2012 Ryder Cup Discussion Thread

[Nosevi]

That is what Ollie and Seve were famous for...people like to forget that when a guy dies but Seve was the worst and the person most responsible for the climate of today.

Not sure that's completely true, yes he would do whatever he could to win, especially in the Ryder Cup, but there is a bit of 'niggle' in the Ryder cup and I'm not sure you can pin it on Seve. Regarding the Woods/Molinari concession thing, if it didn't matter why wait till after you've missed your putt to concede it? Doesn't matter? Then concede it as soon as your opponent is on the green. Ironically if woods had conceded it what do you think Molinari would have done? My money is on concede Woods' putt - we finish all square. Or Woods misses and Molinari is the villain for not being as sporting. I think Woods had just had enough "get out of there" were his words in the press conference I thought (though could be wrong) but thought it was a shame to make the decision to loose the match and put DL3 down in the list of loosing captains. It's not the fact the US team lost rather than drew, I just don't think it was his decision to make is all.

[zeg]

Originally Posted by newtogolf

I agree with your comments about smart team players, but you're taught in team sports that it's your job to be out there when the team needs you.  It's the coaches job, not yours,  to determine if your performance at 80% is better than the next guys at 100%.

I could be wrong, but I highly doubt Ian Poulter would request a benching and no one was showing more intensity and emotion in his matches than he was.  If I had to pick a team mate out of all 24 guys, Poulter (ironic since I never really liked him) is my first choice based strictly on how he stepped up for his team and the intensity he played every match with.

Again, as I stated in my response to Golfingdad maybe this is different because golf is really an individual sport.

Sure, it's up to the coach---which is why I said that you better be ready to give it all you've got if he calls on you. But you have to let him know what your level is. If there's a reason you're going to be at less than your best, he needs to know that so that he can make his decision. That's what Phil's statements mean to me. Throw in the apparent rule that the pairings were fixed, and Phil is just saying that he doesn't have it all available for the afternoon.

I also think that the role of "intensity" in golf is radically different from other sports. In football, an amped up, intense linebacker is going to run over a less enthusiastic opponent. Golf is much less about overwhelming your opponent than about bringing your best. For some, intensity may do that. But many people play better when they're more relaxed.

[Monte the Bear]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Golfer

That is what Ollie and Seve were famous for...people like to forget that when a guy dies but Seve was the worst and the person most responsible for the climate of today.

What a crock. Ya know what's responsible for it? Europe winning. And the on-course booze. And morons. On both sides.

Seve Ballesteros never called anything 'a war on the shore' or wore army camoflage kit. He didn't arrive on course looking like a dick in cavalry hat. He didn't conduct town hall meetings for the spectators prior to the tournament.

Jeez.

[misty_mountainhop]

Originally Posted by Joakim

That half point was HUGE. For everyone that placed bets on a 14-14 tie, it paid 12-1.

Maybe so but are you seriously suggesting that TW and Molinari should have finished with a 1up win for Woods just to satisfy some gamblers? Sorry but tough luck in my book.

[Golf Man]

Originally Posted by Joakim

Unprecedented actions never seen in Ryder cup history and/or that require questioning.

1) I've never seen anyone clapping so encouraging b4 a game is over.

2) Never before have I seen a team come out ON TV and tell your opponent during the match what your game plan is.  Never before (that I know of) has all 12 players only played  3 matches and sitting on your bench is Phil Mickelson, Keegan Bradley, Brandt Snecker and Furyk was a good choice. Never before have I seen a manager choose a game plan. This is just plain stupid, every sports event you start with a plan but you must have flexability and willing to change things.

3) Never do I see teams get satisfied not going for the knockout and satisfied with we have a good lead. Also his lineup choice... yes the rookies had a good lead but leading off the final round of the Ryder cup against their best and most experienced players is a big risk that did not work. Everyone new Ollie was bringing out his big guns and you had an advantage knowing. Start a couple vets and the rest of your rooks would have been paired against very beatable players. It would have relieved alot of pressure the night before knowing they had substantial advantages. Plus Psychologicaly you just took EURO'S best players and they very well could have played down to their competition.

Sure this is only monday quarterbacking but as you pointed out....(Love is only the second US captain to have double digits on board after 2 days (since 1979)......

and he lost. I could go on and on with mistake after mistake so to end this.

