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Just my observation,  I will let the experts correct me if need be.  Left knee is still pretty bent into and after impact.  The hips might not be opening enough in the drill...?

Nate

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Just my observation,  I will let the experts correct me if need be.  Left knee is still pretty bent into and after impact.  The hips might not be opening enough in the drill...?

Yeah, I didn't get a chance to edit this video so it may not be too obvious to others (since I didn't throw any stills or slow motion in there) ... but, you are correct, it's not too different than before.  It's my first attempt though and I'll keep at it ... along with trying Erik's suggestion of more knee flex.

You know how it is ... something that is new can feel so foreign, and yet you watch the playback and you're like "wait a minute ... that looks the same as before!  How is that even possible, it felt sooooooooooooo awkward?!?!?!"

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Sure, I don't see why not.  I'll give it a try next time out.  Thanks!

Video below is a good visual to have.  Like Erik said you are "jumping" without enough knee flex.  Left knee flexes past the left ankle and then you "spring" up from there.  Will almost feel like you are lowering your center of gravity.  As you spring up the weight stays forward and the hips are forward.  Like you're holding a sandbag and need to launch it over a ten foot wall in front of you.

Mike McLoughlin

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@Golfingdad The video above that Mike posted is GREAT!  I just wanted to make a quick video also showing dtl showing glutes/hamstrings squeezing together, belt buckle more toward the target.  Try to get to this alignment sooner.  Agree with Erik on more knee flex.  Now that you have the picture go do some motions in front of a mirror or reflection in a window.  Best of luck.

Stephan Kostelecky

Golf Instructor

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Yeah nice video Stephan. @Golfingdad , for now I would recommend doing it just like Stephan did, without a ball.  Just get the movement right then add the ball in later.

Mike McLoughlin

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Yeah nice video Stephan.  @Golfingdad, for now I would recommend doing it just like Stephan did, without a ball.  Just get the movement right then add the ball in later.

OK, thanks.  That's good because I can do that indoors.  I actually went to the range this morning (before I read your post) and did the drill sort of like Stephan was doing, but with a ball.  Didn't get a chance to film it though.

I'll do some drills for the next couple of days inside and then when I get back out to the range on Tuesday, I'll film myself doing it with and without some balls.  [Insert silly comment here @Ernest Jones ]  And then maybe send that in to Evolvr.

Is it worth it to take a DTL view, or is face on all that's necessary for this?

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OK, thanks.  That's good because I can do that indoors.  I actually went to the range this morning (before I read your post) and did the drill sort of like Stephan was doing, but with a ball.  Didn't get a chance to film it though.

I'll do some drills for the next couple of days inside and then when I get back out to the range on Tuesday, I'll film myself doing it with and without some balls.  [Insert silly comment here @Ernest Jones]  And then maybe send that in to Evolvr.

Is it worth it to take a DTL view, or is face on all that's necessary for this?

Quote:

Originally Posted by sk golf

@Golfingdad The video above that Mike posted is GREAT!  I just wanted to make a quick video also showing dtl showing glutes/hamstrings squeezing together, belt buckle more toward the target.  Try to get to this alignment sooner.  Agree with Erik on more knee flex.  Now that you have the picture go do some motions in front of a mirror or reflection in a window.  Best of luck.

I would personally prefer to see both DTL and FO.  Things to look for in the DTL view are posted above.

Stephan Kostelecky

Golf Instructor

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Went out today and got some video of me attempting this drill.  Was going to send it in to Evolvr but after watching it, I can already see that I'm not really doing it correctly, so instead, and for posterity's sake, I'll just post them here.  (Notice I also made a point to turn the phone sideways ;))

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That's a lot better.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
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I was sitting around over the weekend with nothing to do so I finally got around to watching my 5SK videos.  Pretty repetitive stuff for somebody who is on Evolvr and has been to a few 5SK clinics or lessons, but still enjoyable.  (I even got to see more of the "Holy moses!" girl from the commercials :))

One thing that I didn't really think of at the time, but popped into my head when I was out at the range today, was when they were talking about the grip (disc 3, 15 min mark for those who care), and specifically, talking about the right index finger.  Chuck says that you can use the right index finger as sort of a monitor for your clubface, as long as its on the back side of the shaft.

