2013 Players at TPC Sawgrass, Tiger and Sergio Feud Discussion Thread

[boogielicious]

Luckily, The Hubble Telescope was following Tiger's round.  NASA confirmed with Hubble images and Global Positioning Satellite data that Tiger, in fact, was within 0.124 meters from the actual crossing point.  I am just disappointed that the European Union Space Agency did not confirm NASA findings considering the importance of this event.

[RonTheSavage]

Are we still having a discussion about Tiger pulling a club from his bag 49 yards away from his playing partner? Sergio is not a rookie, he has to know by now that this is the circus that follows Tiger from tournament to tournament. I guess he heard Tiger pull his driver on 18 also that caused him to rinse those two balls huh?

Im not buying the marshalls story just yet. Tiger Woods is very guarded with the media. I dont think he would speak that freely in an interview while lying at the same time. Not saying the marshall is flat out lying either but it could be some sort of miscommunication.............it happens. I guess the TW haters are grasping for any negative to talk about these days.

[Zwick]

Originally Posted by RonTheSavage

Are we still having a discussion about Tiger pulling a club from his bag 49 yards away from his playing partner?

Whoa, easy there. This soap opera has to continue, a lot of grown up people have nothing better to do with their time. We've got to respect this!

[RPMPIRE]

Originally Posted by RonTheSavage

Im not buying the marshalls story just yet.

I'm not buying it either. From my experience with local PGA tournaments in the Bay, most of the "marshals" who raise their arms or paddles to quiet the crowd are all volunteers or members of the golf club - in other words, they're the average Joe or Jane.

[rehmwa]

I wonder if the fact that Sergio's playing partner nailing the sweet spot on 17 had anything to do with Sergio also going for it a 2nd time instead of playing it safe......

Frankly, Sergio's final tee to 17 was the shot that Tiger was BEGGING for....

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by k-troop

Just fanning the flames, looking for their 2 minutes of fame.  I agree this doesn't mean Tiger lied--there could have been any of a number of people Tiger would casually refer to as "Marshal".  But on the other hand, if he would lie about such a non-issue, it does say something about his character.

I agree that it would say something about Tiger's character if he lied, but I think it already says something about his character that he took none of the onus originally, regardless of whether or not the marshal said anything to him.  We love the game of golf, partially because of the integrity, and one phrase I hear on here all the time (usually in reference to one's ball when it comes to rules questions - but it applies to etiquette as well, in my opinion) is "ultimately it's the responsibility of the player."  And no person in the world knows better the circus that follows Tiger Woods when he plays than Tiger himself, so he should be fully aware of how his crowd may react to him at any given moment.  I believe the actual pulling of the club early is an honest mistake and don't fault him for it, however, I believe afterwards he should have said something like "it was my mistake for not confirming for myself that Sergio had already hit."  Had he done that, this story would have died then and there.

Originally Posted by saevel25

The shocking thing was, Tiger rarely says anything that gives away much about what happened. He doesn't like to add fuel to the fire. I am not sure if its because it was Sergio. If these two really just do hate each other. Tiger never let anything slip when it came to Phil, back when the whole, "Tiger-Phil" rivalry going on. Its just strange that he would say a Marshall told him Sergio has hit. I've been to plenty of tournaments, and the marshals are really strict, and they take there job seriously. So when they are told not to talk to the players, i believe the Marshal over Tiger in this case. Which the question must be ask, why would Tiger, a usually very PR, say things by the book type of guy let this slip. To me its just says, he rather shift blame away from himself a bit because he knows he was in the wrong.

On what Sergio was talking about,

Which i must reiterate, Tiger woods is popular, the crowd gets excited by every little thing he does. He knows this, and he must know his presence has an influence on people around him. To be considerate of other golfer's. Look at what Jack did in the British Open for Tom Watson. He sank that long putt, the crowd erupts like he won. Jack quieted the crowd to give Tom Watson his fair shot. Jack understood his presence and how it influenced people, not just for his advantage over other golfers, but how the crowd might react. I am not saying he must tell them not to get excited for a shot, and how that effects other pairings  (group infront or behind you, or on a hole near you), but for your own playing partner in the same group. Yea, Tiger should have paid more attention to his presence. To say Tiger doesn't know he has this same presences i BS, he knows how the crowd is going to react around him. So if it was intentional or not, Tiger was in the wrong to do any action that might have caused the crowd to be disturbing to another player. Ignorance doesn't put someone in the clear.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by RonTheSavage

Are we still having a discussion about Tiger pulling a club from his bag 49 yards away from his playing partner? Sergio is not a rookie, he has to know by now that this is the circus that follows Tiger from tournament to tournament. I guess he heard Tiger pull his driver on 18 also that caused him to rinse those two balls huh?

