head/eye position perception of target line in full swing

[guiseppe]

I'm trying to understand the role my head tilt and eye position affect my ability to envision the target line in the full swing. I can pick a spot in front of the ball along the target line, set up square to it and my clubface appears closed/way left of my target once I get over it.  If I can't see my target line, I have no chance of making a committed swing.

I remember at some point reading about optics, head tilt, dominant eye, etc, but can't seem to find the article again.  Any recommended reading?  I'm not just looking for tips on how to set up or how to see my target.  I want to understand "why" my ability to perceive the target line is affected by my head position.

Thank you.

[mvmac]

  guiseppe said:

I'm trying to understand the role my head tilt and eye position affect my ability to envision the target line in the full swing. I can pick a spot in front of the ball along the target line, set up square to it and my clubface appears closed/way left of my target once I get over it.  If I can't see my target line, I have no chance of making a committed swing.

I remember at some point reading about optics, head tilt, dominant eye, etc, but can't seem to find the article again.  Any recommended reading?  I'm not just looking for tips on how to set up or how to see my target.  I want to understand "why" my ability to perceive the target line is affected by my head position.

Thank you.

What shot are you trying to hit? If it's a draw you'll want to have the face aimed a little right of the final target.

For the head tilt, hopefully this will help.

[guiseppe]

mvmac:  thank you for the reply.  I had read the post about golf posture (good post.)  What I am looking for, however, is more of an explanation as to "why" as opposed to "how."

I am looking for an explanation regarding what is happening optically when I am looking at a distant target from a sideways position (i.e. set up over a golf ball as opposed to behind it where you can use both eyes when they are level)  Articles reference that golfers often times mis-align themselves because they perceive the target to be too far right, but they don't say why this happens, i.e.

http://www.academia.edu/12240565/Golfers_may_have_to_overcome_a_persistent_visuospatial_illusion

http://www.humankinetics.com/AcuCustom/Sitename/Documents/DocumentItem/02_Lier_jsep_10_0111.pdf

Other articles talk about "parallax."

What I am trying to understand is "why"--what is going on with the way I perceive distant objects when standing sideways that makes it difficult for me to see an accurate target line from the ball.

[mvmac]

  guiseppe said:

Articles reference that golfers often times mis-align themselves because they perceive the target to be too far right, but they don't say why this happens, i.e.

They are also trying to aim to a target 150 yards away when they should just be lining up to a spot 2-3 feet in front of them.

[MrDC]

Maybe this?

I struggled with alignment a lot in the past, what helped me is getting a good look behind the ball then using the clubface, it's the needle on the compass, using a spot on the grass didn't work well for me.

[mvmac]

  MrDC said:

Maybe this?

I struggled with alignment a lot in the past, what helped me is getting a good look behind the ball then using the clubface, it's the needle on the compass, using a spot on the grass didn't work well for me.

The part of aiming too far right because you spot check doesn't make sense to me. You pick it when you're standing behind the ball and align the face to that, the spot doesn't move so how can you aim the face too far right?

Lots of golfers aim right because it's a compensation for their leftward swing direction.

[Missouri Swede]

  guiseppe said:

mvmac:  thank you for the reply.  I had read the post about golf posture (good post.)  What I am looking for, however, is more of an explanation as to "why" as opposed to "how."

I am looking for an explanation regarding what is happening optically when I am looking at a distant target from a sideways position (i.e. set up over a golf ball as opposed to behind it where you can use both eyes when they are level)  Articles reference that golfers often times mis-align themselves because they perceive the target to be too far right, but they don't say why this happens, i.e.

http://www.academia.edu/12240565/Golfers_may_have_to_overcome_a_persistent_visuospatial_illusion

http://www.humankinetics.com/AcuCustom/Sitename/Documents/DocumentItem/02_Lier_jsep_10_0111.pdf

Other articles talk about "parallax."

What I am trying to understand is "why"--what is going on with the way I perceive distant objects when standing sideways that makes it difficult for me to see an accurate target line from the ball.

  mvmac said:

The part of aiming too far right because you spot check doesn't make sense to me. You pick it when you're standing behind the ball and align the face to that, the spot doesn't move so how can you aim the face too far right?

Lots of golfers aim right because it's a compensation for their leftward swing direction.

I have a similar perception as guiseppe does.

I can line up at the range with an alignment rod by the ball aimed at my target and another one parallel to it for foot alignment. I stand behind the ball and see the rod by the ball is aimed at my target.  But when I address the ball with my toes on the parallel rod, and I feel like I am aiming straight for the left "rough" (really a yardage marker 150 yards out, left of where I know the sticks are aimed--I'm a righty, by the way).  It actually visually appears that the rod by my toes is now aimed left, and the rod by the ball appears to be as well.

