Ban Belly Putters?

[Kieran123]

Originally Posted by sean_miller

If someone with a modern driver and low compression ball still needs more distance, that person needs to learn how to swing the club faster and hit the ball on the button. People have an enormous capacity to be useless and a longer ball / driver combo will only reset the baseline. Bad golfers will always find a way to be bad. Go back and give someone in the 1970s a decent 2012 ball and driver combination and they won't believe it when you tell them how many adult males still can't hit the ball > 200yards.

So true.

[Texian]

Dear Tiger,

Keep your cotton pickin' hands off my long putter.

[bplewis24]

Interesting choice of words.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by SVTGolfer

"anchored" Hahahahahahaha. Psshh, You heard Nick Faldo whining about it on Golf channel, that's where you "heard" it.

My argument still stands... If belly putters are illegal then so are adjustable drivers...

Not necessarily.  I just got an email today from Golfweek that says the USGA and the R&A; are still looking hard at the belly putters.  The only bone of contention appears to be the act of anchoring them, resulting in a pivot rather than a swing.  So stay tuned.......

[Kujan]

I like Tiger's solution: putter can be no longer than your wedges.

[Ernest Jones]

Originally Posted by Texian

Dear Tiger,

Keep your cotton pickin' hands off my long putter.

Originally Posted by bplewis24

Interesting choice of words.

Holy Smoking Gun, not very subtle was it.

[Stretch]

Originally Posted by Kujan

I like Tiger's solution: putter can be no longer than your wedges.

I dislike Tiger's solution. I am 6'7" and my (otherwise entirely conventional) putter is at least an inch longer than my pitching wedge.

[John Marat]

I compare this same subject to "two-handed" bowling that is taking shape on the PBA.

The numbers do not lie, belly and long putters in no way or shape give you an unfair advantage over the competition. They should NOT be banned for the sake of it being a different method. Try to be a little more progressive in your thinking and understanding.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by John Marat

They should NOT be banned for the sake of it being a different method. Try to be a little more progressive in your thinking and understanding.

I don't think that's a valid argument. That's your opinion, but telling others to be more "progressive" in their thinking is insulting.

Many feel the game of golf is meant to be played a certain way, and that way is not by anchoring. You can disagree, but tone down the mild insults, eh?

[Kieran123]

Originally Posted by Texian

Dear Tiger,

Keep your cotton pickin' hands off my long putter.

You are the type of person who society should just ignore, but I can not help myself. Not because I am a fan of Tiger, but because you are a racist piece of shit.

What provoked you to say this? You jumped straight to a filthy racist response because of a man's opinion on belly putters.

Belly putters. If you sink this low over something like this, I would hate to see your opinions on other things...like black history month.

If you are so smug to post a racist remark here on this forum, throw on your white robe and do something about it.....fact is you won't. You're a coward, a racist and a ****ing joke.

May the rest of your days on this planet be spent miserable - which you clearly are.

I can see the gravestone now.

---Here lies Texian---

Remembered for being a racist

Forever alone

Easily forgotten

Not missed

[John Marat]

Originally Posted by iacas

I don't think that's a valid argument. That's your opinion, but telling others to be more "progressive" in their thinking is insulting.

Many feel the game of golf is meant to be played a certain way, and that way is not by anchoring. You can disagree, but tone down the mild insults, eh?

That was in no way meant to be an insult.

" Many feel the game of golf is meant to be played a certain way"  That is exactly what needs to change with all sports. Any time someone does something out of the normal people want to destroy their method even if it doesn't create an advantage.

I was simply saying golf will improve if we go to a more "progressive" approach going forward.

[SVTGolfer]

Originally Posted by iacas

I don't think that's a valid argument. That's your opinion, but telling others to be more "progressive" in their thinking is insulting.

Many feel the game of golf is meant to be played a certain way, and that way is not by anchoring. You can disagree, but tone down the mild insults, eh?

I guess he ruffled your feathers there oh wise God of the golf intraweb forums...  It seems lie anytime anyone disagrees with you or has an opinion you don't like you make it a point to discredit them right away. Happens more often than not around here.

I happen to agree with him.

And since you tried to tell me I didn't make an argument, which I did, but let me clarify it for you: using a belly putter is no more of an advantage than using an adjustable driver. THERE! Is that worded simple enough for you?

[glock35ipsc]

Originally Posted by newtogolf

Since I don't use a long / belly putter I'm not very concerned about the outcome, but I do find it interesting that the USGA is considering banning them while others are discussing making the holes on greens larger to make the game easier.

I was kind of thinking along those same lines.

Originally Posted by SVTGolfer

I dont understand why people are so quick to discredit and want to ban equipment that works or gives another player a competitive edge… Its not an "advantage" its just an edge. Meaning someone may putt better with a belly putter or a long putter because its more comfortable for them (i.e. back issues, etc…) or it fits their eye and helps them align better. Its no different than having an adjustable driver or a longer than 45" driver. People take an adjustable driver and if set at nuetral they slice it just like any other driver, but once they adjust it to draw, etc... then they hit it straight or correct their miss enough to stay in the fairway. Now that player is taking an edge also because whereas they would normally be playing from the rough constantly or taking an OB drop often, theyre now in play in the fairway. This alone can bring a high 20+ handicap player down to a 15 or lower handicap because keeping the ball in play is huge! Why aren't people getting all up in arms over the adjustable driver movement? 3 years ago there were only a couple adjustable drivers out there, and now, EVERY manufacturer sells one.

