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Cary Schoen and The Lower Body Lie That Is Devastating Golf (Troll Thread)


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-The Lower Body Lie That Devastates Golf- Although almost ALL modern golf instruction is a tragically flawed, cruel hoax, the area of horrendous advice that is almost universally communicated and causes the most damage is how to move the body (Pivot) in order to generate the forces necessary to whirl the arms, hands, and club into the ball. The three main ways that golfers struggle with their downstroke pivot sequence are: 1) Overuse of the Lower Body 2) Wrong Sequence of Movement 3) Wrong Movement Direction In my opinion, the problems that the aforementioned cause are the biggest destroyer of good golf than any of the other components that make up the golf stroke. Now, you can certainly still play poorly with a good pivot, but we just don't see it often. What we do see regularly are players that swing the club in a reasonable manner with their hands and arms, but still play AWFUL golf. Many of the prescribed remedies that instructors offer to struggling golfers include: 1) Be more aggressive with the lower body 2) Transfer your weight sooner and get more on your left side at impact 3) Bump or slide your hips toward the target to initiate your downswing The commentators during the PGA Tour telecasts exacerbate the problem by offering the diagnosis for poor shots as "he hung back on that one and didn't transfer his weight to his left side in time." The strange thing is that this diagnosis is offered for whether the player blocked the shot to the right, or pulled it to the left ??? Cary Schoen
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Many of the prescribed remedies that instructors offer to struggling golfers include:

1) Be more aggressive with the lower body

2) Transfer your weight sooner and get more on your left side at impact

3) Bump or slide your hips toward the target to initiate your downswing

So these are the "lies"?  I agree with #2 and #3 to a point.  What good golfer doesn't have their weight forward at impact?  T he average PGA Tour player has between 80-95% of his pressure on his front foot at impact. The average amateur has 55%.

Mike McLoughlin

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The three main ways that golfers struggle with their downstroke pivot sequence are:

1) Overuse of the Lower Body

2) Wrong Sequence of Movement

3) Wrong Movement Direction

In my opinion, the problems that the aforementioned cause are the biggest destroyer of good golf than any of the other components that make up the golf stroke. Now, you can certainly still play poorly with a good pivot, but we just don't see it often. What we do see regularly are players that swing the club in a reasonable manner with their hands and arms, but still play AWFUL golf.

Many of the prescribed remedies that instructors offer to struggling golfers include:

1) Be more aggressive with the lower body

2) Transfer your weight sooner and get more on your left side at impact

3) Bump or slide your hips toward the target to initiate your downswing

I'm confused, as well. So you're saying that a poor pivot is the reason most golfers struggle, but that the fix isn't the lower body motion?

Bill

“By three methods we may learn wisdom: First, by reflection, which is noblest; Second, by imitation, which is easiest; and third by experience, which is the bitterest.” - Confucius

My Swing Thread

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Is there some kind of product I can buy to help me understand your post?
  • Upvote 2

Yours in earnest, Jason.
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very strange because I can see in most impact position slow motion video that most of the weight is on the front foot by the time of impact... are my eyes lying to me?

:adams: / :tmade: / :edel: / :aimpoint: / :ecco: / :bushnell: / :gamegolf: / 

Eyad

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I'm saying that the reason that most golfer's struggle IS a poor pivot and the fix IS in fact the lower body motion

Oh. I didn't get that from this:

-The Lower Body Lie That Devastates Golf-

Although almost ALL modern golf instruction is a tragically flawed, cruel hoax, the area of horrendous advice that is almost universally communicated and causes the most damage is how to move the body (Pivot) in order to generate the forces necessary to whirl the arms, hands, and club into the ball.

I thought you were one of those anti-modernist golf movement people.

Bill

“By three methods we may learn wisdom: First, by reflection, which is noblest; Second, by imitation, which is easiest; and third by experience, which is the bitterest.” - Confucius

My Swing Thread

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Is there some kind of product I can buy to help me understand your post?

Maybe a training aid, or a video series......or, dare I hope, both?!

In David's bag....

Driver: Titleist 910 D-3;  9.5* Diamana Kai'li
3-Wood: Titleist 910F;  15* Diamana Kai'li
Hybrids: Titleist 910H 19* and 21* Diamana Kai'li
Irons: Titleist 695cb 5-Pw

Wedges: Scratch 51-11 TNC grind, Vokey SM-5's;  56-14 F grind and 60-11 K grind
Putter: Scotty Cameron Kombi S
Ball: ProV1

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Same OP post in golfwrx.

Steve

Kill slow play. Allow walking. Reduce ineffective golf instruction. Use environmentally friendly course maintenance.

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I am

So it's your position that golfers suffer from poor pivot and that the "modern" golf swing does not use lower body action?

Bill

“By three methods we may learn wisdom: First, by reflection, which is noblest; Second, by imitation, which is easiest; and third by experience, which is the bitterest.” - Confucius

My Swing Thread

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Maybe you should stick to being a player instead of a spammer Cary?-Oh wait never mind.

"The expert golfer has maximum time to make minimal compensations. The poorer player has minimal time to make maximum compensations." - And no, I'm not Mac. Please do not PM me about it. I just think he is a crazy MFer and we could all use a little more crazy sometimes.

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I thought you were one of those anti-modernist golf movement people.

I am

Maybe you should stick to being a player instead of a spammer Cary?-Oh wait never mind.

Maybe he'd be better off with a more modern golf swing.......

In David's bag....

Driver: Titleist 910 D-3;  9.5* Diamana Kai'li
3-Wood: Titleist 910F;  15* Diamana Kai'li
Hybrids: Titleist 910H 19* and 21* Diamana Kai'li
Irons: Titleist 695cb 5-Pw

Wedges: Scratch 51-11 TNC grind, Vokey SM-5's;  56-14 F grind and 60-11 K grind
Putter: Scotty Cameron Kombi S
Ball: ProV1

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That was the most unclear post I've seen in a long time.  here's the gist

What's the issue?  ( something 's wrong - guess what it is).

It must be something to do with the "lower body pivot".  (so do golfers need more or less, how - can't tell - we have to guess)

People do stuff "wrong".  (wrong in what way?  I guess we have to guess more)

Apparently the OP is implying that some instructors provide direction that's counterproductive - whatever that direction is.

even more pithy - "normal swings and instruction are flawed"  (that's it, not even an offer to do it better or different, nor how - I guess the product pitch itself is to be inferred)

I guess if someone wants to advertise a product, or discuss a theory - they'd be better off stating out outright rather than cut and paste from a horribly written sales pamphlet that clearly was NOT designed to stand on its own.

If a sales pitch is this poorly organized, why on earth would I then be interested in anything developed by the same people?

Bill - 

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"The expert golfer has maximum time to make minimal compensations. The poorer player has minimal time to make maximum compensations." - And no, I'm not Mac. Please do not PM me about it. I just think he is a crazy MFer and we could all use a little more crazy sometimes.

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Note: This thread is 3843 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

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