Teaching Foley to Teach Tiger

[ControlJunkie]

Posted via our Twitter last night -

Quote:

the_sand_trap Tiger Woods and Foley article - what to think of this? http://teachingfoleytoteachtiger.blogspot.com/2011/03/so-really.html #tigerwoods

I'm not posting this to dog out Foley or anything, so lets not jump down that road, but everyone check it out and lets hear what you think.

Quote:

The conclusion is that Tiger is learning from Mike and Andy via Dan’s interpretation then relaying what he sees’s to Foley.

Pretty much sums it up perfectly, doesnt it?? What do you guys think?

[Stretch]

That's a rather strange site/blog. Strikes me there's some pre-emptive butt covering going on. If Tiger keeps sucking under Foley and/or splits with him and goes back to a "conventional" swing pattern, there are going to be a lot of people in the S&T; universe arguing very forcefully that he never got the real goods. Of course, if it does click with him and he starts torching fields again, clearly that won't be necessary.

What's the old saying: Success has a thousand fathers, but failure is an orphan.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by ControlJunkie

Posted via our Twitter last night -

I'm not posting this to dog out Foley or anything, so lets not jump down that road, but everyone check it out and lets hear what you think.

Pretty much sums it up perfectly, doesnt it?? What do you guys think?

Quote:

That's a rather strange site/blog. Strikes me there's some pre-emptive butt covering going on. If Tiger keeps sucking under Foley and/or splits with him and goes back to a "conventional" swing pattern, there are going to be a lot of people in the S&T; universe arguing very forcefully that he never got the real goods. Of course, if it does click with him and he starts torching fields again, clearly that won't be necessary.

What's the old saying: Success has a thousand fathers, but failure is an orphan.

I don't twitter, but I suspect Stretch has summed it up nicely. If a successful player is using anything remotely similar to an S&T; swing (even if they learned it before "S&T; existed), or was associated with S&T; at any point in time (even if it was only for a month - e.g. DJ), then hooray for S&T;!! If a formerly successful player is stalled with what is essentially an S&T; swing, then he's not doing it correctly. Win Win for S&T;!!

I said from day 1 that "Tiger Woods + Sean Foley = Fail", but Tiger never listens to what I have to say, so, meh.

[RedFox999]

I dont think Tiger will be leaving Foley for a very long time if he actually even does. Just dont see it happening, Tiger really wants to protect his knee and this will be a good swing for him once he gets to Hunter mahans level with it. I know Ive talked against foley and Tiger a little in the past but my opinion has changed. I think he would be sucking (as much as Tiger can/not winning) if he were still under haney right now.

btw, I think its kinda stupid that all the S&T; gang say Foley is teaching Tiger via Dan or Andy. Who cares if they bounce stuff off each other, thats part of learning. You dont always want just one perspective

[jamo]

From what I've read from other forums and such is that Carraher is one of the best of the S&T; teachers. I don't know if I buy the article though. Why would Foley do this secretly? How would Tiger not notice this, but the article's author did? If Foley thinks Carraher knows more than him, which he must if he is consulting with Carraher, why doesn't Foley hand Tiger off to him? Maybe he see his 15 minutes running out.

[ControlJunkie]

Originally Posted by jamo

From what I've read from other forums and such is that Carraher is one of the best of the S&T; teachers. I don't know if I buy the article though. Why would Foley do this secretly? How would Tiger not notice this, but the article's author did? If Foley thinks Carraher knows more than him, which he must if he is consulting with Carraher, why doesn't Foley hand Tiger off to him? Maybe he see his 15 minutes running out.

There are a number of other reasons, but mainly because if he is the coach of the arguably greatest player of all time, and continues to be his coach while he goes on to take Jack's record of most majors, that likely equals out to a ridiculous amount of money, power, likely a show on Golf Channel, and one helluva ego boost. If Foley hands him off, he won't be able to make that claim anymore. The reason Foley would do it secretly is because if he does it publicly, in his mind, he probably thinks that it makes him look like less of a coach. Not saying that is the reason, just that it's a possibility.

[jamo]

Originally Posted by ControlJunkie

There are a number of other reasons, but mainly because if he is the coach of the arguably greatest player of all time, and continues to be his coach while he goes on to take Jack's record of most majors, that likely equals out to a ridiculous amount of money, power, likely a show on Golf Channel, and one helluva ego boost. If Foley hands him off, he won't be able to make that claim anymore. The reason Foley would do it secretly is because if he does it publicly, in his mind, he probably thinks that it makes him look like less of a coach. Not saying that is the reason, just that it's a possibility.