I respect DL3 for being a nice guy, but I thought this was about winning. DL3 said he was talking with his captains the night before the match and he said "I'm not even thinking about the afternoon" Shocking.... Mayby he should have put some more thought into alot of things.

1. Fair enough but doesn't change the fact that it had no affect whatsoever on Rose's birdie at the 18th - he holed big putts at 16,17 & 18 (possibly only guy to birdie 18 all day?). People react differently to things on the course - Mickleson could have not acknowledged the putt from Rose on 17 and stormed off - would have had no affect at all on the outcome

2. First off all players didn't play 3 matches - all played on all 3 days and everyone played at least 3, with most playing 4 (Bradley, Mickleson, Simpson, Watson, Dufner & Johnson, Woods & Stricker). Kuchar & D Johnson played 2 4 balls, Furyk & Snedeker played 2 4somes. Again I find it hard to criticise Loves performance over the first 2 days given the 10-6 lead that the US had, even if he didn't show great flexibility. What he arguably should have done was have Stricker and Woods sit out the Friday foursomes (given that they were always going to be better in the fourballs), let them play on the Friday afternoon and if it went well then consider them playing 2 rounds on the Saturday. People should also realise that Woods & Stricker lost 2&1, 1up and 1up - they weren't exactly battered. Love probably didn't see the need to change things as they were going well over the first two days - again this is not where teh Cup was lost

3. There are obviously questions about DL3 on the Sunday - was his approach right? His first 5 players out were Watson, Simpson, Bradley (all major winners), Mickleson (multiple major winner) and Snedeker (Fed Ex Champ) - all had winning records going into the singles and seemed to be thriving on the Ryder Cyup experience. I think DL3 was very aware that he didn't want Europe to get momentum early on so he put his form players out early. He was right to have confidence in them beating their opposition - Poulter was obviously playing well, Rose, Donald & McIlroy had played ok, Lawrie isn't exactly a big gun for Europe. Look at what happened to Europe in 1999 - they had 3 players in the top 5 who hadn't played at all that week - they were always going to lose their games. He got a couple of things wrong with regards to the order - i think Olazabal got one over on him by having Donald out first. Watson was a predicatble choice and I think Love assumed that Europe would go with Poulter first - Poulter-Watson would have developed into a bit of a circus. I think he should have put Tiger out first, Stricker last and possibly Furyk out earlier

4. Simple fact is that US needed 4.5 points out of 12 on Sunday and got 3.5 - while you can argue the small points of Loves order the simple fact is that those US players (all of whom had played on both days) in the form that they were in should have got teh points that they needed, no matter what order europe went out in. Whether that was down to maybe taking the eye off the ball, choking, the Europeans playing really well (and lets be honest its a combination of all of these). To try to blame the defeat on Woods & Stricker playing in the 4 balls on Saturday is ignoring the obvious

[misty_mountainhop]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Golfer

That is what Ollie and Seve were famous for...people like to forget that when a guy dies but Seve was the worst and the person most responsible for the climate of today.

Don't be ridiculous.

[newtogolf]

That could explain why I'm not very good at golf.  I might be too competitive and intense when I play.  Intensity didn't seem to hurt Poulter this weekend so maybe there's hope.

Originally Posted by zeg

Sure, it's up to the coach---which is why I said that you better be ready to give it all you've got if he calls on you. But you have to let him know what your level is. If there's a reason you're going to be at less than your best, he needs to know that so that he can make his decision. That's what Phil's statements mean to me. Throw in the apparent rule that the pairings were fixed, and Phil is just saying that he doesn't have it all available for the afternoon.

I also think that the role of "intensity" in golf is radically different from other sports. In football, an amped up, intense linebacker is going to run over a less enthusiastic opponent. Golf is much less about overwhelming your opponent than about bringing your best. For some, intensity may do that. But many people play better when they're more relaxed.

[MSchott]

Originally Posted by Joakim

DL3: Col. Jessup. DID YOU ORDER THE CODE RED?

Mickelson: You don't want the truth, you can't handle the truth.

DL3: Col. Jessup. DID YOU ORDER THE CODE RED?

Mickelson: Your God dam right I did.

Enough of your idiocy. The US team regardless of whether Mickelson played 2X on Saturday were up by 4 points going into Singles. What happened Saturday is inconsequential and anyone ripping on Phil for whatever may have transpired is just here to hate on him. You have proven that you don't like him and are incapable of rational thought in this matter.

