Taking good balls from range buckets

[Sante TwoGloves]

I was going to another range earlier in the season a lot where the owner lives 2 hours away. It's a honor system with a slot where you put your money and grab a bucket sitting on a shelf outside his shack. He comes to town once a week to collect the balls, make new buckets and grab the cash. He was there one day I went. Good guy. Took lessons from him 30 years ago. He was pissed. He said some kids must have had some fun at his place that week. He figured they hit about $85 of balls without paying. Never shorted him once when I went. I did take a few slazengers but replaced them with some balls I found a few weeks later. Hitting buckets without paying? Now that is some stealing there. Damn kids:-)

[Sante TwoGloves]

Yes, it's wrong to take things that don't belong to you.  No matter how you try to justify it to us or yourself it's stealing.  I am amazed that some of you don't seem to grasp the concept that if something doesn't belong to you and you take it, it's stealing. I get that there are different degrees of theft and stealing a golf ball from a range is probably at the bottom of the list for horrible crimes, but how can you call it anything but theft?

But if the range never actually owned them to begin with then it's just like taking a lost or abandoned ball at the course.

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by newtogolf

Yes, it's wrong to take things that don't belong to you.  No matter how you try to justify it to us or yourself it's stealing.  I am amazed that some of you don't seem to grasp the concept that if something doesn't belong to you and you take it, it's stealing.

I get that there are different degrees of theft and stealing a golf ball from a range is probably at the bottom of the list for horrible crimes, but how can you call it anything but theft?

But if the range never actually owned them to begin with then it's just like taking a lost or abandoned ball at the course.

That's also not a good thing to do. It's just not worth the risk of taking someone's ball.

[Sante TwoGloves]

I found two balls today just cross the ob line behind a green I rolled off the back of. Clearly they were abandoned. Picked them up and gave them to my buddy for his shag bag. Stolen from the course? Nah...bringing new life to a lost ball that is just going to rot away unless some other eco conscious person like me comes along and picks up the litter.

[Lihu]

I found two balls today just cross the ob line behind a green I rolled off the back of. Clearly they were abandoned. Picked them up and gave them to my buddy for his shag bag. Stolen from the course? Nah...bringing new life to a lost ball that is just going to rot away unless some other eco conscious person like me comes along and picks up the litter.

What if all the lost balls were resold by the course to help pay for youth programs and such?

[Sante TwoGloves]

What if all the lost balls were resold by the course to help pay for youth programs and such?

In that case I would give them the balls I find and save them the trouble. When I see that sign posted by the course that is exactly what I would do. Until then I feel I am helping them AND the environment by cleaning up after those littering golfers.

[newtogolf]

But if the range never actually owned them to begin with then it's just like taking a lost or abandoned ball at the course.

As @iacas stated, if the range goes through the trouble of collecting them and cleaning them then they are the ranges property.  You're analogy of lost balls on a course makes no sense, you are stealing these balls from a bucket that you paid money to rent from the range, how can there be a question of who owns them?

[Sante TwoGloves]

As @iacas stated, if the range goes through the trouble of collecting them and cleaning them then they are the ranges property.  You're analogy of lost balls on a course makes no sense, you are stealing these balls from a bucket that you paid money to rent from the range, how can there be a question of who owns them?

That's my point. The range is using their manpower, equipment, etc. On balls that they did not buy or plan to use. You are doing them a favor by removing these balls.

[Sante TwoGloves]

What ranges don't do is sort the balls. I went to one range and they had buckets full of balls they just collected ready to go into machines and buckets. they were marked all the same, all identical. Not one other different kind of ball that I could see in the bunch. You think that range owner wants to see some scuffed prov1 s in his mix of new range balls he just spent his hard earned money on? Think about the range owners in this too my friend.

[Pretzel]

My golf course has the employees specifically separate any non-range balls when they pick the range, and thus doesn't mind when people keep non-range balls.

I personally take out balls from the range baskets when I purchase them at the local courses. I have been told to do so, and told specifcally that it is okay, by the head pro at one of the local courses (who also holds authority at the other courses since they are all city-owned). If the courses that I play/practice do not view it as theft, then I do not view it as theft either.

