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Tommy Fleetwood is Overrated


Phil McGleno
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21 hours ago, iacas said:

Backdoor, yes. He finished hours before the leaders.

Won four (compared to the PGA Tour) weak Euro Tour events since 2013. Zero in the last 15 months.

If you’re gonna call someone ill informed I’d expect him to have given incorrect info. He didn’t.

Tommy played all 72 holes during that tournament. And he also was 4th at the us open 2017. So yes, I call @Phil McGleno ill informed on this matter.

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21 hours ago, Jay28 said:

 

Only a few players live up to the media billing.  One of the jobs of the PR people and media is to gin up interest in the game.  Of course they are going to keep  hailing the next superstar

I challenge anyone to provide a link to any article where TF is hailed as anything other than a really, really  good player with a refreshing attitude and interesting look. He has certainly never been talked about as the "next big thing". I find it curious how any good player (even one who hasn't missed a cut globally in 12 months, like TF) is disparaged as "overrated", when in actual fact they haven't even been "rated" beyond where they are presently.  Guys like Rory may disappoint, but it's hard to "overrate" someone who, obviously, on his day, is perhaps second only to Woods in talent and raw ability. TF is not in that conversation and never was.

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58 minutes ago, leftybutnotPM said:

I challenge anyone to provide a link to any article where TF is hailed as anything other than a really, really  good player with a refreshing attitude and interesting look.

"Interesting look" how?  I agree he needs a haircut, but I don't think that's what you meant. ;-) 

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2 hours ago, MacDutch said:

Tommy played all 72 holes during that tournament. And he also was 4th at the us open 2017. So yes, I call @Phil McGleno ill informed on this matter.

That's pretty much the definition of a back-door finish, so no, he's not "ill informed." None of his facts were wrong.

You can disagree with his opinion, but when he's using words as they're defined, he's not "ill informed."

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2 minutes ago, iacas said:

That's pretty much the definition of a back-door finish, so no, he's not "ill informed." None of his facts were wrong.

You can disagree with his opinion, but when he's using words as they're defined, he's not "ill informed."

This is right-A back-door finish is when you are not near the leaderboard and you finish a relatively low pressure round to earn a high place in an event.

Tommy Fleetwood is overrated.

1 hour ago, leftybutnotPM said:

He has certainly never been talked about as the "next big thing".

Oh bullhonkey-He was a hot pick to win some of the last majors the last two years. Picked by several people.

Page 1 has his name nine times.-Page 2 six times.

And I do not just mean people here- I mean media people too.

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27 minutes ago, Phil McGleno said:

This is right-A back-door finish is when you are not near the leaderboard and you finish a relatively low pressure round to earn a high place in an event.

Tommy Fleetwood is overrated.

Oh bullhonkey-He was a hot pick to win some of the last majors the last two years. Picked by several people.

Page 1 has his name nine times.-Page 2 six times.

And I do not just mean people here- I mean media people too.

He's capable of winning a major (or two).

Even if he doesn't, he's still a very good player.

If you mean over rated as in 'same league as Rory', then sure I agree.  But then again not many match up to Rory.

As it stands Tommy is in the top 20 or so players in the world and credit to him.

 

 

Edited by Jay28
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34 minutes ago, Phil McGleno said:

Tommy Fleetwood is overrated.

 

Oh well - he is officially condemned as a failure. I expect to read his retirement announcement very soon. It's a pity that after a couple of years playing on the PGATour  he did not live up to the expectations of some people who debate the worth of his endeavours. :-)

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5 minutes ago, leftybutnotPM said:

Oh well - he is officially condemned as a failure. 

Claiming someone as overrated doesn’t mean they stay overrated... 

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1 minute ago, saevel25 said:

Claiming someone as overrated doesn’t mean they stay overrated... 

In fact at some point they could become underrated. 🙂

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6 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

Claiming someone as overrated doesn’t mean they stay overrated... 

Right.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instructor Development, 5 Simple Keys®/Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins • Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 • "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 • Penn-State Behrend Head Coach • • • • • • • • • • :aimpoint: :edel: :true_linkswear:

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This is from today.  I like Tommy Fleetwood (funny commercials, cool hair), but giving him the same odds as Adam Scott, and better odds than Molinari and Finau seems off.

2019 U.S. Open Betting Odds

Brooks Koepka 8-1
Dustin Johnson 8-1
Tiger Woods 10-1
Rory McIlroy 10-1
Jordan Spieth 14-1
Patrick Cantlay 16-1
Justin Rose 20-1
Rickie Fowler 20-1
Jason Day 25-1
Justin Thomas 25-1
Jon Rahm 25-1
Xander Schauffele 25-1
Adam Scott 30-1
Phil Mickelson 30-1
Tommy Fleetwood 30-1
Francesco Molinari 35-1
Tony Finau 35-1
Hideki Matsuyama 40-1
Matt Kuchar 40-1
Bryson DeChambeau 50-1
Paul Casey 50-1
Brandt Snedeker 50-1
Webb Simpson 50-1
Henrik Stenson 60-1
Marc Leishman 60-1
Gary Woodland 80-1
Patrick Reed 80-1
Louis Oosthuizen 100-1
Sergio Garcia 100-1
Matt Wallace 100-1
Kevin Kisner 100-1
Graeme McDowell 100-1

Edited by chspeed
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On 6/5/2019 at 7:28 PM, Phil McGleno said:

What has the dude really accomplished?

