On average, how many strokes does your mental game cost you per round?

[pstvev]

Back when I was playing a lot and scoring relatively well, my answer would have been 6 to 9.

Amusingly, now that I am a more mature golfer, but also a worse golfer, my answer is 3 to 5.

I am curious what everyone thinks of their mental game, and especially curious what the single-digit or better handicappers would answer...

[billchao]

Define "mental game" please.

[Lihu]

I voted 0, because I play equally bad under pressure or for fun.

Seriously, though. My typical hole (par 4 or 5) is 2 shot approach, then screw up somewhere 20 yards and in and 100 yards and in on par 5. The chips that I mess up are generally not taking my time setting up the shot, and the putts are generally because I don't read the greens carefully enough and am either too aggressive or wimpy on my first putts on horrific GIR approaches that leave with 50+ foot putts. My typical rounds end up being in the 10 to 14 over range, with rare lucky short easy rounds 5-7 over if I hit greens better. When I don't make the proper decision on how and where to make my shots, it could easily be 20+ over.

From this, I suppose you could deduce that mental game costs me 6 to 15 shots. One qualifier, is that I am still a relative novice in terms of the number of years playing this game, so this attitude might change?

[turtleback]

Define "mental game" please.

I voted 0, because I play equally bad under pressure or for fun.

I don't think mental game is primarily concerned with pressure it is decision making.  It is when you know that a recovery shot is unlikely but you try it anyway.  It is when you know that you cannot reach a par 5 in 2 but challenge the water anyway and go into the drink.  Basically, when you are getting the risk-reward decision wrong.  Of curse some of these bad decisions can be due to pressure, but I would not consider pressure a primary component of mental errors - more of a possible contributing factor.

With that said as to what I am considering, I would guess from 0 to 6.  My errors tend to be focused more in the execution area.

[rehmwa]

all of them

[billchao]

I don't think mental game is primarily concerned with pressure it is decision making.  It is when you know that a recovery shot is unlikely but you try it anyway.  It is when you know that you cannot reach a par 5 in 2 but challenge the water anyway and go into the drink.  Basically, when you are getting the risk-reward decision wrong.  Of curse some of these bad decisions can be due to pressure, but I would not consider pressure a primary component of mental errors - more of a possible contributing factor. With that said as to what I am considering, I would guess from 0 to 6.  My errors tend to be focused more in the execution area.

I was thinking something along those lines, but then it's still hard to measure. For example, if your risk/reward decision leads you into a hazard, does that mean you made a bad decision? After all, an 80% success rate still means you fail one out of every five tries. The reverse is also true, you make a bad decision and got lucky. Still a bad decision. Most of my errors are related to execution, as well.

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by billchao

Define "mental game" please.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

I voted 0, because I play equally bad under pressure or for fun.

I don't think mental game is primarily concerned with pressure it is decision making.  It is when you know that a recovery shot is unlikely but you try it anyway.  It is when you know that you cannot reach a par 5 in 2 but challenge the water anyway and go into the drink.  Basically, when you are getting the risk-reward decision wrong.  Of course some of these bad decisions can be due to pressure, but I would not consider pressure a primary component of mental errors - more of a possible contributing factor.

With that said as to what I am considering, I would guess from 0 to 6.  My errors tend to be focused more in the execution area.

Yeah, I added more of an explanation to my statement. Some days, I just make the worst possible decisions and end up shooting 97, and on days when there are no real decisions to be made I can shoot really well. Definitely, lack of experience in making proper decisions. LSW helps, but it still takes some understanding to really appreciate what it states about decision maps and such. I've had many good golfers tell me that golf is a game of decisions, I suppose it's really time start to learn that phase.

[turtleback]

all of them

So, are you saying that the real mental error is playing golf in the first place?

[rehmwa]

So, are you saying that the real mental error is playing golf in the first place?

or perhaps I'm chronically 'mental' all the time - thus the obsession with the hobby

either way works for me

[rkim291968]

I voted 3 to 5 but I may have a wider definition of mental game and I may be making more mistakes than 3 - 5.  E.g, in the last round, I "lined up" a short putt of about 6 feet - I use a straight line ball mark that points to the direction I want to hit to.   I do this when a short putt has a subtle break to negotiate.   But when I stood over the ball, optically, I didn't see the ball lining up to the correct path.   I should have trusted by initial ball line up.  Instead, I made adjustment on the fly to hit the ball right of the initial line.   Yup, I missed the short putt to the right of the hole.   To me, that's a mental mistake, not trusting my ability to line up the ball.

Hitting a drive on a short par 4 when a sure 5i will do the job is another mental mistake I repeat too often.   This happens when I have been hitting good drives in that round.  I mistakenly think it is going to carry over to the short par 4 hole and for no other reason than "I can do this," I grabbed the driver and hit it into a tall grass where rattlesnakes await.  Lost ball and a penalty stroke later, I grab my 5i and hit a perfect drive down the middle.

