What is the purpose of life?

[9wood]

throughout history of mankind, there have been too many crimes against humanity

What about the 250.000,000 innocent people that were tortured and murdered from 1917-1995 by atheist led regimes of Lenin, Stalin, Mao Zedong, Pol Pot, etc. simply because they opposed national atheism

[Vinsk]

What about the 250.000,000 innocent people that were tortured and murdered from 1917-1995 by atheist led regimes of Lenin, Stalin, Mao Zedong, Pol Pot, etc. simply because they opposed national atheism

Seriously? You want to discuss how much torture and death occurred and STILL occurs in the name of religion? You're losing the argument tremendously.

[jsgolfer]

Do you seriously think that that is how evolution works?

Do you really think that evolution has no answer to that question? Seriously?

Originally Posted by RGoosen

I would like to point out that religion relies on faith. Science relies on theories. When an  existing belief can be disproven we move on.

This is the kind of nonsense that pervades these argument. It is not true. Science does NOT rely on theories. Scientists pose questions and answer/prove them. This is how knowledge evolves. We respond to observable reality. Dead people to not walk. Snakes do not talk. Virgins do not have children. These are not "theories".

The counter argument to scientific knowledge is not to persist in believing things that can not possibly be true and have never been demonstrated to be true. Do you guys really believe in Adam and Eve , Noah's Ark, that Mary was a virgin  and fear eternal damnation?

Again - let's have ONE piece of evidence. Just one.....please. Why is that so hard? Is it because faith means persisting in believing in something that even the devout know to be untrue?

You mean you don't buy the likeness of Jesus in a sticky bun?

[newtogolf]

One of the biggest myths is that "we should respect people's beliefs."

1) Beliefs do not automatically deserve respect. Belief is not a race, a gender, or a sexual orientation. It is subject to scrutiny.

2) Never once has any God (or anything supernatural at all for that matter) ever defended itself.....it's only ever the followers. If your God exists, it should easily be able to defend itself.

So someone who identifies themselves as a different gender warrants greater consideration than a persons belief in a higher entity?

Again, I'm agnostic, but you'd have no idea if a God was defending itself.

We created the concept that a God was just and humane, but what if a God wasn't as virtuous as we envision him / her to be and all the natural disasters, terrorist attacks and freak accidents are in reality the God defending itself?   We're incapable of understanding something that is superior to us, our arrogance and limited mental capacity lead us to assume we are the most superior life forms in the solar system.

Some view the world as being nothing more than a giant ant farm, if that's the case then like the ant we have no idea where we fit within the world order.

[Lihu]

[quote name="9wood" url="/t/84340/what-is-the-purpose-of-life/100_100#post_1198864"] What about the 250.000,000 innocent people that were tortured and murdered from 1917-1995 by atheist led regimes of Lenin, Stalin, Mao Zedong, Pol Pot, etc. simply because they opposed national atheism

Seriously? You want to discuss how much torture and death occurred and STILL occurs in the name of religion? You're losing the argument tremendously.[/quote] I don't consider people with other agendas who self declare themselves to be fighting in the name of God to be actual Christians, anymore. Like Lucifer, they fell out with God. Many other Christians feel the same way as I do. The same goes for the 250.000,000 million people killed and tortured in the name of atheism (communism). Communism certainly doesn't endorse killing either.

[Mr. Desmond]

I don't consider people with other agendas who self declare themselves to be fighting in the name of God to be actual Christians, anymore. Like Lucifer, they fell out with God. Many other Christians feel the same way as I do.

The same goes for the 250.000,000 million people killed and tortured in the name of atheism (communism). Communism certainly doesn't endorse killing either.

Gosh, I feel like it's the 1960's and I'm back in Catechism class.

[Vinsk]

I don't consider people with other agendas who self declare themselves to be fighting in the name of God to be actual Christians, anymore. Like Lucifer, they fell out with God. Many other Christians feel the same way as I do. The same goes for the 250.000,000 million people killed and tortured in the name of atheism (communism). Communism certainly doesn't endorse killing either.

I'm not sure I understand your comparing communism to atheism. Those atrocities had nothing to with intolerance to a religious belief. They just happened to be atheist people with awful standards and morals. They also had mustaches, so are all mustached people evil? Richard Dawkins explains this very well. Billions of people have been executed and/or tortued strictly in the name of their religious beliefs. Religious fanatics kill and torture, atheist right books.

