2014 Kraft Nabisco Championship Discussion Thread

[iacas]

By the age of 20, Wie had won twice on Tour, so it's not like she totally flamed out. She also was a full-time student while trying to play on Tour. I think it's a little bit disengenuous to say he hasn't lived up to her potential when really she's only been a real Tour player for like two or three years.

Agreed. She turned pro at 15, but then… finished high school and went to Stanford.

Lexi is playing full time.

[k-troop]

By the age of 20, Wie had won twice on Tour, so it's not like she totally flamed out. She also was a full-time student while trying to play on Tour. I think it's a little bit disengenuous to say he hasn't lived up to her potential when really she's only been a real Tour player for like two or three years.

Not disingenuous, and I made no comment about Wie living up to her potential.  I sincerely believe that Wie hasn't lived up to her hype--I'm not distorting any facts or presenting anything out of context.  It's quite likely that Wie is achieving her potential, it's just that her potential is lower than what was expected (at least based on the $10M endorsement deal given to a 15-year old).

[iacas]

If this is all the discussion we can get out of Lexi and Michelle going head to head, I fear for the LPGA.

[boogielicious]

By the age of 20, Wie had won twice on Tour, so it's not like she totally flamed out. She also was a full-time student while trying to play on Tour. I think it's a little bit disengenuous to say he hasn't lived up to her potential when really she's only been a real Tour player for like two or three years.

Agree that criticism on her is a bit much.  Sports media want instant stars that dominate.  I did not hear much about Yani Tseng or Inbee Park after their down turns.

One thing that helped Lexi was playing alongside Michelle in the final.  It think it would have put more pressure on her if Pak or Webb or another multi-major champion was in her group.  Playing with a friend was less pressure.

[Golfingdad]

If this is all the discussion we can get out of Lexi and Michelle going head to head, I fear for the LPGA.

OK, let's talk about the golf swings then.  What's the deal with Lexi and those divots??

She APPEARS to have an extremely steep angle of attack.  What's going on there?

Also, can't get over (having deja vu right now, fyi) the amount of jumping involved in her swing with the driver.  Does you pressure plate contraption only measure percentages in relation to each other?  Or does it also measure actual pressure in pounds or psf?  Because I'd like to know how much weight is actually on the ground at impact.  It looks like almost none on either foot.

[RandallT]

OK, let's talk about the golf swings then.  What's the deal with Lexi and those divots??

She APPEARS to have an extremely steep angle of attack.  What's going on there?

Lexi's approaches were definitely unique. I've never noticed her have so many abbreviated follow-throughs. She had amazing control, and it seemed like she did whatever swing felt totally natural to get the ball to do what she wanted. Body english, whatever it took. She wasn't thinking form of swing at all, just get the ball from spot to spot. I was fascinated to see her finish on each iron (often a wedge), and then watch how close her approach landed. It was like she had total control, even though it was not a textbook swing that people use on the range. I watch LPGA fairly often, and even saw Lexi on that show where Holly Sonders plays a one-on-one round. I don't recall that I've ever noticed her play so much by feel like that.

[9iron]

Lexi's approaches were definitely unique. I've never noticed her have so many abbreviated follow-throughs. She had amazing control, and it seemed like she did whatever swing felt totally natural to get the ball to do what she wanted. Body english, whatever it took. She wasn't thinking form of swing at all, just get the ball from spot to spot. I was fascinated to see her finish on each iron (often a wedge), and then watch how close her approach landed. It was like she had total control, even though it was not a textbook swing that people use on the range. I watch LPGA fairly often, and even saw Lexi on that show where Holly Sonders plays a one-on-one round. I don't recall that I've ever noticed her play so much by feel like that.

Just from watching the swings alone, I thought for sure she must have missed the entire green on some of those shots. Then  the ball lands within 15 feet!

[iacas]

She APPEARS to have an extremely steep angle of attack.  What's going on there?

It's like -10° or so with short irons. Very steep yes.

Also, can't get over (having deja vu right now, fyi) the amount of jumping involved in her swing with the driver.  Does you pressure plate contraption only measure percentages in relation to each other?  Or does it also measure actual pressure in pounds or psf?  Because I'd like to know how much weight is actually on the ground at impact.  It looks like almost none on either foot.