I will say though that I don't do this on unfamiliar courses. When the policy has not been specifically outlined, it really isn't right to take them.The courses has found the balls on their range, which is no different than you finding a ball on the course, and therefore owns them in the same way that you own balls that you find way out in the weeds. You are taking their property without permission in that case. The courses I have played just happen to have a policy in which they allow golfers to take balls that they find in their buckets that aren't range balls.

[iacas]

That's my point. The range is using their manpower, equipment, etc. On balls that they did not buy or plan to use. You are doing them a favor by removing these balls.

No, you aren't.

[Pretzel]

That's my point. The range is using their manpower, equipment, etc. On balls that they did not buy or plan to use. You are doing them a favor by removing these balls.

Let me use this same logic really fast.

Pretend that you own a field in which you grow hay. One day, you come to your hay field to find that a stranger accidentally spilled a bunch of seed for more hay in your field, causing more hay to grow than you anticipated. Since you already had a hay field, the added costs associated with growing more hay are completely inconsequential (in fact, you would have planted that much hay in the first place if it didn't cost more to buy more seed). When cut, dried, and baled you end up with 500 bales instead of your expected 400 bales.

In this hypothetical scenario, would you be upset if a stranger came up and started to take the extra 100 bales of hay with the excuse, "Well, this hay wasn't really yours anyways to begin with and it just cost you extra money, so I'm doing you a favor by taking it off your hands!"

[Sante TwoGloves]

My golf course has the employees specifically separate any non-range balls when they pick the range, and thus doesn't mind when people keep non-range balls. I personally take out balls from the range baskets when I purchase them at the local courses. I have been told to do so, and told specifcally that it is okay, by the head pro at one of the local courses (who also holds authority at the other courses since they are all city-owned). If the courses that I play/practice do not view it as theft, then I do not view it as theft either. I will say though that I don't do this on unfamiliar courses. When the policy has not been specifically outlined, it really isn't right to take them.The courses has found the balls on their range, which is no different than you finding a ball on the course, and therefore owns them in the same way that you own balls that you find way out in the weeds. You are taking their property without permission in that case. The courses I have played just happen to have a policy in which they allow golfers to take balls that they find in their buckets that aren't range balls.

In other words Employees are paid to sort when they could be doing something more productive or off the clock completely raising the overhead of the range...costing them money when people clutter their balls with balls they didn't pay for or want in their selection for their customers. No wonder they tell you to take the ones you want. It saves them money. Hmmm...

[flopster]

I think the people who think it's okay to cherry pick premium balls out of a range ball bucket should just go in the golf shop and tell the clerk behind the counter " I hooked a brand new ProV in the range today so is it okay I rifle through the range balls till I find something comparable? I think you will find out real quick if it's okay or not, I honestly don't know what will be said though, some may say go ahead and search away while others may say tough luck.

[Ernest Jones]

In other words Employees are paid to sort when they could be doing something more productive or off the clock completely raising the overhead of the range...costing them money when people clutter their balls with balls they didn't pay for or want in their selection for their customers. No wonder they tell you to take the ones you want. It saves them money. Hmmm...

Are you an acrobat?

[Lihu]

My golf course has the employees specifically separate any non-range balls when they pick the range, and thus doesn't mind when people keep non-range balls. I personally take out balls from the range baskets when I purchase them at the local courses. I have been told to do so, and told specifcally that it is okay, by the head pro at one of the local courses (who also holds authority at the other courses since they are all city-owned). If the courses that I play/practice do not view it as theft, then I do not view it as theft either. I will say though that I don't do this on unfamiliar courses. When the policy has not been specifically outlined, it really isn't right to take them.The courses has found the balls on their range, which is no different than you finding a ball on the course, and therefore owns them in the same way that you own balls that you find way out in the weeds. You are taking their property without permission in that case. The courses I have played just happen to have a policy in which they allow golfers to take balls that they find in their buckets that aren't range balls.

