"Correct" pace of play

[MS256]

Personally I have found more instances of the best player in the group being the slowest than the worst player in the group.

Not my experience at all, and not by a long shot.

The number one reason by far that the better players I know don't like playing with less skilled players is that they can't possibly keep up with the same pace. Almost every week in the clubhouse I hear "I have no desire to help somebody look for their golf ball on every hole."

The disclaimer would be that I don't happen to know a single "good" player that is slow (in fact they are very fast) so my experience may not be typical.

[Lihu]

Not my experience at all, and not by a long shot.

The number one reason by far that the better players I know don't like playing with less skilled players is that they can't possibly keep up with the same pace. Almost every week in the clubhouse I hear "I have no desire to help somebody look for their golf ball on every hole."

The disclaimer would be that I don't happen to know a single "good" player that is slow (in fact they are very fast) so my experience may not be typical.

It might be possible that the 18 handicap who hits far and straight and putts like crap, would play faster than the low handicap who is more careful about his shots.

[phan52]

I don't think it needs to be more than 4 hours, but we set a time of 4:15 because our course is not easy (73.1, 138) and not everybody is a singe digit player keeping the ball consistently in front of them. But we also mandate that, if you take longer than 4:15 to play, you better finish within 12 minutes of the group in front of you. We tee off every 10 minutes and if the group in front of you is slow, you better at least keep up.

[MS256]

It might be possible that the 18 handicap who hits far and straight and putts like crap, would play faster than the low handicap who is more careful about his shots.

Maybe but I've never seen it. I have to play some pretty good golf to keep up with any on the "A" players without holding them up (and believe me I try). The last thing I want to do is slow somebody down.

I can't envision any scenario where an 18 handicapper could play with, lets say my boss, and not slow him down a lot.

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by turtleback

Personally I have found more instances of the best player in the group being the slowest than the worst player in the group.

Not my experience at all, and not by a long shot.

The number one reason by far that the better players I know don't like playing with less skilled players is that they can't possibly keep up with the same pace. Almost every week in the clubhouse I hear "I have no desire to help somebody look for their golf ball on every hole."

If that is the case, then perhaps the courses you play should be maintained in a way that is more friendly to the weaker players.  If the course is that penal, then something needs to change, either the course itself or the level of play among the clientele.

[Lihu]

Maybe but I've never seen it. I have to play some pretty good golf to keep up with any on the "A" players without holding them up (and believe me I try). The last thing I want to do is slow somebody down. I can't envision any scenario where an 18 handicapper could play with, lets say my boss, and not slow him down a lot.

Unless, it's the ones I played today who hit a really long way and managed to 3 putt everything. To be honest, I'm guessing they're single digits having a bad putting day.

[flopster]

If that is the case, then perhaps the courses you play should be maintained in a way that is more friendly to the weaker players.  If the course is that penal, then something needs to change, either the course itself or the level of play among the clientele.

That would certainly help where I play, despite the chance of an encounter with a rattlesnake I see people trekking up the hillsides in knee high grasses looking for their ball, just because of this condition we have a local rule pertaining to lost balls in "native areas" where it can be treated as a lateral hazard, the course simply does not want people walking in these areas and I think it's a good idea, however since people are determined I have always thought it would be in the courses best interest to have these areas disc and marked OB instead, that way the toughness of the course will be maintained while eliminating a lot of the delays and dangers on the course.

[mcanadiens]

For those of us blessed with plenty of courses to choose from, it's always a good idea to pick based on your skill level. Playing the up tees is obvious as well, but a tight fairway is a tight fairway.

I know I stink, so I'm giving the tougher courses a pass for the time being. Hopefully, I'll get there some day. Luckily, there are plenty of more forgiving tracks around here for me to pick from.

[colin007]

But looking through this thread it is clear to me that there is a lot of slow play attitude out there.  Too many people think their pace of play is perfect - that anyone slower is the problem, and that anyone faster is just a speed golfer.  But that they are never the problem.

im seeing this as well...

[flopster]

im seeing this as well...

This is probably very true but of course people will have to look upon themselves as if they could be the cause and obviously no one thinks they are or could be. Basically it's upon the courses to enforce pace of play policies and to try and educate as many that are willing to listen.

[mcanadiens]

Realistically, I doubt that many people on this forum are the big problems. Most of us are about their golf or we wouldn't be on here.

That, of course, doesn't mean we all shouldn't look at our habits and try to improve them.

[turtleback]

Maybe but I've never seen it. I have to play some pretty good golf to keep up with any on the "A" players without holding them up (and believe me I try). The last thing I want to do is slow somebody down.

I can't envision any scenario where an 18 handicapper could play with, lets say my boss, and not slow him down a lot.

