Ball plugs in soggy fairway, disappears

[The Recreational Golfer]

During the rainy season, fairways can get so water-logged that a ball descending onto them can drill right into the ground and disappear.

What's the ruling?

[Fourputt]

I guess it's lost.  I can't even find a decision which would say different.  If it's ground under repair, then you get relief and you may substitute a ball if the original ball is lost in the GUR or not recoverable.  But if the area is not marked as GUR,  then either the ball must be found and identified or it's just lost.  In such an extreme case the course should be closed for play until such time as it is once again playable.

[Motley01]

Ball is plugged is a free drop, and relief from standing water also.

[Rulesman]

The relief procedure for an embedded ball requires the ball to be dropped as near as possible to the spot where the ball lay. As the ball cannot be seen, its spot cannot be determined. So there cannot be any relief. The ball must be treated as 'not found'.

It could be argued that a ruling should be made in equity similar to that in Decision 18-1/5 but as this IMO is not an uncommon event I would suggest that if one was thought necessary it would be in the book.

I believe Decision 28/1 confirms my view

Stroke & Distance I'm afraid.

http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Rules-of-Golf/Decision-18/#18-1/5

http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Rules-of-Golf/Decision-28/#28/1

[dsc123]

Can we all agree that this would take the cake for the worst rule in golf?

[zeg]

Originally Posted by dsc123

Can we all agree that this would take the cake for the worst rule in golf?

No.

[Rulesman]

Originally Posted by dsc123

Can we all agree that this would take the cake for the worst rule in golf?

Can't see a problem with it.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by dsc123

Can we all agree that this would take the cake for the worst rule in golf?

zeg said it:

Originally Posted by zeg

No.

[rustyredcab]

Find the ball and get free relief. I'd dig like a gopher until I found the ball. The plugged ball should leave an entry hole. No ball found? Then it is lost as people are saying.

I'd say not so much a bad rule as it is a bad break.

[TourSpoon]

I'd say not so much a bad rule as it is a bad break.

This.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by Motley01

Ball is plugged is a free drop, and relief from standing water also.

Embedded ball rule, Rule 25-2 makes no allowance for not finding the ball.  This is not "standing" water, and by the way, that is something not even mentioned in the rules.

Originally Posted by dsc123

Can we all agree that this would take the cake for the worst rule in golf?

No we can't.  If anything is "worst" about this scenario, it's the decision to play under those conditions.  The only evidence you have that the ball is actually embedded is if you find it at the bottom of its pitch mark - you can't just assume it.  Barring that, the ball is just lost.

[Sonny217]

Originally Posted by Fourputt

Embedded ball rule, Rule 25-2 makes no allowance for not finding the ball.  This is not "standing" water, and by the way, that is something not even mentioned in the rules.

No we can't.  If anything is "worst" about this scenario, it's the decision to play under those conditions.  The only evidence you have that the ball is actually embedded is if you find it at the bottom of its pitch mark - you can't just assume it.  Barring that, the ball is just lost.

+1   Excellent observation.

[onesome]

Could the course implement a local rule on this where the ball was observed by more than the player landing in the fairway and disappearing into the soggy ground that the player should either have a free drop or replay the shot over again from the same spot without penalty?

[zeg]

Originally Posted by onesome

Could the course implement a local rule on this where the ball was observed by more than the player landing in the fairway and disappearing into the soggy ground that the player should either have a free drop or replay the shot over again from the same spot without penalty?

I doubt it. As far as I know, other than the case referenced above where you have evidence that an outside agency has taken your ball, there are no cases where you get to apply even "known or virtually certain" information about where the ball should be but not apply a penalty in doing so. Local rules need to comply with the basic principles of the other rules of golf, and I doubt that guessing where the ball should be in the fairway meets that requirement.

I'm with Fourputt here, if the course is in the kind of condition where this is happening enough that it really matters, it's just not playable by the rules. If I were the groundskeeper, I'd be worried that people walking across the fairway would be doing serious damage to the turf.

[clubchamp]

We have this problem with some areas of rough when it rains a lot but once it was realized that it was a problem the grounds crew just started marking it. Now in the fairway I just can't see not being able to find an entry point unless it's literally to the point of standing water.

[MEfree]

Originally Posted by dsc123

Can we all agree that this would take the cake for the worst rule in golf?

I understand the basis for a lot of the rules in golf and agree that a lot of them have merit even if I disagree with some of them.  However, I think my biggest problem with the rules is the attempt to have them be all controlling even when common sense might prevail.