[Monte the Bear]

These are the ratings from the British newspaper, The Guardian, for Team USA.

TEAM USA

Keegan Bradley

America's player of the tournament. Bubba got all the credit for whipping the crowd up but really most of the early palaver was down to the 2011 US PGA champion, who set about sinking a preposterous number of putts on the opening day and running around like Marco Tardelli in the 1982 World Cup final. Had by far and away the most haunted thousand-yard stare of the entire US team in the closing ceremony. He really did care quite a lot. He'll be winning a few majors down the years.

Rating: 10

Jason Dufner

Spent the entire week wandering around like a man wondering if he had left the gas on but deciding that it will be OK either way because he's got a pretty good insurance policy. Three points from four, the last won when he flicked away Peter Hanson, who had been coming back at him in determined fashion, by raising an eyebrow. Took to the stage in what could best be described as a carefree mooch, both hands in pockets, like a gentleman popping down the road to see if he could grab a pint at the local before lasties, but no worries if he doesn't make the bell, he might have a couple of cans back at home in the fridge. Scruffy and slightly overweight, give or take a splash of genius, he is each and every one of us. Only he's jumped the rope.

Rating: 10

Jim Furyk

Showed his usual fighting spirit from beginning to end, even though it didn't quite work out for him. Unlucky to lose to the Macs on the opening day, he made damn sure it did not happen again with birdie on the opening hole against the pair on Saturday. He never relinquished that lead. And what could he do in the singles, up against both Sergio and Seve? He was a dimple away from going dormie two on the 16th, celebrating a putt which was dropping but then outrageously decided to pop back out again, then saw his attempt at a long-range up and down from the back of the 18th miss by a coat of paint. You know who was keeping those balls out? Yep. Despite it all, he was gentlemanliness personified. Apart from during the closing ceremony, that is, where he was a picture of seething malevolence as a Scottish folk band jigged gleefully in front of him, heidrum-hodruming right up in the poor guy's grille.

Rating: 10

Dustin Johnson

The Ryder Cup is perhaps the perfect arena for Big Dustin, who is arguably the most talented player on the entire circuit but certainly the most inconsistent. In matchplay conditions, though, he can have his thundering meltdowns and move on without having suffered too much pain. Having needlessly shed a two-hole lead to Colsaerts in the singles, missing short putts and toying with water, he hit a towering long iron into the 14th to set up birdie, the first of three holes in a row to close out a match in the brisk manner of a hunter twisting a rabbit's neck. Three wins from three, without making any fuss, a gentle giant.

Rating: 10

Zach Johnson

A tenacious wee irritant, a scrapper of the highest quality. Denied a four-from-four record only by Ian Poulter's frankly silly putting display at the tail end of the Saturday fourballs. During the closing ceremony was by some distance the American to appear most personally affronted by defeat. The look on his face! The narrowing of the eyes! Now there's a man who understands how important the Ryder Cup is.

Rating: 10

Matt Kuchar

The incredible smiling man. He even managed a thin-lipped version during the closing ceremony, despite his putter having cooled on him – and Westwood's having turned inexplicably molten – at exactly the wrong time. Otherwise a consistent thorn in Europe's side, winning both of his fourballs.

Rating: 10

Phil Mickelson

Lefty has never been the greatest at the Ryder Cup but this looked like finally being his year. He formed a majestic pairing with the rookie Keegan Bradley, the two dovetailing perfectly, the old boy taking up the slack when the young pup ran out of steam. The perfect Ryder Cup was in the making – until Rose raked in that astonishing birdie monster on the 17th in the singles. When the Englishman completed his smash and grab on the final green with a granite pressure putt, it was a hammer blow to Mickelson, and the Americans, who had now lost all five of their opening matches. Mickelson's reaction to having his pocket picked? A warm smile and generous congratulations. What a sport. If Seve really is pulling the strings somewhere, perhaps he could set up some sort of pulley mechanism that'd finally deliver a US Open to one of the game's gents. Seve?

Rating: 10

Webb Simpson

Came roaring out of the blocks in the singles and would have had a three-hole lead after four had Poulter not chipped in outrageously at the 1st. Was denied by Poulter and Rose scrapping like madmen in the Saturday morning foursomes but otherwise delivered two easy victories over the first two days. It is always nice to see a relatively unheralded major winner prove he has what it takes to stay at the very top and Simpson gave notice of his intention not to be a one-hit wonder.