If Scotty Cameron makes one, then its legal in my book… Hahaha

I don't agree with your comparison of a belly/long putter and an adjustable driver.  The playing characteristics of a typical long putter cannot be changed during a round like an adjustable driver can.  The driver can be tweaked on the range to fit one's swing for the day if needed, then taken to the course..... or they can go grab a fade bias/draw bias/neutral face/high hitter/low hitter out of the trunk. I view the adjustable driver like this: a way to get out of a real driver fitting and end up with a really cool gadget!

Otherwise, I agree.  I'm all for most anything that helps the regular Joe have more fun with the game.

[bplewis24]

Originally Posted by John Marat

The numbers do not lie, belly and long putters in no way or shape give you an unfair advantage over the competition.

This argument is brought up a lot, but I think it has a ton of holes in it.

1) Using different general putting statistics like putts per green or top 10 putting doesn't prove, nor disprove, anything.

2) There are no specific and scientific studies (that I'm aware of) that have been done on the topic.

In order for a study to prove anything, it would have to compare each individual golfer against themselves, not against the field.  The argument, hypothetically, would be that a golfer becomes a better putter when they are allowed to anchor it against their body.  The argument is NOT that a golfer becomes the best putter in the world.  A proper study would have to show statistical data under like conditions with a large enough sample size of the same golfer with same length putts, same greens, same style putter head/face (etc), but with one sample set of data with a traditional length putter and stroke, and another that is longer and anchored against his body.

Brandon

[SVTGolfer]

Why dont we just outlaw certain putting grips then while we're at it…? Gotta have uniformity, right? I think the claw is unfair… please...(rolls eyes)

[newtogolf]

What the numbers don't show is the putting statistics of a golfer with the yips who did not have the option to go to a long or belly putter.  The numbers don't appear to be influenced by belly or long putters because some of the golfers using them made the switch when they encountered problems with conventional putters.  You have to look at how they have impacted the individuals who made the switch.  What happens to Adam Scott or Keegan Bradley's putting average if long/belly putters are banned?  Are they able to maintain their tour status and world ranking if they are banned?

Originally Posted by John Marat

I compare this same subject to "two-handed" bowling that is taking shape on the PBA.

The numbers do not lie, belly and long putters in no way or shape give you an unfair advantage over the competition. They should NOT be banned for the sake of it being a different method. Try to be a little more progressive in your thinking and understanding.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by John Marat

That was in no way meant to be an insult.

"Many feel the game of golf is meant to be played a certain way"  That is exactly what needs to change with all sports. Any time someone does something out of the normal people want to destroy their method even if it doesn't create an advantage.

I was simply saying golf will improve if we go to a more "progressive" approach going forward.

Fair enough on the first sentence.

I see golf as a game meant to be played by swinging the club, not by anchoring it to your body. The ruling bodies felt that the game was "not meant to be played" by standing astride the line of your putt, for example - I see this as similar to that. This is golf - it's a game in which we stand to the side of the golf ball and swing the club freely gripping it with our hands. It's not a game played straddling the line of the putt or with clubs anchored to our bodies. It's not a game played by using a golf club like a pool cue. Etc.

Originally Posted by SVTGolfer

I guess he ruffled your feathers there oh wise God of the golf intraweb forums...  It seems lie anytime anyone disagrees with you or has an opinion you don't like you make it a point to discredit them right away. Happens more often than not around here.

I didn't "discredit" JM. Please read my post again. If anything, his comment discredited the opinions of others who think that anchoring a club to your body as part of its standard method of use is not the way the game is meant to be played.

And cool it on the name-calling and general childishness, please.

Originally Posted by SVTGolfer

And since you tried to tell me I didn't make an argument, which I did, but let me clarify it for you: using a belly putter is no more of an advantage than using an adjustable driver. THERE! Is that worded simple enough for you?

I don't see too many people arguing that it's an "advantage." That's never been my argument.

Originally Posted by SVTGolfer

Why dont we just outlaw certain putting grips then while we're at it…? Gotta have uniformity, right? I think the claw is unfair… please...(rolls eyes)

Straw man argument. Nobody's suggesting that, and there's certainly precedent for rules that govern how you can use a golf club and how you have to stand while using the golf club. You can't hit putts with the butt end of your putter and you can't stand astride the line of your putt, for example.

[inthehole]

Originally Posted by SVTGolfer

using a belly putter is no more of an advantage than using an adjustable driver. THERE! Is that worded simple enough for you?

And you would be wrong.    I know a little about mechanics and physics.    An anchored system in any context is inherently more stable than a free floating system.    It baffles me how anyone can't get their head around this.    An anchored putter is a different tool and takes much of the angular movement out of the equation.     Simply put, we should all have to use the same tool for the job.   Leave the broom sticks for curling ...