I was told the same thing by three ranges around here, but in retrospect I feel like there should be a bin as one other poster mentioned for us to place the balls for either youth programs or other things. The issue with the range sorting through them is that it takes too much time for the few people who work the course. They purchase 10,000 balls at a time and it seems like they buy at least once or twice a month. The range is nearly blanketed with range balls in the evenings. We have unlimited range balls, and many people take advantage of this. The range surmises that most people will stick with the official 2 large buckets a day at each location. I comply with the official policy, as I don't have 8 hours to hit balls. Plus, it really gets boring after the second bucket, and by then I want to go to work. As I hit a lot of balls, I always find a lot of balls. I usually set them aside because if I took every single ball I found I would have bucket fulls In the 3 months I started using the range again. I purchased only 5*** dozen brand new ProV1x, and 2 onion bags of really crappy balls from Golfsmith and used range balls for my net area I bought for something like $2 per pound. Even with 4 golfers in the family, there is no way we will ever use them up. None of us really lose balls where we play, and I've lost something like 8 balls at places where losing balls is very common place over the last 6 rounds around the world. Simply put, no one really needs to collect balls from the ranges, especially since they will just sit in a garage. ***I also buy the Golfsmith 50 bucket of top grade used ones and from some local shops for $1. Hit once only type balls.

[Sante TwoGloves]

That's why the smart ranges let you take the non range balls. They don't need or want the expense of cutting, drying, and baling those extra bales of hay they didn't plant and budget for. Who wants a plot of beautiful new range balls with scuffed prov1 s mixed in. They are like weeds that need to be removed.

[turtleback]

maybe we should start collecting the tees we find that arent broken at the range and bring them to the front counter? :)   seriously, there are greater crimes. who is completely honest on their taxes raise your hand.

So it is OK to steal so long as there is a bigger crime that you are not committing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tefunk

I am. Anyone who isn't, is stealing from the rest of the honest taxpayers

You mean that business trip you took to Pebble Beach was a legitimate deduction?  Good for you. Sometimes I order a second plate of all you can eat pasta when im full then ask for a doggie bag two fork fulls later.

Amazing how people who do dishonest things assume everyone does.

So I will admit I was wrong, I asked my lawyer friend if taking the balls from the range would be theft. He used to work as a public defender in Maryland, and he said technically yes it would be theft, because the balls would be owned by the range. However, if there weren't markings on the ball to signify they were range balls, as soon as they were hit, they would be finders keepers.

If you do get arrested for taking a ball I'd suggest a different lawyer.   I only took a Business Law class and his reasoning is clearly incoherent.  UNLESS he is saying it will be finders keepers because there is no "proof".  Lawyers sometimes get confused between the Truth and what is provable.  I missed the part in that business law class that says that your property is your property only if you have your name on it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ernest Jones

Some of us care about the society we live in and raise our children in.

First step stealing a pro v1, next stop shooting up a shopping mall?

Good for you!

There ya go  Any crime you commit that does not lead to shooting up a mall is OK.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mchepp

This is an interesting discussion. The range I grew up on only had "real" balls. Most had a red line but at least more that a third did not. That range most assuredly would say you stole from them.

Overall my issue with this is that people are being very sanctimonious over a very trivial matter.

Ah, the "it is too small to count as stealing" rationalization.

It's not what you know, it's what you can prove? Lol

You must have been talking to @jsgolfer 's lawyer friend.

My takeaway, is this really a problem that any driving range cares about? Am I losing sleep on this? Nope.

Just as a business case, if I buy a 10,000 range balls, am I really going to be concerned with some found balls from wayward shots. Probably not. And if they are I probably won't be hitting balls there anytime soon. Just saying.

So it someone has a lot of something, THAT makes it OK to take some

What ranges don't do is sort the balls. I went to one range and they had buckets full of balls they just collected ready to go into machines and buckets. they were marked all the same, all identical. Not one other different kind of ball that I could see in the bunch. You think that range owner wants to see some scuffed prov1 s in his mix of new range balls he just spent his hard earned money on? Think about the range owners in this too my friend.

I tried that with my bank.  Why would they want those folded wrinkled bills mixed in with those nice fresh crisp ones straight from the mint?   I'm doing them a favor if I take those worn bills off their hands.

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It is all rationalizations.  Taking a ball is hardly the Crime of the Century.  Very few things are.  But the fact that it is on the trivial end of the crime scale doesn't mean it isn't stealing.