[Lihu]

Exactly. Evil people do evil things no matter why they say they do it, they always find a "reason". In the name of religion or anything else.

[Vinsk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vinsk

They just happened to be atheist people with awful standards and morals.

Exactly. Evil people do evil things no matter why they say they do it, they always find a "reason". In the name of religion or anything else.

Well, yes ....but my point is there have years of torturing and executing people STRICTLY on behalf of one religious fanatic not believing what he/she believes. Period. You don't have years of history of atheist killing and intolerance to people who do have a theist belief. It's not "I don't believe in God and you do so I want to kill you".....it has been "you don't believe in God the way I do and I want to kill you".

[Gator Hazard]

Well, yes ....but my point is there have years of torturing and executing people STRICTLY on behalf of one religious fanatic not believing what he/she believes. Period. You don't have years of history of atheist killing and intolerance to people who do have a theist belief. It's not "I don't believe in God and you do so I want to kill you".....it has been "you don't believe in God the way I do and I want to kill you".

Actually communist countries did this to their own people.  It is estimated that communist regimes killed anywhere from 40-100 million people for their religious beliefs in less than a 100 years.  France even put tens of thousands to the guillotine for their religious beliefs when the "Cult of Reason" movement took hold fueled by Voltaire and Rousseau's philosophical writings. So, actually quite the opposite is probably true and atheist killings of faith based persons outnumber faith based persons killing each other.  That or it's very close.  This has nothing to do with just religion itself, it has to do with human character flaws based around power and influence and the want for more power religion or a banishing of it was a means to control.

[turtleback]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RGoosen

Amen :)

Amen to let's search for our sense of humor. We've seemed to have lost it.

If one is secure in their beliefs, one might appreciate humor and perhaps join it. Taking offense doesn't help. Asking yourself why other's opinions hurt you, and you will learn more about yourself.

I completely agree.  But some folks are just so threatened by the very thought that there might be a God that they feel compelled to crap on religion.  Maybe they will take your words to heart.

[Shorty]

I completely agree.  But some folks are just so threatened by the very thought that there might be a God that they feel compelled to crap on religion.  Maybe they will take your words to heart.

No, they feel compelled to "crap on" the beliefs of people that would be rejected by a seven year old after five minutes of contemplation. And are then outraged and offended by comments like I just made.

That is why they are frustrated. They are not threatened. If my dog doesn't learn a simple (to me) command and keeps making a mess, it frustrates, it doesn't threaten me.

They are frustrated that believers never defend their beliefs, because they can't. They just resort to dogma. I really don't think that any people think there "might be  a God". 2000 years ago -it was understandable. But we have progressed.

I would love to see some of you in a discussion with Christopher Hitchens, were he still alive. Saying "the bible told me so" doesn't cut it, I'm afraid.

And BTW, I don't think there are any atheists who expect to change the minds of Christians here. But it would be nice if the would engage in the debate.

They could start by doing the following: Please supply ONE piece of information that would support the existence of God. They don't because they can't.

[9wood]

Seriously? You want to discuss how much torture and death occurred and STILL occurs in the name of religion?

I would love to.

You are correct by saying much torture and death has occurred in the name of religion, specifically the religion of Islam. That doesn't negate the FACT that approximately 250,000,000 were tortured and brutally murdered or starved to death by atheist led regimes of Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Zedong, Pol Pot, etc, just in the 20th century alone. But it seems if you prefer to ignore all those atrocities committed by atheists.

[Duff McGee]

@9wood Shorty has asked repeatedly for ONE piece of actual evidence for the existence of your god. Everything else is just fluff. You said there are tons of pieces of evidence so let's hear one please.

[Patch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vinsk

Seriously? You want to discuss how much torture and death occurred and STILL occurs in the name of religion?

I would love to.

You are correct by saying much torture and death has occurred in the name of religion, specifically the religion of Islam. That doesn't negate the FACT that approximately 250,000,000 were tortured and brutally murdered or starved to death by atheist led regimes of Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Zedong, Pol Pot, etc, just in the 20th century alone. But it seems if you prefer to ignore all those atrocities committed by atheists.

