Pace Problem

[Cartboy]

On ‎2‎/‎16‎/‎2016 at 3:53 PM, Bill926 said:

Maybe it's a simple as you get what you pay for.  The muni course I play here is the cheapest in town, its always packed with all ages and skill levels, and the course really isn't that nice at all, so price has to be the reason.  There's no marshals, the starters are volunteers who only checks your receipt and tells you your're next, but expect to play a 5 hr round.

Another course which is a little nicer, charges about $15 more, and you can get around there in a little over 4 hours on a Saturday morning, EXCEPT when they run a really cheap special, and book 7-8 min tee times, by 9 AM there is a 4 group backup on the first tee, and it is going to take 6 hours to play if you didn't get out early.

Then there's a course that charges at least double what the other ones do, nice course always in good shape, always a starter and marshals checking cart numbers, its crowded but not overly, and you can get around in 4 hours or less.  The only special they do is an afternoon shotgun, play as much as you can before dark.

So what is it, less people = better pace, or maybe the people that are willing to pay more are better at keeping up the pace?

The course I'm trying to find something to do about slow play at is pricey, in the highest tier in the area.  It is also highly rated by those who do that sorta thing.

The only way being busy seems to factor in is that more groups get held up, and get upset, because of slow play when it is busy.  Slow groups seem to be slow regardless of how busy the course is.  Perhaps even slower when it is not busy because no one is pushing them.

It is next-to-impossible to speed a slow group up unless there is a faster group right on them.  In that same vein, if a slow group is not holding anyone up, then there is no problem.  I guess that falls back to the Pace Has Priority rule since if there is no faster pace on the course, slow pace has priority.

 

 

 

 

[Phil McGleno]

Did you know there are other threads here @Cartboy?

[Cartboy]

Spieth and McElroy played in 4:35 today.

 

[Cartboy]

16 hours ago, Cartboy said:

Spieth and McElroy played in 4:35 today.

 

Under the guidelines for Rule 6-7, a player is permitted 40 seconds to play a stroke. This 40-second time limit includes the first to play from the teeing ground, from the fairway and from around and on the putting green.

The PGA TOUR rules for pace of play includes the 40-second time limit, but also allows an extra 20 seconds (for a total of 60 seconds) under the following circumstances:
> The first player to play a stroke on a par-3 hole
> The first player to play a second stroke on a par-4 or par-5 hole
> The first player to play a third stroke on a par-5 hole
> The first player to play around the putting green
> The first player to play on a putting green

Under both sets of guidelines, the timing of a stroke on the putting green begins after a player has been allowed a reasonable amount of time to mark, lift, clean and replace his ball, repair his ball mark and other ball marks on his line of putt and remove loose impediments on his line of putt.

Will you be watching your watch as you watch the final round of the Masters today?

 

[Cartboy]

The first really busy day of the year today.  Several big groups of 4 to 6 tee times.

My first two rounds, the first really big group 8:00 tee time was on 4:40 pace, three open holes in front of them.  I spoke to them both times, then turned it over to the Pro/GM, a very-experienced club Pro.

That group finished in 4:40, and everyone seemed quite pleased.

I know deeper back in the pack, after adding up a half-dozen 2-shot gaps, pace would have been 5 1/2.

Oh well.

Oh yeah, when I left we were out of carts, with only replays finishing for the next hour or two, and 12 carts worth of tee times left to arrive.

Guess I'll hear how that went.

Bigger day next Saturday.

 

 

 

 

 

[Cartboy]

Another big day yesterday.  Multiple multiple tee time groups, solid tee sheet until afternoon replays.

The GM did the first marshal lap and I went out for the second round.  There were several shot, 2-shot, and full-hole gaps, which added up.  When I got to 9, there was an older couple and two older guys, and it had taken them 2:40 to there.  All the groups behind them were piled up.When I went back to the slow group, they were just coming off the 9th green.  They offered to skip a hole.  I told them they could play at whatever pace they wanted as long as they let faster groups play through.

I did PR with all the groups back to 4, and told them we were working on it.  Then I went back to where folks had been piled up, and the spacing was much better.

When I left work two hours later, the GM was coming in off a marshal lap.  He was just shaking his head, and said he didn't know how people could play so slow.