[Golfingdad]

I was thinking something along those lines, but then it's still hard to measure. For example, if your risk/reward decision leads you into a hazard, does that mean you made a bad decision? After all, an 80% success rate still means you fail one out of every five tries.

The reverse is also true, you make a bad decision and got lucky. Still a bad decision.

Most of my errors are related to execution, as well.

Good post.  I agree with this.  I say as long as you have committed to the shot, then you have made the "correct" decision and your mental game is not hurting you.  (Unless you're an idiot and are trying to reach an island par 5 green from 290 or something.)

By and large, I'd say that as long as you make a decision that you are capable of and completely commit to it, then you're all good.  You can now put the blame entirely on execution.

But, for me, there are still those times when my head gets a little "swirly."  I can't quite make up my mind so I go into the shot wondering if I should be putting instead of chipping.  Or hitting iron off the tee on the short par 4 instead of driver.  Or vice versa.  Again, it's not that either decision is right or wrong, its being indecisive that is wrong.

For that reason, I'd probably say that I probably lose somewhere near a shot (maybe not quite, maybe between zero and 1) per round to the "mental game."

[Lihu]

Agree with @billchao in regard to "execution". Unless you're scratch, execution is the probably the source of the errors. However, the mental part might be more how you react to the bad shot, and possibly cost you a lot more shots from bad decisions. This is why a potential bogey often leads to doubles or triple for me at least.

For example, on days that I shoot well, even a topped drive ends up with a second shot that could simply make up the distance or just puts me back into play. On days when I shoot terrible, a bad tee shot might end up with 2 PW (or punches) out of the trees because my first PW was trying to "make up" the yardage lost from the tee shot to supposedly reduce the loss to a bogey or if I try to "got for it" to keep a par. This invariably leads to a potential double or triple. Whereas, a better strategy might have been to tap it out then try to make up for the distance loss with a longer club from the fairway or something like that.

[Big C]

I don't think mental game is primarily concerned with pressure it is decision making.  It is when you know that a recovery shot is unlikely but you try it anyway.  It is when you know that you cannot reach a par 5 in 2 but challenge the water anyway and go into the drink.

I've always looked at it the opposite way. My decision making is a course management skill that can be improved with time and practice. It allows for explanation and reflection after a round (why did I try that shot? Here are the factors that I considered when deciding whether to chip or putt, etc.)

In my view, the mental game is more of an intangible factor. My mental game is the ability to play my best golf under pressure, to focus after bad holes/shots and not compound my errors due to frustration.

The mental game is the reason that one 9 handicap can go out and consistently shoot high 70's/low 80's rounds in tournaments, while another 9 handicap will often flirt with 90 in his pressure rounds. Unlike decision making, the mental game failures cannot be explained succinctly. "I was hitting the ball so well all month, then the big tournament comes around and my swing falls apart," is a common lament of someone with a poor mental game. Because it defies explanation and analysis, it is incredibly frustrating and a poor mental game leads a golfer to get very down on himself, label himself a "choker", etc.

Back to the original question, my answer is 1 to 2 shots. I still feel pressure during important rounds and still make some bad swings because of it. But my focus and concentration tends to improve during important rounds as well. I have shot some very good tournament scores during the past year. Two years ago, my answer would have been closer to 6 to 9. I have felt first hand the frustration of a golfer with a bad mental game. Shooting a 76 in your casual rounds and following it up with a 94 in your next tournament is no fun whatsoever.

[Golfingdad]

Shooting a 76 in your casual rounds and following it up with a 94 in your next tournament is no fun whatsoever.

What about shooting a 76 in a tournament and then following that up with a 101 in a different tournament????

[Big C]

What about shooting a 76 in a tournament and then following that up with a 101 in a different tournament????

Clearly the sign of a schizophrenic golfer. This person obviously has severe mental issues and is quite possibly a danger to himself and others.

In all seriousness though, sometimes you just gotta say "that's golf." Even those with great mental games aren't immune from the occasional stinker now and then. It's generally over the span of 5 or more tournament rounds where the trends start to reveal themselves, IMO.

[iacas]

I voted 0.

[saevel25]

I voted zero. I follow Lowest Score Wins in terms of game planning and use aimpoint for green reading. I don't see much else in terms of the mental aspect I need to worry about.

[billchao]

Hmm. Ok, so I never try a shot unless I'm confident that I can hit it, I'm not prone to emotional outbursts on the course, and I "forget" shots both good and bad rather easily so they don't cloud my mind and judgment, either. Add in the fact that I tend to do slightly better under pressure, and I'm practically a mental game god. :-P