Rating: 10

Brandt Snedeker

He was beaten by the Macs, he beat the Macs, and he was smoked by Paul Lawrie. A mixed bag but the guy's just won $10m at the FedEx and must still be spinning. Plus, like his team-mate Dufner, Snedeker exudes the carefree manner of a punter who's just taken a gamble to jump the rope and see how long he can get away with it – albeit jump the rope more athletically.

Rating: 10

Steve Stricker

His putter wasn't as hot as it usually is, and the poor man ended the tournament as the Bizarro Poulter, with a 0-4 record, and no points to show for his troubles. But consider his matches for a minute: he lost 2&1 in his opening foursomes and his other three games by one hole. And if his putt at the 18th on Saturday afternoon hadn't ridden the wall of death round the back of the cup and squirmed out, he would have denied Garcia and Donald the point at 10-4 which started Europe's revival. The thin lines between success and failure can be measured by the width of a dimple. He also had to deal with the preposterous opening-day putting of Colsaerts, accepting blow after blow with a dignified stoicism.

Rating: 10

Bubba Watson

It would get very odd if people carried on like this every week but the Ryder Cup calls for a sprinkling of showmanship and Bubba has it coming out of his ears like hair pokes from under his visor. It takes a special kind of star to engineer a brouhaha with the express intention of teeing off amid the tumult, then run down the fairway high-fiving half the gallery. And it takes a special kind of golfer to deliver two huge fourball victories and make the usually ice-cool Donald flustered enough to miss a couple of short match-clinching putts.

Rating: 10

Tiger Woods

As anybody who witnessed the great man's meltdown on the 16th tee at the Masters this year will know – he missed the green by 40 yards with a wedge, then hoofed the club along the ground as his soul departed for a voyage in the funk mothership – when Tiger struggles, he really struggles. Which is what he did on the front nine at Medinah, flaying drive after drive into the trees and misjudging his short irons woefully. And yet coming home he was every inch the 14-time major winner, fighting and scrapping to the end in every match. OK, so he ended up with little to show for it. But you have to wonder if his concession to Francisco Molinari at the last on Sunday will, in time, be seen as an act of sportsmanship right up there with Jack Nicklaus's to Tony Jacklin at Birkdale in 1969. Having missed his short putt to win the match, Tiger seemed instinctively to realise that Europe's comeback deserved outright victory, that the Seve Factor was a story that needed a positive conclusion and that – to paraphrase Big Jack – he did not think Molinari would miss that but he didn't want to give him the chance. Tiger might not have the greatest Ryder Cup record, not by a long chalk, but this concession alone is some legacy to leave the competition. One of the great sporting gestures.

Rating: 10

Davis Love III (non-playing captain)

Having built a 10-6 lead going into the singles, the American captain can hardly be said to have got much wrong during the week. Within minutes of suffering the most painful defeat of any US captain in Ryder Cup history he was in front of the cameras, warmly congratulating his opposite number, Olazábal, evoking the Spirit of Seve – "He was obviously here for that one point they needed!" – and insisting that any heat should be directed at him and not his proud players. "I hope they put it all on me, because these guys put a lot into this. They played very, very well. We're going to be bitterly disappointed but it was a good Ryder Cup and it was good for golf. It wasn't good for us but it was good for golf." Europe wouldn't have had a Homeric singles odyssey to embark on had they not been facing the strongest US team since 1981, when America travelled to Walton Heath and gave the home side a frightful smack in the mouth. Captain Love, for his efforts, should be applauded. Without his excellence, we'd be talking about a very average Ryder Cup right now.

Rating: 10

[k-troop]

You're all winners!! What a crock.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by misty_mountainhop

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lefty-Golfer

That is what Ollie and Seve were famous for...people like to forget that when a guy dies but Seve was the worst and the person most responsible for the climate of today.

Don't be ridiculous.

Honesty is ridiculous now?

[Golf Man]

Originally Posted by k-troop

You're all winners!! What a crock.