She would probably register 0% on a few driver swings, yes.

It measures the pressure however you want, but the output is often a percentage in relation to each other.

[cipher]

Michelle's swing is kind of amazing as well.  She gets her hips so far open at impact.  Smaug or whatever his name was told us so!

[9iron]

It's like -10° or so with short irons. Very steep yes.

She would probably register 0% on a few driver swings, yes.

It measures the pressure however you want, but the output is often a percentage in relation to each other.

For her to get on her toes like that, wouldn't she need to really push off the ground? Wouldn't she then at some point prior to impact have placed a good amount of force on the ground, or the scale? That action reminds me of Bubba Watson's swing.

[iacas]

For her to get on her toes like that, wouldn't she need to really push off the ground? Wouldn't she then at some point prior to impact have placed a good amount of force on the ground, or the scale? That action reminds me of Bubba Watson's swing.

The 0% was in answer to the "does she get fully off the ground" part.

Yes, she puts force into the ground, as does anyone who jumps.

[9iron]

The 0% was in answer to the "does she get fully off the ground" part.

Yes, she puts force into the ground, as does anyone who jumps.

Makes sense. I actually think Wie has the better golf swing, but I think Thompson is a little better at closing the deal when in contention.

[k-troop]

By the age of 20, Wie had won twice on Tour, so it's not like she totally flamed out. She also was a full-time student while trying to play on Tour. I think it's a little bit disengenuous to say he hasn't lived up to her potential when really she's only been a real Tour player for like two or three years.

Agreed. She turned pro at 15, but then… finished high school and went to Stanford.

Lexi is playing full time.

Just want to point out a few more facts relevant to this.  Wie graduated from Stanford in 2012; she's been a full-time professional golfer for nearly two years.  Lexi earned LPGA status for the 2012 season as well.  So while Lexi has had LPGA status and a full-time schedule for about 4 months longer than Wie, Wie still has six years more experience of competing at that level.

Additionally, @jbishop15 points out that Wie had 2 wins by age 20.  Four years later, Wie still has only 2 wins.  By your logic she should be winning now since she's at it full time.  She's not.

I don't think it's much of a stretch to say that Wie's career has been a disappointment, and Lexi is achieving what we all expected Wie to do.  At any rate I'm talking about lady golf, so they're both doing something right.

[iacas]

I don't think it's much of a stretch to say that Wie's career has been a disappointment, and Lexi is achieving what we all expected Wie to do.

Michelle finished second. And has other top threes in majors too. It's not like she's nowhere to be found. She's having a good year. I'm not terribly disappointed. If you are, that's you. :-)

[ghalfaire]

I don't think it's much of a stretch to say that Wie's career has been a disappointment, and Lexi is achieving what we all expected Wie to do.  At any rate I'm talking about lady golf, so they're both doing something right.

I was disappointed that Michelle lost for no reason other than I was rooting for her.  But realistically she just ran into a buzz saw with Lexi.  Michelle shot one under par on the last day of a major championship, that isn't exactly choking or blowing up.  Lexi on the other hand had a hot putter and shot four under.  Since there is no defense in golf this happens to all of us including the professionals.  When your opponent is playing lights out there just isn't anything you can do about it but smile and congratulate them on the 18th.

[RandallT]

I was disappointed that Michelle lost for no reason other than I was rooting for her.  But realistically she just ran into a buzz saw with Lexi.  Michelle shot one under par on the last day of a major championship, that isn't exactly choking or blowing up.  Lexi on the other hand had a hot putter and shot four under.  Since there is no defense in golf this happens to all of us including the professionals.  When your opponent is playing lights out there just isn't anything you can do about it but smile and congratulate them on the 18th.

Yep. Only 3 players had a better final round than Michelle. One of those 3 was Lexi, who was simply in a zone. Lexi earned this one, flat out. Lexi's an exciting risk taker and it worked out this time. Maybe another day, at another major venue, the steady, consistent, skillful round of Michelle's would have prevailed. I had a blast watching them contrast each other. It set up an interesting debate if Michelle should have adjusted her strategy. Arguably, Michelle had her chances but just didn't convert on the greens.