It was a beautiful day, we were packed, everyone knew that, and no one was really upset.

Keeping things moving is a tough job.

[David in FL]

25 minutes ago, Cartboy said:

Another big day yesterday.  Multiple multiple tee time groups, solid tee sheet until afternoon replays.

The GM did the first marshal lap and I went out for the second round.  There were several shot, 2-shot, and full-hole gaps, which added up.  When I got to 9, there was an older couple and two older guys, and it had taken them 2:40 to there.  All the groups behind them were piled up.When I went back to the slow group, they were just coming off the 9th green.  They offered to skip a hole.  I told them they could play at whatever pace they wanted as long as they let faster groups play through.

I did PR with all the groups back to 4, and told them we were working on it.  Then I went back to where folks had been piled up, and the spacing was much better.

When I left work two hours later, the GM was coming in off a marshal lap.  He was just shaking his head, and said he didn't know how people could play so slow.

It was a beautiful day, we were packed, everyone knew that, and no one was really upset.

Keeping things moving is a tough job.

The group that had everyone backed up offered to skip a hole to help get back on track, and you didn't take them up on it?!

[Fourputt]

3 hours ago, Cartboy said:

 

Keeping things moving is a tough job.

It is when you don't really have any pace of play policy and the management doesn't really make any effort to improve it.  I'm only thankful that I play on courses that are better run than that.

[Cartboy]

I have not said anything recently because, strangely, Pace has not been a serious issue this year.

For example, today our tee sheet was solid from 7:00 until after 10:00, and I even had to squeeze some times.

When I left at 1:00, all the groups that had finished were under four hours.

No great effort on our part . . . just someone doing a lap a couple of times.

After fifty years of golfing and ten years working golf, I am going to suggest that the biggest factor is who's on the course golfing at any time, more so than who's on the course trying to keep things moving.

I noticed that with the double rounds at the PGA yesterday, the morning rounds actually gained time on the tee sheet, playing under 4 hours in soggy conditions, preferred lie.

 

 

 

 

[Cartboy]

Well, we made it through another season with occasional 5-6 hour rounds.  The primary culprit is golfers founding out too late that they have chosen a course, or tee setting, beyond their skill level.

Interestingly, a person who joined our outside staff four years ago, and who kinda has a problem with what comes out of his mouth, and so said something like, "6 hours rounds, that's why no one plays here," back then to those of us who had been doing our best with our pace problem for three years, now is the one who is ultimately responsible for those lengthy rounds.

What's interesting is how his tune has changed.

Everyone have a nice Winter.

Edited October 30, 2016 by Cartboy

[Cartboy]

Y'all will be happy to know that pace is not much of a problem any more.

We just pretty much ignore it.

😎

 

 

Edited April 3, 2019 by Cartboy

[Vinsk]

9 minutes ago, Cartboy said:

Y'all will be happy to know that pace is not much of a problem any more.

We just pretty much ignore it.

😎

 

 

A sound solution eh?

[Patch]

1 hour ago, Cartboy said:

Y'all will be happy to know that pace is not much of a problem any more.

We just pretty much ignore it.

😎

 

 

That's pretty much what I have been hearing at the two courses I frequent. It's not worth the trouble to enforce the SP issue. The only slow ups they have are on Saturday morning. Sometimes on Sundays. At least 2, or three times a month, Sat/Sun mornings are for leagues anyways. Week days are never a problem. 

[Cartboy]

My 11th year at this course starts in 2 weeks.

[colin007]

Slow play is caused by slow players, who will play slowly even from the correct tees, on short, easy courses, in perfect weather. 

They should be shot on sight.

[chspeed]

13 minutes ago, colin007 said:

Slow play is caused by slow players

Woah. Deep. 😜

14 minutes ago, colin007 said:

 

They should be shot on sight.

Agreed.

[dennyjones]

1 hour ago, colin007 said:

Slow play is caused by slow players, who will play slowly even from the correct tees, on short, easy courses, in perfect weather. 

They should be shot on sight.

most don't have a clue they are slow or if they do they don't care because they paid their money!   

[Piz]

47 minutes ago, dennyjones said:

most don't have a clue they are slow or if they do they don't care because they paid their money!   

Hear! Hear!