Well, it just so happens that Stephan has me working with a weaker (maybe "less strong" is a better term) grip to try and help curtail the overdraws that tend to pop up every once in awhile.  Now that finger is right on the back of the shaft, so today at the range - and I only remembered this for about the last 10 balls or so - I tried to be conscious of that finger and "feel" it directly opposite the target at impact.  Those 10 balls all started right where I had intended!

Does this mean anything?  Maybe.  Maybe not.  Maybe **** yourself.  (Sorry, I love The Departed , and love quoting movies, had to throw that in there. ;))  Seriously though, I was hitting it pretty good the whole session and I was only using a 9 iron at the time, so its possible there is no connection to this 'trigger finger' but I will try it out again tomorrow to see where it leads.

----------------------------------------

Also, I feel like I'm making good progress with my straighter legs at impact.  We moved our coffee table out of the living room this weekend so now I can take swings in there while I'm watching TV!!  I've been doing the drill every night and its starting to take hold a bit.

Things are moving!!

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I was sitting around over the weekend with nothing to do so I finally got around to watching my 5SK videos.  Pretty repetitive stuff for somebody who is on Evolvr and has been to a few 5SK clinics or lessons, but still enjoyable.  (I even got to see more of the "Holy moses!" girl from the commercials :))

One thing that I didn't really think of at the time, but popped into my head when I was out at the range today, was when they were talking about the grip (disc 3, 15 min mark for those who care), and specifically, talking about the right index finger.  Chuck says that you can use the right index finger as sort of a monitor for your clubface, as long as its on the back side of the shaft.

Well, it just so happens that Stephan has me working with a weaker (maybe "less strong" is a better term) grip to try and help curtail the overdraws that tend to pop up every once in awhile.  Now that finger is right on the back of the shaft, so today at the range - and I only remembered this for about the last 10 balls or so - I tried to be conscious of that finger and "feel" it directly opposite the target at impact.  Those 10 balls all started right where I had intended!

Does this mean anything?  Maybe.  Maybe not.  Maybe **** yourself.  (Sorry, I love The Departed, and love quoting movies, had to throw that in there. ;))  Seriously though, I was hitting it pretty good the whole session and I was only using a 9 iron at the time, so its possible there is no connection to this 'trigger finger' but I will try it out again tomorrow to see where it leads.

----------------------------------------

Also, I feel like I'm making good progress with my straighter legs at impact.  We moved our coffee table out of the living room this weekend so now I can take swings in there while I'm watching TV!!  I've been doing the drill every night and its starting to take hold a bit.

Things are moving!!

I am always conscious of my right fore-finger for some reason. It's annoying because I always think of Hogan's book where he says that it shouldn't be too forceful, yet I can't help but flex it sometimes. Thanks for enlightening me a little to the fact that it can actually be used (obviously not RELIED UPON, but used) for clubface control. At the very least that drops my anxiety about that stupid finger lol...."let's not cry over spilled guineas."


Does this mean anything?  Maybe.  Maybe not.  Maybe **** yourself.  (Sorry, I love The Departed , and love quoting movies, had to throw that in there. ;))  Seriously though, I was hitting it pretty good the whole session and I was only using a 9 iron at the time, so its possible there is no connection to this 'trigger finger' but I will try it out again tomorrow to see where it leads.

What's the matter, smartass, you don't know any ****in' Shakespeare? :-D

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Does this mean anything?  Maybe.  Maybe not.  Maybe **** yourself.  (Sorry, I love The Departed, and love quoting movies, had to throw that in there. ;))  Seriously though, I was hitting it pretty good the whole session and I was only using a 9 iron at the time, so its possible there is no connection to this 'trigger finger' but I will try it out again tomorrow to see where it leads.

What's the matter, smartass, you don't know any ****in' Shakespeare?

We'd help you, but unfortunately, golf instruction is like growing mushrooms. Feed 'em shit and keep 'em in the dark. :-P

Constantine

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What's the matter, smartass, you don't know any ****in' Shakespeare?

Thanks for skipping the first "line" of that statement and not farting on myswing thread. ;-)

We'd help you, but unfortunately, golf instruction is like growing mushrooms. Feed 'em shit and keep 'em in the dark.

@JetFan1983 , I'd be happy to receive some help from you.  But first I'm gonna take a little break.  Gonna step outside for a smoke you wanna smoke you don't smoke do ya what are ya one of those fitness freaks go **** yourself! :beer:

I gotta watch this tonight!!  (By some miracle I don't own the DVD tho, how the heck did that happen??)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by jamo

What's the matter, smartass, you don't know any ****in' Shakespeare?