A religion is "an organized collection of beliefs, cultural systems, and worldviews that relate humanity to an order of existence". Based on that,  Lenin, Stalin, Mao, and the rest of those you listed were practicing a form of religion. Their own form of religion to be sure, but still a religion.

[Vinsk]

I would love to.  You are correct by saying much torture and death has occurred in the name of religion, specifically the religion of Islam. That doesn't negate the FACT that approximately 250,000,000 were tortured and brutally murdered or starved to death by atheist led regimes of Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Zedong, Pol Pot, etc, just in the 20th century alone. But it seems if you prefer to ignore all those atrocities committed by atheists.

You are completely missing the point here. The people you listed did not commit those crimes in the "name of atheism". PleSe get that through your brainwashed skull. Hitler was an artist but it doesn't mean you can say artists are horrific evil people. Do you understand that? Lenin, Stalin, Mao didn't have any care that their victims were religious they killed anyone they choose for other ridiculous reasons but not out of "atheism". However, Islam, and many others in the past and present, tortue and execute SOLEY BASED ON A RELIGIOUS BASIS. Do you understand that? Atheist aren't spread all over TV begging for money from blind and foolish people. Atheist aren't telling you they can cure your illnesses if you come to their church and donate. You'd love to debate? Why don't you research the atrocities that have been done and are being done by religious fanatics FOR THE PURPOSE OF A RELIGIOUS IDEOLOGY, compared to those FOR THE PURPOSE OF ATHEISM, not just picking out horrible people from years ago who happen to have been atheist as well. Why can't you understand the difference? You could list many things those horrible leaders had in common and make a childish connection that that is why they did what they did. Gary Ridgeway, Jeffery Dalmer, Ted Bundy, John W. Gacy all serial killers .....and hey! They all went to church and believed in God. So what does that say? NOTHING. Why? Because they didn't murder people out of a religious ideology. They murdered out of a sociopathic disorder. You're losing ground quickly.....

[Lihu]

@9wood Shorty has asked repeatedly for ONE piece of actual evidence for the existence of your god. Everything else is just fluff. You said there are tons of pieces of evidence so let's hear one please.

The human mind, and our ability to argue over what we perceive to be truth in an abstract manner. Pretty miraculous and different than anything else on this planet. ;-)

[cipher]

No, they feel compelled to "crap on" the beliefs of people that would be rejected by a seven year old after five minutes of contemplation. And are then outraged and offended by comments like I just made.

That is why they are frustrated. They are not threatened. If my dog doesn't learn a simple (to me) command and keeps making a mess, it frustrates, it doesn't threaten me.

They are frustrated that believers never defend their beliefs, because they can't. They just resort to dogma. I really don't think that any people think there "might be  a God". 2000 years ago -it was understandable. But we have progressed.

I would love to see some of you in a discussion with Christopher Hitchens, were he still alive. Saying "the bible told me so" doesn't cut it, I'm afraid.

And BTW, I don't think there are any atheists who expect to change the minds of Christians here. But it would be nice if the would engage in the debate.

They could start by doing the following: Please supply ONE piece of information that would support the existence of God. They don't because they can't.

What a seven year old would not understand is the problem that the evolutionary theory of the origins of life has with oxygen.  There is reasonable cognitive consideration and science for design as well.  I have spoken with many people over the years about this, but you are incapable of having respectful discussion and I won't engage fully with someone who hides behind his/her screen name.  I have found most atheists I have dealt with to be capable of meaningful dialogue about this, unfortunately you are not one of them.  Also I guess this is not the topic at hand here.

You are completely missing the point here. The people you listed did not commit those crimes in the "name of atheism". PleSe get that through your brainwashed skull. Hitler was an artist but it doesn't mean you can say artists are horrific evil people. Do you understand that? Lenin, Stalin, Mao didn't have any care that their victims were religious they killed anyone they choose for other ridiculous reasons but not out of "atheism".

Of course they won't commit crimes in the "name of atheism".  That kind of goes without saying does it not?  Very classy that you call him brainwashed btw.  You also are kidding yourself.  I have family who lived through Stalin's persecution of Christians.  Targeted and killed near 20 million of them.  It takes a very short search to understand and see documentation of Stalin's hate for Christians and how he specifically targeted them as an atheist.