts and the one thing I have an issue with is that people fail to recognize that what used to be called the Westmorland effect is likely a factor here. As each level of the chain of command the language chosen to inform becomes milder, tending to minimize what happened. When people invested in an organization are faced with a volatile situation the risk to themselves, other employees, the organization colors everything. Being a team player is often not only a value but a club to limit dissent and criticism, especially in paramilitary and sports environments. It is easy to see it in black and white from the outside. A local writer in my area has called for the dismissal of every employee from secretaries up. This kind of response is why people fail to report in the first place. Of course in my state the reporting requirements are such that a bunch of people including Paterno would be facing charges. I just think even though I recognize the awful moral failure, one of the outcomes if we are to prevent these kind of things is organizations that are more internally supportive of criticism and dissent, including whistle blowers. I also think we need to be more measured in our personal responses. The nuclear response every time we respond to issues polarizes discussion and is one of the main reasons our political and other institutions are so dysfunctional these days.

[clubchamp]

  Gresh24 said:

Originally Posted by Gresh24

He said he stopped it.  Here are his words:

I did stop it, not physically ... but made sure it was stopped when I left that locker room

He also said he called the police who apparently have no record of him reporting anything. Which makes me wonder what is really going on him since PSU fired Paterno but left him on the staff and his grand jury testimony doesn't match what he is saying now. This isn't going to get better for PSU until Sandusky's trial is done, the civil suits are done, Paterno civil suits are done, and the ncaa investigation is done which is probably the worst of all.

[FLOG4]

  clubchamp said:

Originally Posted by clubchamp

He also said he called the police who apparently have no record of him reporting anything. Which makes me wonder what is really going on him since PSU fired Paterno but left him on the staff and his grand jury testimony doesn't match what he is saying now. This isn't going to get better for PSU until Sandusky's trial is done, the civil suits are done, Paterno civil suits are done, and the ncaa investigation is done which is probably the worst of all.

I know if anyone had their personal tweets, posts, emails put in the public forum they would match up 100% with any testimony given.  I was subpoenad once and had to testify and with my arrogance and elephant like memory I knew would do me well.......If you are ever in the situation......Just say I don't recall a thousand times......Persons not even a part to the communication can testify to the intent of the communication that someone else delivered!!!!!!!The written word can be twisted from what the real intent was by the author.  The spoken word can be interpreted differently from the receivers perspective vs the deliverers perspective.  And if you actually do or did ask the police for assistance and they tell you they will look into it and yet nothing was documented???? You look like a fool.  Unless you taped a conversation, took pictures or have a witness that is unimpeachable. Yes there is much to play out here.

[Gresh24]

At least justice was served yesterday...

[Gresh24]

....and I don't think Sandusky lasts very long at all in prison...

[Kapanda]

  Gresh24 said:

Originally Posted by Gresh24

....and I don't think Sandusky lasts very long at all in prison...

They will protect him properly. If he was a nobody, sure. But he is a world famous paedophile. His safety will be assured.

[Gresh24]

  Kapanda said:

Originally Posted by Kapanda

They will protect him properly. If he was a nobody, sure. But he is a world famous paedophile. His safety will be assured.

The most notorious one's are the one's that last the least amount of time...

Child rapist aren't usually protected.

[Kapanda]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-18561471

This guy has balls, if nothing else.

[newtogolf]

Sandusky got off easy, he should have been serving his life sentence 20 years ago.  I have no tolerance for people who abuse children in any way, especially in the way he did.  I'm a bit shocked by the actions of Sandusky's lawyer, Amendola.  The guy just lost a high profile case but seemed in good spirits, making jokes, congratulating the opposition, judge and jury on a great case.  It smells of something shady, but we may never know for sure.  I'm guessing Sandusky commits suicide before he ever gets sentenced.

[Mr3Wiggle]

The Freeh Report is now out.  And let's just say, it doesn't look good for the school or Paterno's legacy.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8159195/report-says-penn-state-senior-officials-disregarded-children-welfare

If players taking money is an offense that can penalize a program, where does this sort of thing rank?  Obviously not violation under NCAA regulations, but still a system-wide breach of morality and law.

Aside from the hundreds of millions the university is going to have to pay out to victims, do you think NCAA penalties will be in play?