Thanks for skipping the first "line" of that statement and not farting on myswing thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JetFan1983

We'd help you, but unfortunately, golf instruction is like growing mushrooms. Feed 'em shit and keep 'em in the dark.

@JetFan1983, I'd be happy to receive some help from you.  But first I'm gonna take a little break.  Gonna step outside for a smoke you wanna smoke you don't smoke do ya what are ya one of those fitness freaks go **** yourself!

I gotta watch this tonight!!  (By some miracle I don't own the DVD tho, how the heck did that happen??)

Ehhh, don't sweat it. Golf pretty much sucks as a game, but you get to form relationships.

Constantine

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Played in another tournament today.  Didn't do good, didn't do bad, just kinda ... played.  I guess you could say I "grinded."  (Or is it "ground?"  Neither sound even close to correct.)  Anyways, I never felt terribly comfortable, and never hit any amazing shots, but most of the ones that I did hit poorly, I recovered from OK.  No big, bad blowup holes ... just a couple of sloppy double bogeys, and the rest bogeys and pars.  (Oh, and finished with a birdie on the par 5 9th after being over the green in two) :)

Putted pretty well for the first nine ... making all of those 4-6 footers.  But then on the back, I missed 3 or 4 of them.  Ended up with 34 putts total, and shot 85.  Good for T4.

As far as my swing goes, I think once I get more comfortable with this weaker grip, I'll know that the left side of the course is not a worry anymore, and things will snowball up from there.  For now, I still tense up a bit and worry that I'll hook one, don't commit to the shot and hit an ugly push fade.  I'll get there.

Practice, practice, practice.

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@Golfingdad The video above that Mike posted is GREAT!  I just wanted to make a quick video also showing dtl showing glutes/hamstrings squeezing together, belt buckle more toward the target.  Try to get to this alignment sooner.  Agree with Erik on more knee flex.  Now that you have the picture go do some motions in front of a mirror or reflection in a window.  Best of luck.

Yeah nice video Stephan.  @Golfingdad, for now I would recommend doing it just like Stephan did, without a ball.  Just get the movement right then add the ball in later.

Here's a video from today of me working on this.  I'd be able to see any differences a little better face on but there was a dude there today, so no dice.  (I also forgot to turn the phone sideways again, whoops)

Overall, I hit the ball quite well today.

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Sorry. No comments on your swing per se, but I had to post this:

