Laser Rangefinder Expectations

[Fourputt]

It seems the new GX-4 has the aforementioned illegal technology, but that you have to have some form of bright yellow "smart key" that is easily visible on it for the functions to be available. Does this theoretically release it from being illegal since yes the technology is in it, but has to be unlocked otherwise it only functions as a basic rangefinder? Also I found it funny that the first quote I see when I go to Leupold's website is Iacas haha :P

The local rule says if it has the capability then it can't be used, even if that feature is turned off.

9. Distance-Measuring Devices If the Committee wishes to act in accordance with the Note under Rule 14-3, the following wording is recommended: "Distance-Measuring Devices: [Specify as appropriate, e.g., In this competition, or For all play at this course, etc.], a player may obtain distance information by using a device that measures distance only. If, during a stipulated round, a player uses a distance-measuring device that is designed to gauge or measure other conditions that might affect his play (e.g., gradient, wind speed, temperature, etc.), the player is in breach of Rule 14-3, for which the penalty is disqualification, regardless of whether any such additional function is actually used."

[iacas]

The local rule says if it has the capability then it can't be used, even if that feature is turned off.

Without the yellow faceplate, it doesn't have the functionality - it's not merely "turned off." My hunch is it's perfectly legal when the chrome plate is on.

The point of the "even if it's turned off" part of the rule is that we'd have no way of knowing whether the functionality was turned off or not. Only the competitor himself looks through the eyepiece. The bright yellow flag serves the purpose to let others know that he can't cheat (with that range finder) if he wanted to, so i bet it's legal. The GX-4 is looking like a good thing for people who want the slope for practice rounds but still want a range finder for regular use as well.

[Fourputt]

Without the yellow faceplate, it doesn't have the functionality - it's not merely "turned off." My hunch is it's perfectly legal when the chrome plate is on.

The way the recommended local rule is written I don't think it matters what color anything is. It says that using such a device is not allowed, regardless of whether the feature is used. Not turned on or off, but if it even has that capability then it is not allowed. It seems to be stated pretty clearly to me. Decision 14-3/.05 would support that conclusion:

14-3/0.5 Local Rule Permitting Use of Distance-Measuring Device Q. May a Committee, by Local Rule, permit the use of distance-measuring devices? A. Yes. A Committee may establish a Local Rule allowing players to use devices that measure or gauge distance only (see the Note to Rule 14-3). However, the use of a distance-measuring device that is designed to gauge or measure other conditions that might affect a player's play (e.g., gradient, wind speed, temperature, etc.) is not permitted regardless of whether such an additional function is used.

[iacas]

The way the recommended local rule is written I don't think it matters what color anything is. It says that using such a device is not allowed, regardless of whether the feature is used. Not turned on or off, but if it even has that capability then it is not allowed. It seems to be stated pretty clearly to me. Decision 14-3/.05 would support that conclusion:

I disagree. The yellow piece is the one that effectively "has" the capabilities. Without it, it's not possible to get it on the sly or without others knowing, like I mentioned above.

I'll ask Leupold, though. No sense in us speculating when they can just tell us what the USGA told them.

[JGus]

Just wanted to throw a quick thanks out to everyone who has provided input on the whole Rangefinder vs. GPS discussion, as well as to Erik for the great review a while ago.

I used my Leupold GX-I Rangefinder today for the first time and it had an immediate impact. My average GIR's over the last year and a half was around 25%, but today I hit 50% of them. It was so nice to know the true distance and it made club selection a lot easier. I am still calibrating all of my distances, to include 1/2, 3/4, and full swings for my wedges and feel that after today that my percentages will continue to get better.

Thanks!

[iacas]

I'll ask Leupold, though. No sense in us speculating when they can just tell us what the USGA told them.

The USGA says the GX-4 without the yellow enabling key is legal for tournament play with the local rule in effect. Leupold checked this before building the thing (as one would suspect they would).

[NEhomer]

Dusting this one off 'cause I'm curious about the slope impact on the rules. 

I recently bought a Nikon coolshot without the slope feature...very pleased with it. I didn't consider one with slope simply because of the rule.

I question though why the slope feature is banned. I can see banning rangefinders altogether but if you're going to allow electronics technology to aid in estimating distance, why would you then handicap it's ability? It's like being allowed to use a knife but it's gotta be dull. 

Thoughts?

[iacas]

6 minutes ago, NEhomer said:

Dusting this one off 'cause I'm curious about the slope impact on the rules. 

I recently bought a Nikon coolshot without the slope feature...very pleased with it. I didn't consider one with slope simply because of the rule.