I understand why the rules would say the OP`s situation would result in a lost ball, but let me add the following twist-

2 competitors are playing each other in a match play event with the saturated fairways the OP describes.  Given the conditions of the course they mutually agree to waive the lost ball penalty when either of them loses a ball on a shot that appears to land and submerge in the fairway.

I only see two potential issues here-

1.  Handicapping when the rules are not followed.

2.  There is a disagreement regarding a waived or modified rule.

1 typically results in a vanity handicap which is already common and 2 can usually be solved by reverting to the official rules if the competitors can`t agree on the waived rule (although this is likely to lead to some bad blood between the players involved, but this can also happen when one player enforces the official rules on another player).

By disqualifying both competitors, I think the rules of golf are being needlessly inflexible.  In local club match play tournaments, the committee isn`t always there to deal with every possible contingency, so why not give the players involved the ability to mutually agree to a solution.

1-3 . Agreement To Waive Rules

Players must not agree to exclude the operation of any Rule or to waive any penalty incurred.

PENALTY FOR BREACH OF RULE 1-3 :

Match play – Disqualification of both sides ;

Stroke play – Disqualification of competitors concerned.

(Agreeing to play out of turn in stroke play – see Rule 10-2c )

[zeg]

Originally Posted by MEfree

By disqualifying both competitors, I think the rules of golf are being needlessly inflexible.  In local club match play tournaments, the committee isn`t always there to deal with every possible contingency, so why not give the players involved the ability to mutually agree to a solution.

Interesting point, but I am not aware of any sport that permits players, referees, etc, to arbitrarily alter the rules for a single competition (other than Calvinball).

Even if you wanted to allow it, it's also not easy to decide, and from experience in the rules forum, nearly impossible to get general consensus on which rules can be waived "safely." I think the possibility of arguments and disputes is a lot higher if you start allowing agreements to waive rules, and it strikes me as unnecessary.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by MEfree

I understand the basis for a lot of the rules in golf and agree that a lot of them have merit even if I disagree with some of them.  However, I think my biggest problem with the rules is the attempt to have them be all controlling even when common sense might prevail.

I understand why the rules would say the OP`s situation would result in a lost ball, but let me add the following twist-

2 competitors are playing each other in a match play event with the saturated fairways the OP describes.  Given the conditions of the course they mutually agree to waive the lost ball penalty when either of them loses a ball on a shot that appears to land and submerge in the fairway.

I only see two potential issues here-

1.  Handicapping when the rules are not followed.

2.  There is a disagreement regarding a waived or modified rule.

1 typically results in a vanity handicap which is already common and 2 can usually be solved by reverting to the official rules if the competitors can`t agree on the waived rule (although this is likely to lead to some bad blood between the players involved, but this can also happen when one player enforces the official rules on another player).

By disqualifying both competitors, I think the rules of golf are being needlessly inflexible.  In local club match play tournaments, the committee isn`t always there to deal with every possible contingency, so why not give the players involved the ability to mutually agree to a solution.

1-3. Agreement To Waive Rules

Players must not agree to exclude the operation of any Rule or to waive any penalty incurred.

PENALTY FOR BREACH OF RULE 1-3:

Match play – Disqualification of both sides;

Stroke play – Disqualification of competitors concerned.

(Agreeing to play out of turn in stroke play – see Rule 10-2c)

The committee doesn't have the power to waive a rule of golf either, so it's a moot point whether they are there.  Again, if conditions are that bad, they shouldn't be playing a competitive round.  If it's some sort of scheduled match where they are actually required to play on that day, or at that time, then you call a committeeman and explain the situation and get a reschedule.  In my Mens Club match play tournaments, we had a 4 week window in each round to contact our opponent, set up a day to play, and get the match in.  We could play the match at any time up to the deadline, and anyone who put it off to the last day ran the risk of not getting the match in due to weather.  In that case the committee just flipped a coin and the winner moved on in the tournament.  No extensions were given because the window was plenty large enough to give both players opportunity to arrange the match.  This is how most local bracket match play competitions are set up.

There is simply no logical reason to attempt to play a match when the conditions make the course unplayable, and if they play in spite of that, they get what they get.  The rules do not allow unlimited alterations simply to accommodate weather.  Weather is part of the game, and playing in adverse conditions is something to be expected, but when the weather causes such extreme conditions, then the match should be postponed or maybe even played on a different course.