Im not buying the marshalls story just yet. Tiger Woods is very guarded with the media. I dont think he would speak that freely in an interview while lying at the same time. Not saying the marshall is flat out lying either but it could be some sort of miscommunication.............it happens. I guess the TW haters are grasping for any negative to talk about these days.

Umm, doesn't this exact same thing apply to Tiger as well?  It's 100% on Sergio to wait to hit his shot (when it's his turn) because he should know that Tiger is going to be doing something that will cause a crowd reaction right when he's trying to hit?  Yeah, that seems fair.  And, no, I am not a Tiger hater.

This makes me think of Spider Man and his whole "with great power comes great responsibility" mantra.  Tiger is the one who brings the giant crowds, so it's on him moreso than any other player to do his best to make sure things are fair for everybody.  Yes, the other players have to know and prepare for it, but it still should fall on Tiger to do (or not do) whatever he can to protect the rest of the field.

[colin007]

Whether or not a marshal said anything to Tiger is NOT THE ISSUE!!!  The issue is that Sergio made the choice to not back off once the noise started, which was several seconds before he started his swing!!!!

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by colin007

Whether or not a marshal said anything to Tiger is NOT THE ISSUE!!!  The issue is that Sergio made the choice to not back off once the noise started, which was several seconds before he started his swing!!!!

You are right, but some people here are like a terrier holding one end of a rope toy.  He won't let go even when he's hanging off the ground by his teeth.  He has no idea why he does it, but he just can't let go.  He is going to keep pulling until you let go, and then he will think that he won, never realizing that you simply got tired of the game.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by colin007

Whether or not a marshal said anything to Tiger is NOT THE ISSUE!!!  The issue is that Sergio made the choice to not back off once the noise started, which was several seconds before he started his swing!!!!

That's debatable.  The one replay I saw with the split screen had Tiger pulling the club several seconds before Sergio swung, but the noise started pretty much right at that go-no go point for Sergio.

[RonTheSavage]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

I agree that it would say something about Tiger's character if he lied, but I think it already says something about his character that he took none of the onus originally, regardless of whether or not the marshal said anything to him.  We love the game of golf, partially because of the integrity, and one phrase I hear on here all the time (usually in reference to one's ball when it comes to rules questions - but it applies to etiquette as well, in my opinion) is "ultimately it's the responsibility of the player."  And no person in the world knows better the circus that follows Tiger Woods when he plays than Tiger himself, so he should be fully aware of how his crowd may react to him at any given moment.  I believe the actual pulling of the club early is an honest mistake and don't fault him for it, however, I believe afterwards he should have said something like "it was my mistake for not confirming for myself that Sergio had already hit."  Had he done that, this story would have died then and there.

Agreed.

Umm, doesn't this exact same thing apply to Tiger as well?  It's 100% on Sergio to wait to hit his shot (when it's his turn) because he should know that Tiger is going to be doing something that will cause a crowd reaction right when he's trying to hit?  Yeah, that seems fair.  And, no, I am not a Tiger hater.

This makes me think of Spider Man and his whole "with great power comes great responsibility" mantra.  Tiger is the one who brings the giant crowds, so it's on him moreso than any other player to do his best to make sure things are fair for everybody.  Yes, the other players have to know and prepare for it, but it still should fall on Tiger to do (or not do) whatever he can to protect the rest of the field.

Very true and he always have which is why I lean towards believing Tiger in this situation. One thing I've read and witnessed over the years is that Tiger has always been "aware" of his playing partners.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by albatross

Oh give me a break.  Yea, Tiger doesn't know the difference between the marshals and the escorts.  Laughable.

Why? They're dressed the same. They simply have a different word on the badge they wear on a neck lanyard - which for all we know could have been flipped around (they tend to get that way).

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

I agree that it would say something about Tiger's character if he lied, but I think it already says something about his character that he took none of the onus originally, regardless of whether or not the marshal said anything to him.

Tiger wasn't even aware that there was a problem until several holes later DURING a rain delay, no? It's not like Sergio said "hey bud, you know when you drew your club I was mid-swing and it disrupted me."

So it's a bit weird. By saying "a marshal told me he'd hit" he's basically saying "I didn't do anything wrong." And I don't know about you, but when someone with Sergio's history immediately goes to the press to ply his case rather than coming to speak to me like a man, then I get how Tiger might feel he's not exactly owed much if you know what I mean…

[RonTheSavage]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

That's debatable.  The one replay I saw with the split screen had Tiger pulling the club several seconds before Sergio swung, but the noise started pretty much right at that go-no go point for Sergio.

How many times has Tiger stopped in the middle of his down swing because of an idiot photographer?

Now if this had come from just about anybody else on tour I would take it more serious. But from this guy..........

