The Dan Plan - 10,000 Hours to Become a Pro Golfer (Dan McLaughlin)

[pullfade]

As I have previously mentioned in this thread, Dan plays like a 7-8 handicap. I've played about 20 rounds with him, two of which were tournament rounds.

Can he put up a 73 on a course he's familiar with every so often? Yes. Does he shoot high 80's in tournaments? Yes. He's an inconsistent high single digit unfamiliar with how to play and score in tournament golf. I'd venture to guess this is a pretty common scenario among golfers who pick up the game as adults.

[Lihu]

As I have previously mentioned in this thread, Dan plays like a 7-8 handicap. I've played about 20 rounds with him, two of which were tournament rounds.

Can he put up a 73 on a course he's familiar with every so often? Yes. Does he shoot high 80's in tournaments? Yes. He's an inconsistent high single digit unfamiliar with how to play and score in tournament golf. I'd venture to guess this is a pretty common scenario among golfers who pick up the game as adults.

Sorry, I forgot that you stated this before. Thanks for the correction/verification.

[RFKFREAK]

As I have previously mentioned in this thread, Dan plays like a 7-8 handicap. I've played about 20 rounds with him, two of which were tournament rounds.  Can he put up a 73 on a course he's familiar with every so often? Yes. Does he shoot high 80's in tournaments? Yes. He's an inconsistent high single digit unfamiliar with how to play and score in tournament golf. I'd venture to guess this is a pretty common scenario among golfers who pick up the game as adults.

Why do you think this is?

[acerimusdux]

Yeah, I don't see what the confusion here is. He regularly plays a course with a 73 rating, where he is almost always under 80, and only occaisionally under 75. That's what got his handicap down to around 3. Take him off the home course and it would likely be 6-8. Tournament golf is another animal, and something he will have to get used to at some point, but really isn't his priority yet.

And he clearly posts every round he plays on his website, so why would anyone think he was leaving rounds off his handicap? How many rounds do you think the guy plays?

Remember, simply playing golf doesn't really count as "deliberate practice". People suggesting he should be putting more emphasis on playing tournaments, or simply playing more rounds, are kind of missing the point of the project. Many people would likely be doing those things, but Dan believes continuing with regular intense daily practice is still more important right now. He'll likely continue to play every week, and play occasional tournaments, but he believes his improvement will come more from deliberate practice.

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pullfade

As I have previously mentioned in this thread, Dan plays like a 7-8 handicap. I've played about 20 rounds with him, two of which were tournament rounds.

Can he put up a 73 on a course he's familiar with every so often? Yes. Does he shoot high 80's in tournaments? Yes. He's an inconsistent high single digit unfamiliar with how to play and score in tournament golf. I'd venture to guess this is a pretty common scenario among golfers who pick up the game as adults.

Why do you think this is?

I was going to ask the same question. I'm not clear which item is a consequence of taking up the sport later in life. "Inconsistency" or the "Tournament" part?

Yeah, I don't see what the confusion here is. He regularly plays a course with a 73 rating, where he is almost always under 80, and only occaisionally under 75. That's what got his handicap down to around 3. Take him off the home course and it would likely be 6-8. Tournament golf is another animal, and something he will have to get used to at some point, but really isn't his priority yet.

And he clearly posts every round he plays on his website, so why would anyone think he was leaving rounds off his handicap? How many rounds do you think the guy plays?

Remember, simply playing golf doesn't really count as "deliberate practice". People suggesting he should be putting more emphasis on playing tournaments, or simply playing more rounds, are kind of missing the point of the project. Many people would likely be doing those things, but Dan believes continuing with regular intense daily practice is still more important right now. He'll likely continue to play every week, and play occasional tournaments, but he believes his improvement will come more from deliberate practice.

You gave him a stroke?

If it's not his priority yet, then what do you think should be his deliberate practice priority?

Not sure how deliberate practice in the comfort of his own driving range is going to help him with competitive golf. The only training for competition is to compete. Even if he plays skins daily for $5-$10 a hole, he still competes. The more he does it the more comfortable he gets with playing for stakes.

Learning to play by the rules and deliberate and competitive playing might teach him more than hitting more balls on a driving range (although he needs to tighten up his iron accuracy). I'm not really sure he's competed in anything prior to this endeavor?