These are the "alternative" ratings - actual ratings (courtesy of Sky) _ i'd disagree with most of them

Europe

Nicolas Colsaerts: Simply sensational in carding eight birdies and an eagle to carry Westwood to a fourballs win over Woods and Stricker, but was unable to reproduce that form and lost his other three games. 7

Luke Donald: Produced one of the moments of the week with his tee shot to the 17th to help secure a dramatic win on Saturday evening alongside Garcia, and led from the front with victory over Watson in the opening singles match. 7

Sergio Garcia: Admitted he was not at his best in claiming one win from this three matches before the singles, but then produced a battling victory over Furyk on Sunday, winning the last two holes after never being in front since the second. 7

Peter Hanson: Out of sorts and managed just two birdies in his only appearance before the singles, a 5&4 fourballs defeat that saw him and Lawrie six down after seven. Battled hard but lost singles match to Dufner. 5

Martin Kaymer: The former world number one could have been knocked out of the team in the last week of qualifying after a poor run of form, and lost his only game before the singles. But the German showed nerves of steel to win the decisive point in the singles to spark delirious scenes on the 18th green. 8

Paul Lawrie: In his first appearance for 13 years, the Scot managed just four birdies in two fourball defeats, but then made four and an eagle in dispatching Snedeker 5&3 in the singles. 7

Graeme McDowell: Apparently did not expect to play twice on the opening day but was kept alongside McIlroy after their opening foursomes win. Subsequently lost next two games and was left out of Saturday fourballs before losing to Zach Johnson in singles. 5

Rory McIlroy: Played well enough to claim more than two points from four games before the singles, three of which went to the 18th. Amazingly misjudged the time zones for his singles match, arriving at the course just 10 minutes before teeing off, but never trailed in a 2&1 win. 8

Francesco Molinari: Without his brother Edoardo this time, lost both of his team games but unlucky to initially partner a seriously off-form Westwood. Halved with Woods in the final singles after the trophy had been retained. 6

Ian Poulter: The undoubted star of the first two days, winning all three of his matches and controversially rested on Friday afternoon. Birdied the last five holes in Saturday's fourballs win and beat Webb Simpson in singles by winning the last two holes. 10

Justin Rose: Played better than his record of two wins and two losses before the singles suggested and proved it with birdies on the 17th and 18th to beat Mickelson; even the American was applauding at the end. 9

Lee Westwood: Had Colsaerts to thank for his sole win from three games before the singles and looked completely out of sorts on his eighth cup appearance. Came good when it mattered with a 3&2 win over Kuchar on Sunday. 7

USA

Keegan Bradley: Brought enormous energy and enthusiasm to his partnership with Mickelson, not to mention three points from three matches, including a record-equalling 7&6 thrashing of Westwood and Donald. Only defeat was to world number one McIlroy in singles. 8

Jason Dufner: Won two of his three matches before the singles and looked amazingly calm throughout the week on his debut. Also beat Hanson on Sunday in a losing cause. 7

Jim Furyk: Clearly chosen as a wild card due to his experience, but was only used twice before Sunday with one win and one defeat alongside Snedeker. Led Garcia by one with two play in singles but bogeyed the last two holes to lose. 4

Dustin Johnson: Justified his wild card with two fourball wins with Kuchar, holing a crucial long birdie putt on the 17th hole of the win over Colsaerts and Lawrie. Also beat Colsaerts 3&2 on Sunday. 8

Zach Johnson: Won three points out of four and helped stem the European tide on Sunday with a cool win over McDowell, closing the match out with four straight pars. 7

Matt Kuchar: Won both his team games alongside Dustin Johnson, including the vital one over Colsaerts and Lawrie, but lost to a previously off-colour Westwood in the singles, never leading in the match. 5

Phil Mickelson: His previous appearance at Celtic Manor made him the American with the most defeats - 17 - in cup history, but what a difference it made to have Bradley as a partner. Did little wrong in singles either but was beaten by an inspired birdie-birdie finish from Rose. 7

Webb Simpson: The serious Simpson relished his partnership with the laid-back Watson, the two major winners combining for two wins out of three, but lost singles match to Poulter in a crucial contest. 5

Brandt Snedeker: Cracked under the pressure in the opening match on Friday with a wild tee shot on the 18th, but gained revenge with Furyk over McIlroy and McDowell a day later. Hammered by Lawrie in singles. 4

Steve Stricker: No doubt chosen as a wild card largely to partner Woods, the veteran was off form and slumped to three defeats with the former world number one. Made brave par on 18th in crucial singles against Kaymer, but only after a bogey on 17th proved the difference. 4

Bubba Watson: Claimed two points out of three alongside Simpson and responsible for the new trend of encouraging fans to be as loud as possible while hitting opening tee shots. Sent off first in the singles but beaten by Donald. 5