[3putter]

When you look at the video, you will notice Tiger making a gesture to the marshall wearing a "Greg Norman" hat and pointing to Sergio, and the Marshall giving an Ok sign. That was when Sergio was just about to hit. As for Tiger not knowing the difference between a marshal and an escort, that's not so hard, they both dress alike in most tourneys. This is really embarrassing for the game. To have such whinny crap made for reality TV go on at your showcase event is really stupid. Nip this sh!t in the bud and move the heck on.

We all saw that Sergio wasn't on his backswing when the applause started, he had ample time to back off the shot. He hit a bad shot and wanted to blame someone else. It just shows how much of a mental midget he is. I really liked him when I started watching golf religiously, but just couldn't stand his stupidity any longer.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by RonTheSavage

Very true and he always have which is why I lean towards believing Tiger in this situation. One thing I've read and witnessed over the years is that Tiger has always been "aware" of his playing partners.

Exactly.  I believe him too!  We haven't heard of a situation like this arising before, and I think that it's probably because Tiger is usually really good and contientious about his playing partners.  So what's the harm in saying "my bad" this one time?  In general, regardless of the situation - I guess you could call it a pet peeve of mine - I don't like hearing the "it's not my fault" excuse, even when it is warranted.  Yes, this goes both ways.  Sergio is emotional so you know he's going to have that initial reaction every time, however, he could have (and should have) blown it off after that.  He should have said "I hit a bad shot" and nothing else.  Tiger should have said "I should have double checked that he already hit" and nothing else.  If that all happened, we're not talking about this.

Originally Posted by iacas

Tiger wasn't even aware that there was a problem until several holes later DURING a rain delay, no? It's not like Sergio said "hey bud, you know when you drew your club I was mid-swing and it disrupted me."

I just mean then ... when he was first asked about it, instead of "the marshal told me it was ok" he should have then just said "my bad" and moved on.

Originally Posted by RonTheSavage

How many times has Tiger stopped in the middle of his down swing because of an idiot photographer?

Tiger is a freak of nature and I have yet to see anybody else anywhere, ever, do that.  Regardless, it's certainly not something anybody should be expected to have to do.

[Rick Martin]

A spectator who was at TPC and followed TW on Sunday said on Sirius PGA talk radio yesterday that Tiger already had the club pulled and was "shushing" fans before Sergio hit. Don't think he needs to do more on his part.  Its been known forever that anyone paired w/ Tiger has to deal with the large following that he brings - and a disadvantage because of the noise, movement that comes with it.

Hope the two get paired at Merion final group Sunday. Golf needs this kind of rivalry.

[RonTheSavage]

Originally Posted by Golfingdad

Exactly.  I believe him too!  We haven't heard of a situation like this arising before, and I think that it's probably because Tiger is usually really good and contientious about his playing partners.  So what's the harm in saying "my bad" this one time?  In general, regardless of the situation - I guess you could call it a pet peeve of mine - I don't like hearing the "it's not my fault" excuse, even when it is warranted.  Yes, this goes both ways.  Sergio is emotional so you know he's going to have that initial reaction every time, however, he could have (and should have) blown it off after that.  He should have said "I hit a bad shot" and nothing else.  Tiger should have said "I should have double checked that he already hit" and nothing else.  If that all happened, we're not talking about this.

I just mean then ... when he was first asked about it, instead of "the marshal told me it was ok" he should have then just said "my bad" and moved on.

Tiger is a freak of nature and I have yet to see anybody else anywhere, ever, do that.  Regardless, it's certainly not something anybody should be expected to have to do.

I probably should've been more clear here. I didnt expect Sergio to stop his downswing at all, because thats an injury waiting to happen. It's just that everyone including TW has to deal with random noises from time to time. Next thing you know Sergio will be yelling at a bird for chirping too loudly. I agree with you that TW could've easily said my bad or something. But if it's true that TW was actually shushing the gallery then all bets are off. Thats above and beyond.

[austin]

Tiger Woods-Probably the greatest golf who ever lived, and just as big an *******. I'm with Sergio. And, he signed an incorrect scorecard at the Masters and should have been disqualified. He took an 8 on 14 at the Masters and signed for a 6.  This is not rocket science; he was disqualified. Anybody else does that at the Masters; they're gone. I don't care what anybody says, it was bullshit clear and simple. After the wimpy tournament officials ruled in his favor, Tiger could have still made it right by withdrawing. I, and many others, would have greatly respected that, and he would have been well on the way to salvaging the public's perception of his character. But, I forgot, Tiger doesn't give a damn about that. So be it, Tiger. Win all the tournaments you want, and by the way, you still haven't beaten Jack's major record, and at the end of the day, all you are is an ******* who can play golf.

[Mulligan Jeff]

Put Sergio in Tiger's shoes at Masters when Tiger's approach hits the pin and goes in the water. Sergio would never overcome that pitfall.