It sounds like you play with a particular group of golfers where the better players are fast.

I play with a wide variety of people since I usually go out alone and do not belong to a single club so I  mostly play with strangers.  Particularly since I retired and moved and do not yet have any golfing buddies here.

Heck, when I played in a TST outing, the best player in our group was far and away the slowest.

So I don't now which of our experiences is more representative, but good on you if the better players play fast in your neck of the woods.

Realistically, I doubt that many people on this forum are the big problems. Most of us are about their golf or we wouldn't be on here.

That, of course, doesn't mean we all shouldn't look at our habits and try to improve them.

I disagree.  There is a lot of slow play attitude in this thread and every other pace of play thread we have.  And, as I alluded to above, I have experienced it first hand.

[Lihu]

It sounds like you play with a particular group of golfers where the better players are fast.

I play with a wide variety of people since I usually go out alone and do not belong to a single club so I  mostly play with strangers.  Particularly since I retired and moved and do not yet have any golfing buddies here.

Heck, when I played in a TST outing, the best player in our group was far and away the slowest.

So I don't now which of our experiences is more representative, but good on you if the better players play fast in your neck of the woods.

And the worst were the fastest? I recall being done 40 minutes before the other groups started to trickle in, and I believe your group was the one right behind us.

[MS256]

It sounds like you play with a particular group of golfers where the better players are fast.

I play with a wide variety of people since I usually go out alone and do not belong to a single club so I  mostly play with strangers.  Particularly since I retired and moved and do not yet have any golfing buddies here.

Heck, when I played in a TST outing, the best player in our group was far and away the slowest.

So I don't now which of our experiences is more representative, but good on you if the better players play fast in your neck of the woods.

I agree with you and would add that most of us around here (good players and bad players) are also fairly spoiled because we can almost always play fairly empty courses at whatever speed we choose. When something or someone slows us down we notice it more.

[turtleback]

And the worst were the fastest? I recall being done 40 minutes before the other groups started to trickle in, and I believe your group was the one right behind us.

Gotta read a little closer.  In my group.  Not in the outing as a whole.  And if we were that far behind you (I don't really remember) then that is just a testament to how much one slow "good player" can kill the pace for the whole group.

You are also restating (incorrectly) one of my comments in a completely different context.  I never said that the worst were the fastest, neither did that comment have to do with the outing.

[Lihu]

Gotta read a little closer.  In my group.  Not in the outing as a whole.  And if we were that far behind you (I don't really remember) then that is just a testament to how much one slow "good player" can kill the pace for the whole group.

You are also restating (incorrectly) one of my comments in a completely different context.  I never said that the worst were the fastest, neither did that comment have to do with the outing.

I was just self-deprecating myself as being the fastest and the worst.

That was a hard course. The rough was like 25 feet tall! Or was that Goose Creek?

[Meisce]

Layout of the golf course and good starters make a huge difference. The fastest course that I play has a lot of areas marked as 'environmentally sensitive'. There's a free drop ( always in the thick rough ) but you can't enter those areas, even if you can see your ball. Really speeds up the game when there's no penalty and you can't spend ages looking. I've never been waiting on that course. The starters there seem to have a lot of empowerment as well when it comes to letting people off early, or moving the order of groups depending on who's ready to go.

Some of the slowest courses I play are the tighter ones, where if you're off line you inevitably have to wait for people hitting up the adjoining fairways before you can get on with it.

I am very conscious of the fact that it usually takes me a few seconds to get comfortable over the ball, I like to take a practice swing, etc. However, I make up for it by not wasting time elsewhere, i.e. not marking my card on the green, not putting clubs back in the bag before I get in the cart, and making up my mind what to do next before it's my turn to hit.

To someone's earlier point - the slowest golfer I've ever golfed with was also the best. Problem was, he moved like he owned the golf course, especially around the greens. He was asked to leave our golf society this year, because it frustrated the rest of us so much to play with him ( we append penalty strokes in our tournaments if you finish over 15 mins after the group in front of you ).

[Golfingdad]

Layout of the golf course and good starters make a huge difference.

I agree with this.

And I play a lot of courses with these as well, however ....

There's a free drop ( always in the thick rough ) but you can't enter those areas, even if you can see your ball. Really speeds up the game when there's no penalty and you can't spend ages looking.

I've never played a course like this.  The environmentally sensitive areas around here are all lateral hazards marked with red stakes that have green tops.  This means you aren't supposed to go in there to retrieve your ball, but it also means that you drop outside of the hazard WITH a one stroke penalty.

How are your ESA's marked?

Edit: Continuing discussion on this topic moved here: http://thesandtrap.com/t/77678/esa-environmentally-sensitive-areas-as-gur .