Jordan Spieth's Slow Play

[Mr. Desmond]

23 minutes ago, tdiii said:

Yes, but no counter to the more important point that Spieth played the same course in the same conditions as all his competitors but took 15 minutes longer. 

The score in itself and your description of Na's disgust at his play is the counterpoint.

But I think others have made valid points ... Spieth is deliberate, has the lead. 15 minutes -- less than one minute per hole. Plus it was a bit of army golf from what I understand from both.

After watching Friday's circus, I was on the range in the afternoon.

Edited April 10, 2016 by Mr. Desmond

[newtogolf]

3 minutes ago, tdiii said:

Are you deliberately ignoring my comment that I like the kid a lot?  It is not an additional 15 minutes.  It is an additioal 15 minutes on top of an already very slow pace.  And the entire world is watching with a lot of golfers emulating this crap. 
 

The pace of those in front of him can't be blamed on Spieth, so all you can put on him is 15 minutes, let's also remember both him and Rory were hitting out of the trees a lot which takes more time than a shot off the fairway.  

Pro's can't be held responsible for what muni golfers do, we all know about ready golf and we're not playing on television for millions so there's no reason for our rounds to take as long as a pro's ever.  

[tdiii]

Just now, newtogolf said:

The pace of those in front of him can't be blamed on Spieth, so all you can put on him is 15 minutes, let's also remember both him and Rory were hitting out of the trees a lot which takes more time than a shot off the fairway.  

 

Oh, so none of the players in front of them were hitting out of the trees?

[Shindig]

18 hours ago, tdiii said:

. . . with all the s l o o o o w w w play, he's dead to me. 

I would love to watch today's round with you.  Will you freak out when a zombie is featured on TV regularly?

[Mr. Desmond]

1 hour ago, tdiii said:

Oh, so none of the players in front of them were hitting out of the trees?

I don't think most want to invalidate your point - Spieth is deliberate. I think the reason many don't say "he's dead to me" with humor is the entertainment value of watching the Player-Caddie interaction. The consistency of the interaction is unusual and gives you insight into the Player. If we must endure another 45 seconds per hole, I believe it's worth it.

I mean, it's not as emotional as Stevie breaking a camera for Tiger. With Spieth, we learn a bit of what's going on in the player's head.

[iacas]

4 hours ago, Mr. Desmond said:

I don't think most want to invalidate your point - Spieth is deliberate. I think the reason many don't say "he's dead to me" with humor is the entertainment value of watching the Player-Caddie interaction. The consistency of the interaction is unusual and gives you insight into the Player. If we must endure another 45 seconds per hole, I believe it's worth it.

I mean, it's not as emotional as Stevie breaking a camera for Tiger. With Spieth, we learn a bit of what's going on in the player's head.

Oh the lengths to which you'll stretch to defend someone you've decided to defend…

Just hit the damn ball. Figure stuff out faster. Don't fidget. Don't take three minutes to read a putt.

Play faster. I like Jordan Spieth just fine, but this part of him is terrible and will hopefully be addressed. Count me among the many who think that pros should be able to play in 3:30 or so in twosomes. This is lame. They're entertainers, and this isn't entertaining.

[Mr. Desmond]

2 hours ago, iacas said:

Oh the lengths to which you'll stretch to defend someone you've decided to defend…

Just hit the damn ball. Figure stuff out faster. Don't fidget. Don't take three minutes to read a putt.

Play faster. I like Jordan Spieth just fine, but this part of him is terrible and will hopefully be addressed. Count me among the many who think that pros should be able to play in 3:30 or so in twosomes. This is lame. They're entertainers, and this isn't entertaining.

Yes, he can play faster. And Yes, I also said he's exhausting to watch. And yes, I wish they'd told us that they'd staging a  20th anniversary re-enactment of Greg Norman's meltdown. We all have meltdowns and I think Spieth is strong enough to recover from this one.

[natureboy]

8 hours ago, tdiii said:

It is an additioal 15 minutes on top of an already very slow pace.  And the entire world is watching with a lot of golfers emulating this crap. 

HS football and basketball play a shorter game (fewer minutes), with fewer TV timeouts.  The length of the games have nothing to do with a slower pace.  And, yes, MLB is suffering for its worsening pace of play issues.  A game in the 1970s took less than 2:30.  Now it is 3:00.  And fan interest is declining. 

I'm not sure that the overall field pace isn't planned on or 'built in' to some degree for Majors. You have to have breaks in play to allow fans to cross fairways and for the players to get around / through the roped-in areas. There may be a desire for TV coverage to have an 'expected' length for the tournament that is over a certain minimum. In other words it might not be possible for an 'ideal' 3.5 hour round to be played.