Yeah, I pretty much assume the same reasons, but it would really suck if Foley saw that he couldn't do as good of a job yet held Tiger back from someone who could.

[ControlJunkie]

Very true, unfortunately ego and greed gets in the way of doing the right thing far too many times. At the very least, he is getting help, even if he is being sneaky about it. Guess that's at least better than teaching the wrong thing altogether or being incomplete, ya know?

[jamo]

Originally Posted by ControlJunkie

Very true, unfortunately ego and greed gets in the way of doing the right thing far too many times. At the very least, he is getting help, even if he is being sneaky about it. Guess that's at least better than teaching the wrong thing altogether or being incomplete, ya know?

True. Better than he get the right information, even if it is someone else who is giving it to him.

[Harmonious]

This doesn't sound right.  At Bay Hill, with all the media/cameras around, Foley somehow sneaks away from Tiger, confers with another teacher, then goes back to tell Tiger what to do next.  Hmmmm......I'm sure if this is happening, we'll see it on Youtube soon.

[The Gill]

In my humble opinion, the only idiots are those that stop learning. If Foley wants to continue learning from other instructors, more power to him. My only beef would be that he doesn't always cite his sources. Even Einstein's work had a foundation on Poincare and other's works.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by The Gill

In my humble opinion, the only idiots are those that stop learning. If Foley wants to continue learning from other instructors, more power to him. My only beef would be that he doesn't always cite his sources. Even Einstein's work had a foundation on Poincare and other's works.

Maybe he'll do that in his next book.

[westcyderydin]

if i remember right i think i saw from iteach on wrx that he is friends with foley.  that could explain them having a convo around the range.  if they are both teaching pros and friends.  and i think all three of them are from around orlando now so maybe tiger talks to iteach from time to time anyways.

[Phil McGleno]

Originally Posted by Stretch

Strikes me there's some pre-emptive butt covering going on.

Doesn't look like that to me.

Looks like Grant Waite - or someone who likes Grant Waite - is trying to get Tiger to realize Foley doesn't know squat. Tiger has talked to Grant on several occasions and Grant is widely regarded as having an awesome swing. Is he getting into instruction? If so, I can see how this would be aimed at getting Tiger to hire Grant and ditch Foley.

And This Dan Carher guy isn't certified so far as I can tell. He's not listed on that site.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by Harmonious

This doesn't sound right.  At Bay Hill, with all the media/cameras around, Foley somehow sneaks away from Tiger, confers with another teacher, then goes back to tell Tiger what to do next.  Hmmmm......I'm sure if this is happening, we'll see it on Youtube soon.

Quite easy to do. There aren't many media members around the range. I'm not saying it did, just that it would be possible. O'Hair never noticed how often Foley walked over to Andy and Mike, after all. ;-)

I'm in the group that thinks that Tiger's currently not getting great information. His backswing is pretty good to great, but the downswing has some troubling pieces that should not still exist on March 27, 2011.

I know more than I can say, and I also know all of the players involved here (I've not talked to Foley but I probably could if I cared to, and I talk to some of his guys nearly daily), whether the've been said here or not. I know enough to know that I don't know everything, so I'm basically keeping my mouth shut.

[colin007]

Originally Posted by iacas

I know more than I can say, and I also know all of the players involved here (I've not talked to Foley but I probably could if I cared to, and I talk to some of his guys nearly daily), whether the've been said here or not. I know enough to know that I don't know everything, so I'm basically keeping my mouth shut.

can you say if tiger will get the necessary info to fix that downswing soon?  are there people with access who can steer him in the right direction?  i hate seeing my guy struggle like that...

[iacas]

Originally Posted by colin007

can you say if tiger will get the necessary info to fix that downswing soon?  are there people with access who can steer him in the right direction?  i hate seeing my guy struggle like that...

Fingers crossed, but that's just as a guy who likes it when he's playing good golf.

Consider how closed he is during the downswing, how his left tilt versus re-gaining flexion rates differ... and how his right shoulder works due to those things.

[RedFox999]

Originally Posted by iacas

Fingers crossed, but that's just as a guy who likes it when he's playing good golf.

Consider how closed he is during the downswing, how his left tilt versus re-gaining flexion rates differ... and how his right shoulder works due to those things.

what do you mean by closed on the downswing? curious as to what you mean