Step away, look downrange from behind the ball, and everything looks square again. Take address position, it all looks left again.  When I first noticed it a couple years back, I thought it might be my hip or shoulder alignment (not to say I might not have those problems, too!).  But that's not it, because the rod on the ground by my toes looks to me as if it had been moved, even though it hasn't.

So I agree that it's a visual illusion. I don't know what causes it.  I have thought that it my be due to my eyeglasses (I'm nearsighted; -3.5 diopters).  (I suppose I could try contacts lenses to see if that fixes it for me, but I'm not up for that.)

I figure that's part of the reason I use alignment rods when practicing.

[Ernest Jones]

There's a video out there, sold through the OHP guys, that's supposedly all about alignment and how your eyes screw with you because we align parallel left as opposed to behind the ball. I've always been curious to see the video but don't feel like dropping $70 to see it.

[DrvFrShow]

I don't know about overcoming this vision thing, but I just found out yesterday I need prisms in my glasses. THAT may have been the reason I was putting so poorly. I guess it's worse if you need corrective lenses and can't wear contacts.

[dchoye]

I always walk from the hole to the ball on the same side that I set up from.. this way I can draw a line from target to the ball.

When I approach the ball from the opposite side that I am set up to then I tend to draw a line from ball to target.

most times its not good, unless I have a straight short putt or Im trying to hit a straight T-ball off a cut swing.

[guiseppe]

Bump.  I'm still struggling with seeing my line on full shots

[rolopolo]

Welcome to my world :)

Line it up to the target, get over the ball and as soon as I get my head down it looks like I am aiming 50 meters left.

It's something that you just have to get used to in the long run.

Do you also find that puts always look like they break more right to left than what they really do?

[saevel25]

  On 8/1/2016 at 9:12 PM, guiseppe said:

Bump.  I'm still struggling with seeing my line on full shots

Expand  

It could be your shot shape as well. Golfers do strange things when they start mishitting shots, or developing a shape they don't normally get. 

I agree with @mvmac on picking a target a few feet in front of you. The first post is really similar to what I do. 

With your feet and club set up the way you want, looking up at the target should drastically change your alignment. 

You can lay down two alignment stick, rod, dowel, or club parallel to each other between you and the ball. Then practice setting up to this and try to feel what is different from a neutral set up versus what you do. 

[Jeremie Boop]

  On 6/10/2015 at 3:42 PM, mvmac said:

 

They are also trying to aim to a target 150 yards away when they should just be lining up to a spot 2-3 feet in front of them.

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I actually just got into the habit of doing this myself, it was shocking how much of an impact it made on my accuracy. I had played a pull draw for so long that I naturally was aiming way right and could not figure out why I was hitting such huge *what I thought were* blocks/pushes. One day towards the end of the round I started picking out a target not far from where my ball was and instantly I was hitting much more online. I was still hitting a block/push on some shots but instead of it being 20+ yards right it was only a few yards. It was pretty crazy how far off I was lining up by default.

[ralphs007]

 

  On 6/9/2015 at 10:42 AM, guiseppe said:

I'm trying to understand the role my head tilt and eye position affect my ability to envision the target line in the full swing. I can pick a spot in front of the ball along the target line, set up square to it and my clubface appears closed/way left of my target once I get over it.  If I can't see my target line, I have no chance of making a committed swing.

 

I remember at some point reading about optics, head tilt, dominant eye, etc, but can't seem to find the article again.  Any recommended reading?  I'm not just looking for tips on how to set up or how to see my target.  I want to understand "why" my ability to perceive the target line is affected by my head position.

 

Thank you.

Expand  

This is something I've been working on myself.I'm not there yet,but I'm getting setup much better now. Here's what I've been doing and it might help you. I setup like normal,then I drop my left foot back six inches. Most of the time,it sets me up real  close to square. The good thing is, my eyes always set me up about six inches closed,if that makes any sense.

Lay a shaft along your toe line and see how much you need to drop your left foot back to open your stance up ,so that your square. Then experiment with moving it back the same amount before every shot.

I've been doing this for the last month,and so far it's been working for me..

P.S

My brother has the same problem,and he's been trying my tip,and he's been setting up much better now.

P.P.S

I just read what saevel25 posted,and my advice is inline with what he suggested.

Edited August 6, 2016 by ralphs007