Tiger Woods: Joined Mickelson on 17 defeats thanks to his three losses with Stricker and was left out of a session for the first time in his Ryder Cup or Presidents Cup career. Also sent out last in the singles and ended up gifting Europe overall victory by halving his match with Molinari. 3

[Johnhw2]

Hunter has a winning record in ryder cup which no one on the team could say they did before the current RC. While Hunter wasnt in good form leading up to the RC, he did shot the low round at East Lake (tied for low round with Webb Simpson). Some of the Euro team didnt have good form coming in either, Lee W, Martin K, Graeme M to name a few but they are match play winners. I contend Mahan has shown it is a match play winner too with a 4-1 President's cup record last year this time. Some guys  win in match play when they are not in top form and when they arent winning in medal or stroke play tournys. I felt this way at the time of selection but held back until we see the results. I dont know how Hunter (and Rickie who is cut from the same cloth as Hunter) could have been worse than Stricker and Fuyrk. I contend they were on the team based upon being cronies of DL3 and on old form.... Hunter has been working on his chipping hard for two years since the flubbed last RC....I believe he would be ready to win points and could play with Tiger...they are friends...so rather than let Tiger make the Stricker pick DL3 should have gone Hunter.  Why did Jose M O say he was suprised Hunter wasnt on the RC team...

The captain didnt make the right picks for the team and didnt really provide an emotional ist as JMO did for the euro's... that is what is missing as much as holing putts or setting up the course or picking experienced steady players....

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by Golf Man

Quote:

Originally Posted by k-troop

You're all winners!! What a crock.

These are the "alternative" ratings - actual ratings (courtesy of Sky) _ i'd disagree with most of them

Europe

Nicolas Colsaerts: Simply sensational in carding eight birdies and an eagle to carry Westwood to a fourballs win over Woods and Stricker, but was unable to reproduce that form and lost his other three games. 7

Luke Donald: Produced one of the moments of the week with his tee shot to the 17th to help secure a dramatic win on Saturday evening alongside Garcia, and led from the front with victory over Watson in the opening singles match. 7

Sergio Garcia: Admitted he was not at his best in claiming one win from this three matches before the singles, but then produced a battling victory over Furyk on Sunday, winning the last two holes after never being in front since the second. 7

Peter Hanson: Out of sorts and managed just two birdies in his only appearance before the singles, a 5&4 fourballs defeat that saw him and Lawrie six down after seven. Battled hard but lost singles match to Dufner. 5

Martin Kaymer: The former world number one could have been knocked out of the team in the last week of qualifying after a poor run of form, and lost his only game before the singles. But the German showed nerves of steel to win the decisive point in the singles to spark delirious scenes on the 18th green. 8

Paul Lawrie: In his first appearance for 13 years, the Scot managed just four birdies in two fourball defeats, but then made four and an eagle in dispatching Snedeker 5&3 in the singles. 7

Graeme McDowell: Apparently did not expect to play twice on the opening day but was kept alongside McIlroy after their opening foursomes win. Subsequently lost next two games and was left out of Saturday fourballs before losing to Zach Johnson in singles. 5

Rory McIlroy: Played well enough to claim more than two points from four games before the singles, three of which went to the 18th. Amazingly misjudged the time zones for his singles match, arriving at the course just 10 minutes before teeing off, but never trailed in a 2&1 win. 8

Francesco Molinari: Without his brother Edoardo this time, lost both of his team games but unlucky to initially partner a seriously off-form Westwood. Halved with Woods in the final singles after the trophy had been retained. 6

Ian Poulter: The undoubted star of the first two days, winning all three of his matches and controversially rested on Friday afternoon. Birdied the last five holes in Saturday's fourballs win and beat Webb Simpson in singles by winning the last two holes. 10

Justin Rose: Played better than his record of two wins and two losses before the singles suggested and proved it with birdies on the 17th and 18th to beat Mickelson; even the American was applauding at the end. 9

Lee Westwood: Had Colsaerts to thank for his sole win from three games before the singles and looked completely out of sorts on his eighth cup appearance. Came good when it mattered with a 3&2 win over Kuchar on Sunday. 7

USA

Keegan Bradley: Brought enormous energy and enthusiasm to his partnership with Mickelson, not to mention three points from three matches, including a record-equalling 7&6 thrashing of Westwood and Donald. Only defeat was to world number one McIlroy in singles. 8

