Will the PGA Tour lose it's power to Asia?

[Lihu]

Like many other things Asia will become the center of Golf...Is there anyone that believes it will not?

It seems that many of you are discussing if citizens of Asian countries will dominate the PGA tour.  That was not the question asked.

The question asked:  Will the PGA Tour lose it's power to Asia?

The title is as you mentioned, but the OP asks if Asia will become the center for golf?

I think no, but it has potential to be the largest growing market if the middle class starts to golf.

[SavvySwede]

It seems that many of you are discussing if citizens of Asian countries will dominate the PGA tour.  That was not the question asked.

The question asked:  Will the PGA Tour lose it's power to Asia?

A strong group of Asian players in the pro ranks is a necessary first step to Asia become the center of golf.  Until that happens none of the tournaments over there are going to matter. Sure, sponsors could throw a lot a money out there to entice some top players from the US and Europe but who are they going to play against?

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by No Mulligans

It seems that many of you are discussing if citizens of Asian countries will dominate the PGA tour.  That was not the question asked.

The question asked:  Will the PGA Tour lose it's power to Asia?

A strong group of Asian players in the pro ranks is a necessary first step to Asia become the center of golf.  Until that happens none of the tournaments over there are going to matter. Sure, sponsors could throw a lot a money out there to entice some top players from the US and Europe but who are they going to play against?

Yeah, it'll be at least a decade before that happens. . .

[Mac62]

Like many other things Asia will become the center of Golf...Is there anyone that believes it will not?

I don't believe it will, at least in the foreseeable future.

I thought maybe there was an "L" missing from "PGA."

That was my first thought as well, at least in terms of players.  There's certainly been an increasingly large influx of Asian players.  But in terms of the LPGA Tour itself, I don't see that happening in the foreseeable future either.

[boogielicious]

I'm glad golf is growing in Asia and look forward to more good players coming from Asia. But to supplant the PGA Tour, Asia would have to hold premier tournaments. They have a few good tournaments that attract the world's best players, but the strength of field is a lot lower.

[David in FL]

Given the tournament sponsorship money, the number and relative proximity of tour quality courses, and the necessary infrastructure to support the tour, I'd say nope.

[jcjim]

There are many reasons to believe that Asian golf could grow to a level in golf that the USA could never dream of..First the number of possible players in China alone..not to mention other countries surpasses the total population of the US.. There are some pretty fantastic courses being built in china and other places...

Yes golf now is more of a wealthy mans game in Asia but that will change with their massive middle class...Remember China has 4 times the population of the USA..as does India....

It's been discussed that Asia is obsessed with golf and this could translate into far larger numbers of players than we could ever dream of especially since the middle class is being diminished here and golf is shrinking...

Money in Asia isn't a issue...all of our money it is going there now..

[SavvySwede]

There are many reasons to believe that Asian golf could grow to a level in golf that the USA could never dream of..First the number of possible players in China alone..not to mention other countries surpasses the total population of the US.. There are some pretty fantastic courses being built in china and other places...

Yes golf now is more of a wealthy mans game in Asia but that will change with their massive middle class...Remember China has 4 times the population of the USA..as does India....

It's been discussed that Asia is obsessed with golf and this could translate into far larger numbers of players than we could ever dream of especially since the middle class is being diminished here and golf is shrinking...

Money in Asia isn't a issue...all of our money it is going there now..

I don't think the population of China is as relevant as you make it. China has had a dominating chunk of world population for most if not all of recorded history. Money is definitely an important factor but the big difference between the U.S and China is our absolute obsession with sports. You see many families over here sacrifice everything on the chance their kid will become an elite athlete. I doubt Asia even has any real junior development programs, junior am tours, etc. They're still raising their kids to be doctors or engineers, not golfers. I don't see that pattern changing anytime soon.

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcjim

There are many reasons to believe that Asian golf could grow to a level in golf that the USA could never dream of..First the number of possible players in China alone..not to mention other countries surpasses the total population of the US.. There are some pretty fantastic courses being built in china and other places...

Yes golf now is more of a wealthy mans game in Asia but that will change with their massive middle class...Remember China has 4 times the population of the USA..as does India....

It's been discussed that Asia is obsessed with golf and this could translate into far larger numbers of players than we could ever dream of especially since the middle class is being diminished here and golf is shrinking...

Money in Asia isn't a issue...all of our money it is going there now..

I don't think the population of China is as relevant as you make it. China has had a dominating chunk of world population for most if not all of recorded history. Money is definitely an important factor but the big difference between the U.S and China is our absolute obsession with sports. You see many families over here sacrifice everything on the chance their kid will become an elite athlete. I doubt Asia even has any real junior development programs, junior am tours, etc. They're still raising their kids to be doctors or engineers, not golfers. I don't see that pattern changing anytime soon.

If you can convince Chinese parents that if their kid can become a +2 handicap their child can get into Stanford even without a scholarship, at least a million kids will take up golf overnight. If there is a scholarship involved, 10 million.

[jcjim]

I don't think the population of China is as relevant as you make it. China has had a dominating chunk of world population for most if not all of recorded history. Money is definitely an important factor but the big difference between the U.S and China is our absolute obsession with sports. You see many families over here sacrifice everything on the chance their kid will become an elite athlete. I doubt Asia even has any real junior development programs, junior am tours, etc. They're still raising their kids to be doctors or engineers, not golfers. I don't see that pattern changing anytime soon.

Chinas main force is the fastest growing middle class in the world.. now there's 350 million who knows about 10/20 years from now....If you aren't familiar with the Asian obsession with golf then you might check it out...

[billchao]

Chinas main force is the fastest growing middle class in the world.. now there's 350 million who knows about 10/20 years from now....If you aren't familiar with the Asian obsession with golf then you might check it out...