[garybbq]

Yeah, I don't see what the confusion here is. He regularly plays a course with a 73 rating, where he is almost always under 80, and only occaisionally under 75. That's what got his handicap down to around 3. Take him off the home course and it would likely be 6-8. Tournament golf is another animal, and something he will have to get used to at some point, but really isn't his priority yet. And he clearly posts every round he plays on his website, so why would anyone think he was leaving rounds off his handicap? How many rounds do you think the guy plays? Remember, simply playing golf doesn't really count as "deliberate practice". People suggesting he should be putting more emphasis on playing tournaments, or simply playing more rounds, are kind of missing the point of the project. Many people would likely be doing those things, but Dan believes continuing with regular intense daily practice is still more important right now. He'll likely continue to play every week, and play occasional tournaments, but he believes his improvement will come more from deliberate practice.

Well since his full time job is playing golf, this doesn't seem like many rounds posted.

[Lihu]

[quote name="acerimusdux" url="/t/45853/the-dan-plan-10-000-hours-to-become-a-pro-golfer-dan-mclaughlin/2130#post_1078672"]Yeah, I don't see what the confusion here is. He regularly plays a course with a 73 rating, where he is almost always under 80, and only occaisionally under 75. That's what got his handicap down to around 3. Take him off the home course and it would likely be 6-8. Tournament golf is another animal, and something he will have to get used to at some point, but really isn't his priority yet. And he clearly posts every round he plays on his website, so why would anyone think he was leaving rounds off his handicap? How many rounds do you think the guy plays? Remember, simply playing golf doesn't really count as "deliberate practice". People suggesting he should be putting more emphasis on playing tournaments, or simply playing more rounds, are kind of missing the point of the project. Many people would likely be doing those things, but Dan believes continuing with regular intense daily practice is still more important right now. He'll likely continue to play every week, and play occasional tournaments, but he believes his improvement will come more from deliberate practice.

Well since his full time job is playing golf, this doesn't seem like many rounds posted. [/quote] 12 out of 20 scores are at or above 80 too. We also should note that you don't need to post every round you play.

[Pretzel]

12 out of 20 scores are at or above 80 too.

We also should note that you don't need to post every round you play.

How does he carry a 3.1 handicap with that many scores in the 80's?

It's like he sees that he's posting too many bad rounds, so he tosses a 73 or 74 in there every couple rounds to make sure his handicap stays where it's at.

[pullfade]

How does he carry a 3.1 handicap with that many scores in the 80's?

It's like he sees that he's posting too many bad rounds, so he tosses a 73 or 74 in there every couple rounds to make sure his handicap stays where it's at.

Handicap measures your potential, you don't need to be consistent at all to carry a low cap.

[Pretzel]

Handicap measures your potential, you don't need to be consistent at all to carry a low cap.

Note the 2 scores in the 80's among his lowest 10. Something is definitely fishy about that handicap to me. You don't go from posting positive handicap scores to shooting 80's on consecutive weeks or days. It isn't done.

[Shorty]

Handicap measures your potential, you don't need to be consistent at all to carry a low cap.

Yes you do. Of course you do. The better you become, the more consistent you will be.

Potential doesn't mean what you might do one day, it means what you're expected to do a certain percentage of the time.

I've never met a 3 handicapper who wouldn't be embarrassed to shoot in the 80s. Not to say they don't do it, but 2 markers are shooting around par a lot of the time. They have to to maintain their handicap.

[pullfade]

Yes you do. Of course you do. The better you become, the more consistent you will be.

Potential doesn't mean what you might do one day, it means what you're expected to do a certain percentage of the time.

I've never met a 3 handicapper who wouldn't be embarrassed to shoot in the 80s. Not to say they don't do it, but 2 markers are shooting around par a lot of the time. They have to to maintain their handicap.

Take Dan's home course for example. Rated a 73, in the US handicap system you're only expected to shoot your handicap or better 1 out of 5 rounds. That would mean that Dan, with his 3 handicap is only going to shoot around 76 or better 1 out of 5 rounds. I know it's different in Australia but a 2 handicapper here is not shooting around par a lot of the time, of course it depends on the rating and slope of the course but in the US handicap system, taking everything into account I would say a 2 handicapper is generally averaging about 5 over par a round.

And, as I'm sure you're aware, the US handicap system only takes the best 10 scores of your last 20. Theoretically I could shoot 10 rounds over 100 and 10 rounds at 70 and still be a +2 cap. That's why I said you don't need to be consistent to carry a low handicap.

[newtogolf]

Are you saying that if people don't play in tournaments that they don't always play by the rules?

I don't like to accuse anyone of cheating if I don't witness it personally so I won't go that far but his handicap doesn't seem right given how poor he performs in tournament unless he really can't handle pressure.  It could be as others suggest he just doesn't post his bad rounds where as in a tournament you must post your round unless you withdraw.

[newtogolf]

Six rounds in one month (September) for a guy that's dedicated his life to becoming a pro golfer seems very low.   It looks like he played more in August but still seems low.  If I was playing full-time I'd practice a 2-3 hours and play at least one round every other day if not every day.

