Rio's Olympic golf course in turmoil

[newtogolf]

I thought this originally, but now I'm thinking they're just avid environmentalists down there. It doesn't sound like someone is looking to get paid off, but rather the people fighting the course are seriously upset it was built on part of a nature reserve or something.

It's possible it's not about money in which case the country will have to offer up land someplace else to appease the environmentalists (assuming there is any available).  We had a similar battle here on Long Island and that's how it was resolved.

[billchao]

Another update:

Quote:

SAO PAULO -- A Rio de Janeiro judge has rejected prosecutors' request to halt construction at the Olympic golf course, clearing a major hurdle in the sport's return to the games after a 112-year absence.

It was the second-consecutive legal defeat by prosecutors who claim the course is being built without the necessary environmental impact studies and other legal requirements.

Another judge had previously ordered changes to the course's layout to attend to the environmental concerns, but also denied the request to put construction on hold. A work stoppage at this point could keep the course from being completed in time for the games.

It would seem that it's over. The cynic in me says that those who wanted the golf course completed (politicians, etc.) made it happen and this decision has less to do with the environment and the law as it does with politics.

Quote:

" If after the course is finalized there is proof that there was a breach of environmental norms, the necessary actions against those responsible can still be taken," the judge said.

[Abu3baid]

Another update: It would seem that it's over. The cynic in me says that those who wanted the golf course completed (politicians, etc.) made it happen and this decision has less to do with the environment and the law as it does with politics. :doh:

Yes the necessary actions can be taken, ie fine them into bankruptcy! The judge in this case as you alluded really didn't have a choice in the matter.. If he wasn't paid off by the politicians he was most likely persuaded in other ways..

[phan52]

I find it amusing that anybody is making an issue out of the environmental impact of a golf course in Brazil considering the daily habitat destruction and the decades long degradation of the rain forests.

[dkolo]

I find it amusing that anybody is making an issue out of the environmental impact of a golf course in Brazil considering the daily habitat destruction and the decades long degradation of the rain forests.

Well, I think that the cavalier attitude they demonstrate towards environmental regulations in light of their inconvenience in the instant case is representative of the bigger issue there.

[RussUK]

ill-informed American journalists?

Find me a single one written by a British journalist with an appreciation of what's involved that says the same. It just sounds like idle journalist chatter to be honest. Articles to write etc

Look the Prime Minister has categorically ruled it out, so too has Sebastian Coe explaining that we've long passed the time where by we could have done it, and so too has the Mayor (albeit with supreme irony the person who has aspirations to be the next Mayor of London also happens to be the proposed tenant of the Olympic stadium - Karen Brady, albeit she doesn't own West Ham United). The Olympic stadium is currently being converted into a football ground

We could probably take the events (albeit the swimmers might have to make do with the Thames) but quite where we're going to get an olympic village and media centre from I don't know? They'd have to give it us tomorrow, (and a lumpy blank cheque too) in order for us to stand a chance. I suppose we could close down the university of east London (or whatever its called) and turn that into an Olympic village?

No one - and I mean not a single person in a place of authority nor body invovled, is remotely discussing this. It's just not an issue. The last time it cropped up was about 6 months ago when we ruled it out. If London is being kept in a state of readiness, then no one seems to be taking the dust sheets off (quiet opposite). I'm not even convicned we'd take it now. The capacity for a national humiliation is greater than being seen to come to the rescue...... mind you, there could be one possibilty. We're just entering the electoral cycle.... Londonm will be a key battleground in what could be a close contest

I can certainly accept that a politcians no is different to the rest of ours if they think there's an electoral dividend in it

Yes, they may be converting the stadium to a football ground with a stipulation of keeping the capacity to hold athletics events. There would be no issue with changing this to full Track and Field spec.

All the other venues are still there such as the Velodrome, Aquatics centre and the  Rowing venue. Golf is well catered for as well with many high end courses geared up for big events.

I can see the only stumbling block being financial. Can we really affor to run another olympics this soon?

I never agreed with Rio getting the Olympics or the world cup due to the political cliamte the often seem to have. There were stories of corrupt referees during south Amercican cup matches against Argentinian teams and for them to get the Olympics just seems to smack of a few back handers being given out.

If i were David Cameron or, heven forbid, Boris Johnson i would want to go for it. Only issue is we'd have to wheel some of the old celbrities back out for the opening Ceremony

[billchao]

Yes the necessary actions can be taken, ie fine them into bankruptcy! The judge in this case as you alluded really didn't have a choice in the matter.. If he wasn't paid off by the politicians he was most likely persuaded in other ways..

Of course if there are environmental issues, taking punitive action against those responsible after the fact would do very little for the actual environment. [quote name="phan52" url="/t/76985/rios-olympic-golf-course-in-turmoil/30#post_1119824"]I find it amusing that anybody is making an issue out of the environmental impact of a golf course in Brazil considering the daily habitat destruction and the decades long degradation of the rain forests. [/quote]There is opposition to the golf course and subsequent real estate development around it, too. I believe people feel there is impropriety there, especially considering the corruption allegations occurring in Brazil. Here's an article from another source on the subject: [URL]http://riotimesonline.com/brazil-news/rio-sports/controversy-over-olympic-golf-course-continues-in-rio/#[/URL]

[newtogolf]

Of course if there are environmental issues, taking punitive action against those responsible after the fact would do very little for the actual environment.