Jason Dufner: Won two of his three matches before the singles and looked amazingly calm throughout the week on his debut. Also beat Hanson on Sunday in a losing cause. 7

Jim Furyk: Clearly chosen as a wild card due to his experience, but was only used twice before Sunday with one win and one defeat alongside Snedeker. Led Garcia by one with two play in singles but bogeyed the last two holes to lose. 4

Dustin Johnson: Justified his wild card with two fourball wins with Kuchar, holing a crucial long birdie putt on the 17th hole of the win over Colsaerts and Lawrie. Also beat Colsaerts 3&2 on Sunday. 8

Zach Johnson: Won three points out of four and helped stem the European tide on Sunday with a cool win over McDowell, closing the match out with four straight pars. 7

Matt Kuchar: Won both his team games alongside Dustin Johnson, including the vital one over Colsaerts and Lawrie, but lost to a previously off-colour Westwood in the singles, never leading in the match. 5

Phil Mickelson: His previous appearance at Celtic Manor made him the American with the most defeats - 17 - in cup history, but what a difference it made to have Bradley as a partner. Did little wrong in singles either but was beaten by an inspired birdie-birdie finish from Rose. 7

Webb Simpson: The serious Simpson relished his partnership with the laid-back Watson, the two major winners combining for two wins out of three, but lost singles match to Poulter in a crucial contest. 5

Brandt Snedeker: Cracked under the pressure in the opening match on Friday with a wild tee shot on the 18th, but gained revenge with Furyk over McIlroy and McDowell a day later. Hammered by Lawrie in singles. 4

Steve Stricker: No doubt chosen as a wild card largely to partner Woods, the veteran was off form and slumped to three defeats with the former world number one. Made brave par on 18th in crucial singles against Kaymer, but only after a bogey on 17th proved the difference. 4

Bubba Watson: Claimed two points out of three alongside Simpson and responsible for the new trend of encouraging fans to be as loud as possible while hitting opening tee shots. Sent off first in the singles but beaten by Donald. 5

Tiger Woods: Joined Mickelson on 17 defeats thanks to his three losses with Stricker and was left out of a session for the first time in his Ryder Cup or Presidents Cup career. Also sent out last in the singles and ended up gifting Europe overall victory by halving his match with Molinari. 3

Wow that's biased. Westwood and Dufner with the same rating? Okly dokly. Dustin Johnson rated lower than McIlroy? Stricker rated higher than Tiger?

Worst. Article. Ever.

[jamo]

These are the "alternative" ratings - actual ratings (courtesy of Sky) _ i'd disagree with most of them

Europe

Nicolas Colsaerts: Simply sensational in carding eight birdies and an eagle to carry Westwood to a fourballs win over Woods and Stricker, but was unable to reproduce that form and lost his other three games. 7 Luke Donald: Produced one of the moments of the week with his tee shot to the 17th to help secure a dramatic win on Saturday evening alongside Garcia, and led from the front with victory over Watson in the opening singles match. 7 Sergio Garcia: Admitted he was not at his best in claiming one win from this three matches before the singles, but then produced a battling victory over Furyk on Sunday, winning the last two holes after never being in front since the second. 7 Peter Hanson: Out of sorts and managed just two birdies in his only appearance before the singles, a 5&4 fourballs defeat that saw him and Lawrie six down after seven. Battled hard but lost singles match to Dufner. 5 Martin Kaymer: The former world number one could have been knocked out of the team in the last week of qualifying after a poor run of form, and lost his only game before the singles. But the German showed nerves of steel to win the decisive point in the singles to spark delirious scenes on the 18th green. 8 Paul Lawrie: In his first appearance for 13 years, the Scot managed just four birdies in two fourball defeats, but then made four and an eagle in dispatching Snedeker 5&3 in the singles. 7 Graeme McDowell: Apparently did not expect to play twice on the opening day but was kept alongside McIlroy after their opening foursomes win. Subsequently lost next two games and was left out of Saturday fourballs before losing to Zach Johnson in singles. 5 Rory McIlroy: Played well enough to claim more than two points from four games before the singles, three of which went to the 18th. Amazingly misjudged the time zones for his singles match, arriving at the course just 10 minutes before teeing off, but never trailed in a 2&1 win. 8 Francesco Molinari: Without his brother Edoardo this time, lost both of his team games but unlucky to initially partner a seriously off-form Westwood. Halved with Woods in the final singles after the trophy had been retained. 6 Ian Poulter: The undoubted star of the first two days, winning all three of his matches and controversially rested on Friday afternoon. Birdied the last five holes in Saturday's fourballs win and beat Webb Simpson in singles by winning the last two holes. 10 Justin Rose: Played better than his record of two wins and two losses before the singles suggested and proved it with birdies on the 17th and 18th to beat Mickelson; even the American was applauding at the end. 9 Lee Westwood: Had Colsaerts to thank for his sole win from three games before the singles and looked completely out of sorts on his eighth cup appearance. Came good when it mattered with a 3&2 win over Kuchar on Sunday. 7