Interesting, I always thought golf was viewed as extravagant in China and those who play it there are either considered very wealthy or corrupt. Golf is not a sport they idolize and aspire to play.

It kind of bothers me that you keep mentioning the "Asian" obsession with golf and specifically referencing China. Asia is a very large and diverse continent and China is just one part of it.

[No Mulligans]

Money in Asia isn't a issue...all of our money it is going there now..

Not exactly.  Imports to the U.S. from China are about 2.5% as a percentage of U.S. GDP.

[rkim291968]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SavvySwede

I don't think the population of China is as relevant as you make it. China has had a dominating chunk of world population for most if not all of recorded history. Money is definitely an important factor but the big difference between the U.S and China is our absolute obsession with sports. You see many families over here sacrifice everything on the chance their kid will become an elite athlete. I doubt Asia even has any real junior development programs, junior am tours, etc. They're still raising their kids to be doctors or engineers, not golfers. I don't see that pattern changing anytime soon.

Chinas main force is the fastest growing middle class in the world.. now there's 350 million who knows about 10/20 years from now....If you aren't familiar with the Asian obsession with golf then you might check it out...

Not so fast.   Golf is not being viewed favorably by the current premier and the government is cracking down on illegal construction of golf courses.   Golf still is a "rich" (not middle) class thing and it will be that way for a while even without the government's interference.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcjim

Chinas main force is the fastest growing middle class in the world.. now there's 350 million who knows about 10/20 years from now....If you aren't familiar with the Asian obsession with golf then you might check it out...

Interesting, I always thought golf was viewed as extravagant in China and those who play it there are either considered very wealthy or corrupt. Golf is not a sport they idolize and aspire to play.

It kind of bothers me that you keep mentioning the "Asian" obsession with golf and specifically referencing China. Asia is a very large and diverse continent and China is just one part of it.

Agreed on all accounts.

[billchao]

Not so fast.   Golf is not being viewed favorably by the current premier and the government is cracking down on illegal construction of golf courses.   Golf still is a "rich" (not middle) class thing and it will be that way for a while even without the government's interference.

I just want to point out that all golf course construction is actually illegal in China, dating back to Mao Zedong's era. They're just actually enforcing the law now.

[SavvySwede]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SavvySwede

I don't think the population of China is as relevant as you make it. China has had a dominating chunk of world population for most if not all of recorded history. Money is definitely an important factor but the big difference between the U.S and China is our absolute obsession with sports. You see many families over here sacrifice everything on the chance their kid will become an elite athlete. I doubt Asia even has any real junior development programs, junior am tours, etc. They're still raising their kids to be doctors or engineers, not golfers. I don't see that pattern changing anytime soon.

Chinas main force is the fastest growing middle class in the world.. now there's 350 million who knows about 10/20 years from now....If you aren't familiar with the Asian obsession with golf then you might check it out...

I think you're just flat out wrong there.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/19/world/asia/chinas-crackdown-on-corruption-targets-golf-a-sport-for-millionaires.html?_r=0

Edit: looks like everybody beat me to it.

[rkim291968]

This thread is bogus and the voting result speaks for itself.   I am surprised that it even got 15% "yes" votes.

[Lihu]

[QUOTE name="jcjim" url="/t/84212/will-the-pga-tour-lose-its-power-to-asia/0_30#post_1194428"]   Chinas main force is the fastest growing middle class in the world.. now there's 350 million who knows about 10/20 years from now....If you aren't familiar with the Asian obsession with golf then you might check it out... [/QUOTE] Interesting, I always thought golf was viewed as extravagant in China and those who play it there are either considered very wealthy or corrupt. Golf is not a sport they idolize and aspire to play. It kind of bothers me that you keep mentioning the "Asian" obsession with golf and specifically referencing China. Asia is a very large and diverse continent and China is just one part of it.

True, but golf is popular in Japan and especially Korea. The middle class in HK is also getting obsessed with golf. It will eventually become popular in China as well, but as you mentioned there is a stigma associated with it. It could change with a single person who makes it seem more like a common person's sport. Prior to Arnold, golf was considered a rich man's sport in the North America as well. Before that, Harry Vardon made it popular for middle classes in the UK.

[Mac62]

Quote:

Originally Posted by billchao

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcjim

Chinas main force is the fastest growing middle class in the world.. now there's 350 million who knows about 10/20 years from now....If you aren't familiar with the Asian obsession with golf then you might check it out...

Interesting, I always thought golf was viewed as extravagant in China and those who play it there are either considered very wealthy or corrupt. Golf is not a sport they idolize and aspire to play.

It kind of bothers me that you keep mentioning the "Asian" obsession with golf and specifically referencing China. Asia is a very large and diverse continent and China is just one part of it.

True, but golf is popular in Japan and especially Korea. The middle class in HK is also getting obsessed with golf. It will eventually become popular in China as well, but as you mentioned there is a stigma associated with it. It could change with a single person who makes it seem more like a common person's sport.

Prior to Arnold, golf was considered a rich man's sport in the North America as well. Before that, Harry Vardon made it popular for middle classes in the UK.

Golf is very popular in Japan, but it's my understanding that it's also very expensive and very difficult to get a tee time unless you're a member of a course (and membership is out of reach to all but the very wealthy).  I remember reading an article in which they said that the majority of Japanese golfers mostly go to driving ranges (many of which are double and triple-deck) and rarely get to play an actual round on a course.  Maybe this has changed over time, but if not it could certainly be a limiting factor.

According to Wikipedia, India has 196 golf courses in the entire country, about 50% of which are on military bases and only accessible to military and their families.  Of the remaining courses, some of them are Pitch and Putt courses due to the scarcity of available land to build full-sized facilities.  That, combined with the rampant poverty in India, hardly sounds like a hotbed of professional golf.