I question though why the slope feature is banned. I can see banning rangefinders altogether but if you're going to allow electronics technology to aid in estimating distance, why would you then handicap it's ability? It's like being allowed to use a knife but it's gotta be dull. 

Thoughts?

Slope is not distance.

It's that simple.

Distance is deemed common knowledge. Slope is not.

[NEhomer]

Ah ha, so that's it.

Next question...how helpful is that feature since I don't have it? Is it far more complicated than adding a few yards when it's uphill and subtracting a few when it's downhill?

[iacas]

22 minutes ago, NEhomer said:

Ah ha, so that's it.

Next question...how helpful is that feature since I don't have it? Is it far more complicated than adding a few yards when it's uphill and subtracting a few when it's downhill?

Not that useful.

It's one thing if you're a PGA Tour player scoping a course out in a practice name.

[DaveP043]

25 minutes ago, NEhomer said:

Ah ha, so that's it.

Next question...how helpful is that feature since I don't have it? Is it far more complicated than adding a few yards when it's uphill and subtracting a few when it's downhill?

I agree with @iacas.  I have a slope-enabled Bushnell that I don't use any more.  I did use it at times, and I wasn't overly impressed with the "play like" distance, it wasn't any different than I'd have estimated.  I'm guessing that they have to use some time of standardized shot shape in the calculation, so it might not be equally applicable to golfers who have a higher or lower trajectory. Another guess, I think a pro can probably look at the raw yardage and the slope angle and compute his own "plays as" yardage better than the algorithm built into the laser.

[onthehunt526]

On 3/18/2010 at 5:49 PM, iacas said:

Without the yellow faceplate, it doesn't have the functionality - it's not merely "turned off." My hunch is it's perfectly legal when the chrome plate is on.

The point of the "even if it's turned off" part of the rule is that we'd have no way of knowing whether the functionality was turned off or not. Only the competitor himself looks through the eyepiece. The bright yellow flag serves the purpose to let others know that he can't cheat (with that range finder) if he wanted to, so i bet it's legal. The GX-4 is looking like a good thing for people who want the slope for practice rounds but still want a range finder for regular use as well.

I think it says right on the box... Without the faceplate it won't calculate slope. Also it conforms to rule 14-3 if the yellow faceplate is off. Says it on the box. You're talking about the Leupold GX-4I correct?

My expectations are it doesn't shake and I can shoot the flag. I have the Bushnell Tour v4 without slope.

 

[hilmar2k]

I have a Caddytek with the slope and I like the slope a lot. I find the slope to be very useful. 

[iacas]

3 hours ago, onthehunt526 said:

I think it says right on the box... Without the faceplate it won't calculate slope. Also it conforms to rule 14-3 if the yellow faceplate is off. Says it on the box. You're talking about the Leupold GX-4I correct?

My expectations are it doesn't shake and I can shoot the flag. I have the Bushnell Tour v4 without slope.

You quoted me from 2010.

The USGA now allow rangefinders that have slope so long as you turn it off. Before, it used to be that it wasn't even possible. The original Leupold completed a circuit that turned it on. This was illegal even though the circuit wasn't completed and you couldn't "get" the slope.

Then the later versions moved the chip that processed it into the faceplate, which was legal, because the actual capability was "outside" or not a part of the rangefinder when the faceplate wasn't on.

[onthehunt526]

35 minutes ago, iacas said:

You quoted me from 2010.

The USGA now allow rangefinders that have slope so long as you turn it off. Before, it used to be that it wasn't even possible. The original Leupold completed a circuit that turned it on. This was illegal even though the circuit wasn't completed and you couldn't "get" the slope.

Then the later versions moved the chip that processed it into the faceplate, which was legal, because the actual capability was "outside" or not a part of the rangefinder when the faceplate wasn't on.

I'm glad the thread is still relevant this long. Most threads die after a week or two.

[Patch]

1 minute ago, onthehunt526 said:

I'm glad the thread is still relevant this long. Most threads die after a week or two.

Everything gets repeated if you stay on a forum long enough. 

[onthehunt526]

2 minutes ago, Patch said:

Everything gets repeated if you stay on a forum long enough. 

Very true. Like most of the threads I "start".

No seriously, I like the rangefinder I have... The more inexpensive models don't have the stabilization feature that my Bushnell does. I can tell you precisely how far away from my back porch the raccoon that came out last night was.

[hilmar2k]

20 minutes ago, onthehunt526 said:

I can tell you precisely how far away from my back porch the raccoon that came out last night was.

You just going to leave us hanging?