[BruceMGF]

8 hours ago, tdiii said:

And, yes, MLB is suffering for its worsening pace of play issues.  A game in the 1970s took less than 2:30.  Now it is 3:00.  And fan interest is declining. 

This guy says commercial time accounts for all the difference:

http://www.101sports.com/2014/08/22/math-mlbs-bogus-pace-game-issues/

Makes sense to me.  I haven't watched more than half-an-inning for years, because I wander off during the commercial break and don't come back.

[saevel25]

21 minutes ago, natureboy said:

I'm not sure that the overall field pace isn't planned on or 'built in' to some degree for Majors. You have to have breaks in play to allow fans to cross fairways and for the players to get around / through the roped-in areas. There may be a desire for TV coverage to have an 'expected' length for the tournament that is over a certain minimum. In other words it might not be possible for an 'ideal' 3.5 hour round to be played.

Nah, those players are slow. Very few players are actually quick. DJ and Rory are pretty fast. Most of the time the camera cuts to them just before they swing. With Spieth it's 5 minutes of backing off, re-evaluating, ect..

 

[JimF27]

22 hours ago, boogielicious said:

4:30 for two Pros to play 18 is ridiculous. 

Really? Maybe you should try to play Augusta National and have to hole out every putt. Better yet, have a $1,000 Nassau while you're playing. I'd bet you wouldn't finish in 6 hours.

[natureboy]

5 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

Nah, those players are slow. Very few players are actually quick.

Not quite sure what you're saying here?

[Howling Coyote]

22 hours ago, boogielicious said:

4:30 for two Pros to play 18 is ridiculous. 

The leaders are only as slow as the slowest group in front of them.  I think it is more like freeway traffic.  The first ones on are fast and go at full speed.  As soon as one group goes slow, everyone behind grinds to a halt.

Example, in round 2 one group that had Stenson, Phil Mickelson and I think it was DeChambeau.  It was on the 12th hole when Stenson hit his ball way long into the hill.  Everyone went looking for his ball and spent a lot of time.  Finally Mickelson and DeChambeau went and putted out.  Then they went to the next hole and even teed off.  Meanwhile Stenson found his ball, but was trying to find the point of closest relief.  Well in the end he decided there was no relief and had to re-tee his ball.  He wound up with bogey which is pretty good considering, but the group behind was forced to wait.  Again, if you are forced to wait and your caddie informs you before your putt, "no need to hurry the other group is still there", then of course over time one becomes accustomed to take their time.

[natureboy]

A bit lot more composure with a little extra time:

http://www.golfchannel.com/media/spieth-one-will-hurt/

Edited April 11, 2016 by natureboy

[SavvySwede]

5 minutes ago, Howling Coyote said:

The leaders are only as slow as the slowest group in front of them.  I think it is more like freeway traffic.  The first ones on are fast and go at full speed.  As soon as one group goes slow, everyone behind grinds to a halt.

Example, in round 2 one group that had Stenson, Phil Mickelson and I think it was DeChambeau.  It was on the 12th hole when Stenson hit his ball way long into the hill.  Everyone went looking for his ball and spent a lot of time.  Finally Mickelson and DeChambeau went and putted out.  Then they went to the next hole and even teed off.  Meanwhile Stenson found his ball, but was trying to find the point of closest relief.  Well in the end he decided there was no relief and had to re-tee his ball.  He wound up with bogey which is pretty good considering, but the group behind was forced to wait.  Again, if you are forced to wait and your caddie informs you before your putt, "no need to hurry the other group is still there", then of course over time one becomes accustomed to take their time.

Not when Spieth has 1-2 open holes in front of him.

[Howling Coyote]

1 minute ago, SavvySwede said:

Not when Spieth has 1-2 open holes in front of him.

Well if this is consistent and he had one hole open before him and this number grew to 2 or even 3 before being over.  And lets say on round 1 when he was one of the early groups, he had 2 groups backing up behind him, well then he becomes the source of the freeway traffic jam and I take it back.

[tdiii]

Just now, SavvySwede said:

Not when Spieth has 1-2 open holes in front of him.

Especially when the group in front has notorious rain delay Langer in it and JS still can't keep up. 

Edited April 11, 2016 by tdiii

[boogielicious]

33 minutes ago, JimF27 said:

Really? Maybe you should try to play Augusta National and have to hole out every putt. Better yet, have a $1,000 Nassau while you're playing. I'd bet you wouldn't finish in 6 hours.

Don't think so. Plus I'm not a pro player play par or better. I'm expected to play 18 in a foursome in 4:30 or less.  In a twosome, I should be much faster.