  • Upvote 1

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

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    • I'm not an "official" instructor but I've been helping people for a few years now. I find that most beginners never get taught a proper concept of how the swing works. I also find that most people need a better understanding of what the arms and hands do before even working on the grip or the rest of the body. This is because what your concept of how the arms work through the downswing will dictate how strong or weak your grip must be. And if your arms work correctly then you can get away with a lot of variation in the lower body and still hit the ball decently. This will be long by the way... now...I get technical because...well...if you're writing it, you have to make it understandable. So let's understand the swing structure of the left or lead arm. The clubhead is controlled by the left hand, the left hand is controlled by the left wrist which is made up of the two bones of the forearm; the ulna closest to the pinky finger and the radius closest to the thumb. The forearm is attached to but can work independently of the humorous or upper arm which ends at the shoulder joint. That's the structure you are working with. Now how each section of that structure can work in different ways so let's talk about them starting at the upper arm. You may have heard people use the term "external shoulder rotation." It's usually used in reference to the right arm but that's okay you need to understand it in the left arm as well. First off...that's not a correct term. The shoulder is a complex structure of three bones; the clavicle in the upper chest/neck area, the scapula or shoulder blade that glides across the back and the end of the humorous bone that is the upper arm. So when you hear that term what they really are saying is "external rotation of the humerus." A simple way to understand this is to think about arm wrestling. If you are arm wresting someone with your elbow on a table you are trying to force your opponents arm into external rotation while your upper arm would be internally rotating. If you are losing the wrestling match you will find that while your elbow stays in place, your forearm and hand will be pushed back behind the elbow as your humerus externally rotates. So in the golf swing we don't want to be the winner of the arm wrestling match... at any point in time! Both upper arms need to externally rotate. The right upper arm externally rotates in the backswing and stays in that position through impact or for some people just before but very close to impact. The left arm must externally rotate in the downswing from impact through the finish. Some people choose to set-up with both upper arms externally rotated...think elbows pointed at the hips or biceps up. Others will start with just the right arm in this position...some people describe it as the "giving blood" position. Others start with both elbows internally rotated...biceps facing inward toward each other. You can set-up whichever way feels best to you but in your backswing and downswing the upper arms MUST externally rotate. Now back to the left arm...with which you should try to control the swing...and the forearm. The forearm is where most people get in trouble because it can rotate left or right no matter which orientation your upper arm is in...try it...it's just how the forearm is structured to work. And this is where you MUST make the decision as to how you want the forearms to work in order to choose how strong or weak your grip must be. Ben Hogan in his book 5 Lessons uses the terms supination and pronation. To illustrate it simply grab a club in your left hand and hold it out in front of you. Rotate your forearm to where your knuckles point to the sky (this is pronation) and then rotate your forearm the other way so that your knuckles point to the ground (this is supination). When your lead forearm is in pronation (knuckles up) the ulna will be on the left side of the radius. In supination (knuckles down the ulna rotates under the radius and the radius is now on the left side of the ulna. Very important that you relate this to the position of the ulna. At the top of the backswing you should be in a position where you feel that the knuckles of the left hand are pointed to the sky. As you rotate your body open and your chest pulls your arms down and into impact you will need to be aware that your ulna stays on the left side of the radius as long as possible. This is the position instructors are trying to have you achieve by pulling the butt of the club into an invisible wall past your left leg while maintaining the 90 degree angle formed by the shaft and your forearm. You've probably seen or heard of that drill as we all have over the years. Now here is the IMPORTANT part that no one seems to ever speak of...what happens from there!?! From that position...ulna on the left side of the radius, shaft and the forearm at a 90 degree angle, hands directly over the ball...you have two choices. 1) You can keep the ulna traveling toward the target on the left side of the radius and only release (unhinge) the wrists to lower the clubhead down into the ball or 2) while you unhinge your left wrist you can rotate your left forearm from the pronated position (knuckles up) to the supinated position (knuckles down) and let the ulna rotate under and eventually to the right side of the radius. If you choose to release the club with method 1 you will need a strong grip. The clubface will stay stable and square to the target throughout the swing but you probably will lose distance and have a very spinny ball flight. If you choose to release the club with method 2 you will probably require a much weaker grip as the clubhead will be less stable as it closes down coming into impact. This method requires more timing but results in more power through impact and usually more distance. You may also hook the ball if you start with too strong of a grip or a closed clubface at address. Method 2 is what most pros use but not all. Method 1 is what causes most people to hit weak, spinny slices and requires an unusually strong grip because with method 1 the left forearm has a tendency to open more coming into impact where the ulna stays in front of the radius too long.    Here's the catch...you need to learn both releases. Release 1 is how you want to use your wedges when you want to make sure the bounce interacts with the turf or if you need to hit a cut from left to right around a tree. You'll get more height and more spin with release 1. Release 2 will let the leading edge tear through the turf taking a nice crisp divot and can be used to hook a ball from right to left. Congratulations to anyone that read through all of this! I believe that once your brain understands precisely how it needs to control the different parts of your body it can do it repetitively on command. Your swing will repeat and not fall apart from day to day. Learn how you want to use your forearms and you can choose your grip and clubface position at address. Either method will work and both methods are used by the best players in the world for different shots.
    • Day 330 - Mostly just partial swings today, so I could really focus on exaggerating my hips towards the target in my finish. 
    • Day 72 - 2024-12-11 /sees a picture of Chet after shaving with a saw, goes back to doing a little mirror work at AMG.
    • Day 147: more mirror work. Trying to hone in the backswing stuff real nice. 
    • If I was going to try to help someone fix a low snap hook without actually seeing their swing I would have to tell them to break down the problem into pieces. See if you can fix the "low" part of the problem first. A low ball flight tells me you are probably swinging level or hitting down on the ball instead of hitting up on it. Try teeing the ball higher than you are comfortable and put the ball up in your stance a little further up than comfortable...try putting it off your left heal or even the left toe. Try to feel like your club head is swinging up through impact. Try that first and see if it gets you to a high snap hook or a high pull hook.    If you want to address the hook part of the swing you are going to have to look at two areas of the swing as well as your concept of what the arms and hands do through impact. I love talking through this stuff with people but I'll only go into it further if you really want to go down that rabbit hole...you would have to say so. Swing well my friend!
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