You're the kind of Nostradamus who'd have been stroking his chin in 1986 saying, "Jeez, this Faldo guy, seriously, what has that dude ever accomplished?"

I have a feeling Tommy will come good.

Quote

What has the dude really accomplished?

He's like Poulter but with more natural talent and a more pleasing temperament, but still a working class English golfer following in that tradition. No college scholarship at an American university with a strong golf team for Tommy, and not a whiff of the country club about him. He's done very well with the hand he was dealt, and I think he'll do a lot more, yet.

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1 hour ago, ScouseJohnny said:

He's like Poulter but with more natural talent and a more pleasing temperament, 

Darned by faint praise :  more pleasing temperament than Ian Poulter. 

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On 6/5/2019 at 4:28 PM, Phil McGleno said:

What has the dude really accomplished?

Best finishes in majors are T17, a back-door second at Shinnecock last year, T12, and T35. He was T36 and T48 this year I think in the two majors.

His last tournament win was 2018 January and he had only three before that-with one being in 2013 and the other two in 2017.

He did okay in the Ryder Cup with Francesco and that is about it.-18th in OWGR probably because of all the bonus Euro Tour over-rating points.

Overrated.

   May I please submit  that measuring Pro golfers by wins... only... is missing the mark a bit....it's more about cashing as big a check as you can each week when you play for a living....the wins come if you keep playing well and putting yourself in position to possibly win.....this is a great player we're talking about and I myself would not want to tee it up against Him for a $50 nassau..automatic two down presses... just an opinion.....but that opinion should save me about $ 1500.00 bucks.....very steady .... super talented....go for broke...professional .... golfer !!!   Over or under rated i respectfully...submit...depends on the standards we apply....great topic !!!

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My posts here getting lost don’t know why.

Backdoor second sounds negative to me, like it was’nt deserved. But Tommy played all 72 holes and there was only one player better last year. On top of that Tommy was fourth in 2017 at the US open. No mention f that in the opening post. He missed only one cut last 30 tournaments he played! Besides winning in Europe he played well in the USA and during WGC events. @Phil McGleno also calls Tommy’s last Rydercup appearance ‘ok’. It was’nt just ok, he was one of the Ryder cup hero’s.

Absolutely not overrated. 4th and 2nd last two US opens. Maybe someone got a bit butt hurt because of last years Ryder cup?

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4 hours ago, MacDutch said:

My posts here getting lost don’t know why.

Backdoor second sounds negative to me, like it was’nt deserved. But Tommy played all 72 holes and there was only one player better last year. On top of that Tommy was fourth in 2017 at the US open. No mention f that in the opening post. He missed only one cut last 30 tournaments he played! Besides winning in Europe he played well in the USA and during WGC events. @Phil McGleno also calls Tommy’s last Rydercup appearance ‘ok’. It was’nt just ok, he was one of the Ryder cup hero’s.

Absolutely not overrated. 4th and 2nd last two US opens. Maybe someone got a bit butt hurt because of last years Ryder cup?

I think he really needs to win a big tournament and major to match all the press he is getting though. Ryder Cup has performances from players that will never win majors on both sides. So I think that should be seen as a different category. 

I like the guy and his game. But like Fowler, he needs to put in four great rounds in a major and be in the final group to see what he is really made of. 

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5 hours ago, MacDutch said:

Backdoor second sounds negative to me, like it was’nt deserved.

It means the same thing it has always meeant-And he got a backdoor second place finish. Perfect definition for what he did there.

5 hours ago, MacDutch said:

On top of that Tommy was fourth in 2017 at the US open.@Phil McGleno

It was two years ago and I said his BEST finishes in the majors which fourth is beat by second.

5 hours ago, MacDutch said:

Absolutely not overrated. 4th and 2nd last two US opens. Maybe someone got a bit butt hurt because of last years Ryder cup?

Overrated. And son-I have not cared about the Ryder Cup since the Ryder Cup started. It is an exhibition.-The golf there does not matter. And Francesco carried Tommy Hairstyle.

2 minutes ago, boogielicious said:

I like the guy and his game. But like Fowler, he needs to put in four great rounds in a major and be in the final group to see what he is really made of.  

DItto-Overrated until he does something big. Look at how many people-sheep really-picked him to win a major this year.

"The expert golfer has maximum time to make minimal compensations. The poorer player has minimal time to make maximum compensations." - And no, I'm not Mac. Please do not PM me about it. I just think he is a crazy MFer and we could all use a little more crazy sometimes.

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