[acerimusdux]

Originally Posted by Lihu

Not sure how deliberate practice in the comfort of his own driving range is going to help him with competitive golf. The only training for competition is to compete. Even if he plays skins daily for $5-$10 a hole, he still competes. The more he does it the more comfortable he gets with playing for stakes.

Well he does play skins, compete in matches with other guys at his local clubs (some better golfers than he is), compete in events at his local clubs, play charity tournaments and scrambles, etc.  The point is, he's not a good enough golfer to make handling tournament pressure his priority, yet.

How does he carry a 3.1 handicap with that many scores in the 80's?

He doesn't, his handicap went up to 5.3 in mid-September after those rounds in the 80s. His handicap dropped to 3.1 only in October after that stretch where 5 of his last 10 scores were 77 or better.

Six rounds in one month (September) for a guy that's dedicated his life to becoming a pro golfer seems very low.   It looks like he played more in August but still seems low.  If I was playing full-time I'd practice a 2-3 hours and play at least one round every other day if not every day.

He was working on a major change to his swing plane in September, so played less complete rounds as he was focused on that.  Point is, he's logging what he does every day here:

http://thedanplan.com/countdown/

I think the guy is a completely unrealistic dreamer, with no chance of achieving his stated goal, but I have seen nothing to really suggest he is a cheat or a fraud. The numbers and story all seem to add up pretty well to me.

Even on the question of tournament pressure, at the Oregon Mid-Am, he played horribly for his first 7 holes, then settled down and played pretty much at what I think is his usual level. He shot a 47 for that first 9, then 40, 42, 38. That was on a course with a 72.3 rating, which is not a venue he has frequently played.

So I think he could probably play to a 6-8 cap right now even in tournament conditions on an unfamiliar course, once he gets over those initial yips.

As such, I think he should keep the focus for now still on getting better at golf. As his game improves, his confidence in his game will improve, and that in itself will make it easier to handle the competitive pressure.

[nevets88]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

Not sure how deliberate practice in the comfort of his own driving range is going to help him with competitive golf. The only training for competition is to compete. Even if he plays skins daily for $5-$10 a hole, he still competes. The more he does it the more comfortable he gets with playing for stakes.

Well he does play skins, compete in matches with other guys at his local clubs (some better golfers than he is), compete in events at his local clubs, play charity tournaments and scrambles, etc.  The point is, he's not a good enough golfer to make handling tournament pressure his priority, yet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pretzel

How does he carry a 3.1 handicap with that many scores in the 80's?

He doesn't, his handicap went up to 5.3 in mid-September after those rounds in the 80s. His handicap dropped to 3.1 only in October after that stretch where 5 of his last 10 scores were 77 or better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by newtogolf

Six rounds in one month (September) for a guy that's dedicated his life to becoming a pro golfer seems very low.   It looks like he played more in August but still seems low.  If I was playing full-time I'd practice a 2-3 hours and play at least one round every other day if not every day.

He was working on a major change to his swing plane in September, so played less complete rounds as he was focused on that.  Point is, he's logging what he does every day here:

http://thedanplan.com/countdown/

I think the guy is a completely unrealistic dreamer, with no chance of achieving his stated goal, but I have seen nothing to really suggest he is a cheat or a fraud. The numbers and story all seem to add up pretty well to me.

Even on the question of tournament pressure, at the Oregon Mid-Am, he played horribly for his first 7 holes, then settled down and played pretty much at what I think is his usual level. He shot a 47 for that first 9, then 40, 42, 38. That was on a course with a 72.3 rating, which is not a venue he has frequently played.

So I think he could probably play to a 6-8 cap right now even in tournament conditions on an unfamiliar course, once he gets over those initial yips.

As such, I think he should keep the focus for now still on getting better at golf. As his game improves, his confidence in his game will improve, and that in itself will make it easier to handle the competitive pressure.

Yeah, when he posted the feel ain't real thought w/regard to video and the swing change to his backswing, I thought he was more on the right track, swing-wise. Imho, he needs to play tournaments, yes, but at the same time, I think he needs more to improve his mechanics and play on different courses with different style greens.

[Shorty]

2018 MCI Heritage.

He'll be right by then.

Probably will be in the world's top 50 which will guarantee an exemption/invittaion But if he's only ranked 100 in the world he might have to Monday qualify. No problem, though.

[Pretzel]

2018 MCI Heritage.

He'll be right by then.

Probably will be in the world's top 50 which will guarantee an exemption/invittaion But if he's only ranked 100 in the world he might have to Monday qualify. No problem, though.

He'll get a sponsors exemption possibly, if only to watch how bad he crashes and burns.