USA

Keegan Bradley: Brought enormous energy and enthusiasm to his partnership with Mickelson, not to mention three points from three matches, including a record-equalling 7&6 thrashing of Westwood and Donald. Only defeat was to world number one McIlroy in singles. 8 Jason Dufner: Won two of his three matches before the singles and looked amazingly calm throughout the week on his debut. Also beat Hanson on Sunday in a losing cause. 7 Jim Furyk: Clearly chosen as a wild card due to his experience, but was only used twice before Sunday with one win and one defeat alongside Snedeker. Led Garcia by one with two play in singles but bogeyed the last two holes to lose. 4 Dustin Johnson: Justified his wild card with two fourball wins with Kuchar, holing a crucial long birdie putt on the 17th hole of the win over Colsaerts and Lawrie. Also beat Colsaerts 3&2 on Sunday. 8 Zach Johnson: Won three points out of four and helped stem the European tide on Sunday with a cool win over McDowell, closing the match out with four straight pars. 7 Matt Kuchar: Won both his team games alongside Dustin Johnson, including the vital one over Colsaerts and Lawrie, but lost to a previously off-colour Westwood in the singles, never leading in the match. 5 Phil Mickelson: His previous appearance at Celtic Manor made him the American with the most defeats - 17 - in cup history, but what a difference it made to have Bradley as a partner. Did little wrong in singles either but was beaten by an inspired birdie-birdie finish from Rose. 7 Webb Simpson: The serious Simpson relished his partnership with the laid-back Watson, the two major winners combining for two wins out of three, but lost singles match to Poulter in a crucial contest. 5 Brandt Snedeker: Cracked under the pressure in the opening match on Friday with a wild tee shot on the 18th, but gained revenge with Furyk over McIlroy and McDowell a day later. Hammered by Lawrie in singles. 4 Steve Stricker: No doubt chosen as a wild card largely to partner Woods, the veteran was off form and slumped to three defeats with the former world number one. Made brave par on 18th in crucial singles against Kaymer, but only after a bogey on 17th proved the difference. 4 Bubba Watson: Claimed two points out of three alongside Simpson and responsible for the new trend of encouraging fans to be as loud as possible while hitting opening tee shots. Sent off first in the singles but beaten by Donald. 5 Tiger Woods: Joined Mickelson on 17 defeats thanks to his three losses with Stricker and was left out of a session for the first time in his Ryder Cup or Presidents Cup career. Also sent out last in the singles and ended up gifting Europe overall victory by halving his match with Molinari. 3

People seem to be forgetting that one missed putt by Martin Kaymer or a made one by Jim Furyk would have won that match for the U.S (assuming Tiger caring on the 18th hole would win him that match). The outlook would have been much more rosy had a few things gone the other way.

[Monte the Bear]

Originally Posted by k-troop

You're all winners!! What a crock.

Words fail me. That was just a journo writing something amusing - his description of Dufner...oh, never mind.

[WWBDD]

Since Kaymer's putt, this thread has been hilarious.

[sean_miller]

I'm no Woods fanboy, but seriously? BTW Molinari in two RC appearances has earned a total of 1 point (two half points).

Francesco Molinari: Without his brother Edoardo this time, lost both of his team games but unlucky to initially partner a seriously off-form Westwood. Halved with Woods in the final singles after the trophy had been retained. 6

Tiger Woods: Joined Mickelson on 17 defeats thanks to his three losses with Stricker and was left out of a session for the first time in his Ryder Cup or Presidents Cup career. Also sent out last in the singles and ended up gifting Europe overall victory by halving his match with Molinari. 3