There is opposition to the golf course and subsequent real estate development around it, too. I believe people feel there is impropriety there, especially considering the corruption allegations occurring in Brazil.

Here's an article from another source on the subject: http://riotimesonline.com/brazil-news/rio-sports/controversy-over-olympic-golf-course-continues-in-rio/#

I think the real issue is the corruption surrounding the Brazilian government and embezzlement of revenue from their oil production.  The significant drop in oil prices has left Brazil in serious financial straits to the point were they are in great risk of defaulting on bonds for Petrobras and their other government issued bonds.

Brazil is not far behind Greece in terms of a financial collapse which has to make building a golf course tough given all the sub contractors are probably requiring payment in advance.

[Ferguson]

Remind me to have our hazardous waste sent to Orlando!  :-) It is surprising that this issue comes to light so late.  Having done work in Brazil, their regulations are very specific.

There is a strong mood of protectionism - land is on par with oil. Was your work in the public or private sector?

[boogielicious]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boogielicious

Remind me to have our hazardous waste sent to Orlando!

It is surprising that this issue comes to light so late.  Having done work in Brazil, their regulations are very specific.

There is a strong mood of protectionism - land is on par with oil. Was your work in the public or private sector?

Private.  Brazil regulatory systems can be very complicated and cumbersome.  I have not dealt with environmental regulation, but if they are anything like the commercial regulations, I can see why it would be difficult.

[Ferguson]

Private.  Brazil regulatory systems can be very complicated and cumbersome.  I have not dealt with environmental regulation, but if they are anything like the commercial regulations, I can see why it would be difficult.

Mine was in the public sector, and touched the environmental. A literal nightmare, almost like dealing with the IRS. There is a strong desire to bring in multinational exposure via tax incentives but in every single document whether it be for a piece of manufacturing equipment or even a desk chair, these words are used: prices, regulation, taxes, quality standards, environmental impact, and my favorite: Mitigation and Management. They want 60% of power to emanate from renewables. The list goes on. The Olympics seem to bring a level of turmoil to any city, but it all gets worked out in the end I suppose.

[boogielicious]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boogielicious

Private.  Brazil regulatory systems can be very complicated and cumbersome.  I have not dealt with environmental regulation, but if they are anything like the commercial regulations, I can see why it would be difficult.

Mine was in the public sector, and touched the environmental. A literal nightmare, almost like dealing with the IRS. There is a strong desire to bring in multinational exposure via tax incentives but in every single document whether it be for a piece of manufacturing equipment or even a desk chair, these words are used: prices, regulation, taxes, quality standards, environmental impact, and my favorite: Mitigation and Management. They want 60% of power to emanate from renewables. The list goes on.

The Olympics seem to bring a level of turmoil to any city, but it all gets worked out in the end I suppose.

I would hope that the course remains sustainable after the games.  I would hate to see it just go fallow like some Olympic stadiums have in other countries.

[Ferguson]

I would hope that the course remains sustainable after the games.  I would hate to see it just go fallow like some Olympic stadiums have in other countries.

I hate to say it but you know as well as I do that golf course is going to fall apart in 2-3 years without a plan. That’s a shame. Sarajevo, Athens and Beijing are a mess. All those resources lay in waste. And that’s what I don’t understand about the city selection process. Why not create structures for multiuse, maybe for local municipalities, museums and schools? Too much to ask.

[billchao]

http://www.golf.com/courses-and-travel/rio-mayor-defends-olympic-golf-course-dismisses-corruption-allegations

Quote:

"Rio City Hall and I personally are very conscious that we are going to have to explain and re-explain (things) and prove ourselves more than we would have to if we were staging the London Olympics, for example," he (Mayor Eduardo Paes) said.

Paes also insisted that while some land from the nature reserve was bulldozed to make way for the course's grassy knolls, because the lion's share of the terrain used to be a sand quarry, the course has actually increased the amount of native plant life in the area.

"Does this look like an environmental crime?" he exclaimed, arms akimbo, as he led reporters over the course's spongy grass. Earlier, Paes projected aerial photos from the 1980s apparently showing what's now the golf course dotted with concrete structures.

Environmentalists contend that hardy subtropical vegetation had since retaken the area and that before the bulldozers descended it had become home to several endangered species, including species of butterflies and frogs.

"He (Paes) thinks that all green's the same," said Jean Carlos Novaes, a member of the Golfe Para Quem (Golf For Whom) group that has been protesting outside the site for months. "But non-native grass is just not the same thing as the native ecosystem."

It's getting all "he said, she said," now. I think I'm forming a pretty good picture of the whole controversy.

[RussUK]

http://www.golf.com/courses-and-travel/rio-mayor-defends-olympic-golf-course-dismisses-corruption-allegations

It's getting all "he said, she said," now. I think I'm forming a pretty good picture of the whole controversy.

All it needs now is the whole "my dad's bigger than your dad" and it'll be like being back at school.

The SAS use the 6 P's, "Perfect Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance". I get the feeling the Rio organisers should have used this mantra themselves. For a sport as large as golf to return to the Olympics all the legal stuff should have been sorte before they even planned the course