Solheim Cup Controversy: Who is more at fault?

[Zeph]

Pettersen can apologize all she likes, she was there and made her point in everyone's face, so stand by it, saying you're sorry now is really lame and screams damage control.

The only reason why Lee gets a pass here is because they opponents walked away, if they had simply stayed on the green like a respectable player should, this would not be an issue, this would never have happened, they F'ed up and it not only cost them face, but the tournament, because there was no doubt in my mind the US was coming out hard after that and would win.

There are no proof as far as I can tell, that indicates the European players walking off the green and towards the next tee.

Let's not forget that Lee had picked up her ball without the concent twice earlier that round, and that her playing partner told her not to pick it up. She picks it up, starts crying, and suddenly the rules of golf does not apply anymore. And the European players are blamed and called out for bad sportsmanship, because the opponent broke a rule.

[dkolo]

Rocco's "solution" :doh:

I love that he's rocking the Donald Trump cadence.

[imsys0042]

Does any footage show Pettersen walking off the green? All I can find is Hull walking someplace, which could be to where Pettersen is standing, because she's still on the green. More likely it seems Hull considered the hole a tie, but never gave the word to Lee.

None whatsoever.

In the video that I watched she was already off the green.   Hull was watching Lee and right around the time that the ball stopped she walked away towards Petterson who was already well away from what was going on.    Zeph has it right that she went towards where Petterson was standing and it looks like Petterson was on her way to the next tee, it looked like to me.   Any video posted of Lee putting  has Petterson walked off before Lee putted.

Yes, it seems like Hull considered it a tie but Petterson decided to capitalize on Lee's picking up the ball.  If Lee had been warned before, then shame on her for not being overly cautious about it.  She says that she heard "it's good".   I've not heard anything along the lines of that she was convinced it was the opponents who said it.   However, if Hull doesn't walk away like that with Petterson away, then there wouldn't be a controversy.

[geezer]

In the video that I watched she was already off the green.   Hull was watching Lee and right around the time that the ball stopped she walked away towards Petterson who was already well away from what was going on.    Zeph has it right that she went towards where Petterson was standing and it looks like Petterson was on her way to the next tee, it looked like to me.   Any video posted of Lee putting  has Petterson walked off before Lee putted.

Yes, it seems like Hull considered it a tie but Petterson decided to capitalize on Lee's picking up the ball.  If Lee had been warned before, then shame on her for not being overly cautious about it.  She says that she heard "it's good".   I've not heard anything along the lines of that she was convinced it was the opponents who said it.   However, if Hull doesn't walk away like that with Petterson away, then there wouldn't be a controversy.

It looks like Pettersen is at the side of the green, but there's no video that actually explicitly shows where she is standing or what she was actually doing.

The interview that the referee gave actually indicates that Pettersen was on the green when Lee scooped the putt. He says (I'm paraphrasing) 'Hull and Pettersen came walking over toward me where I was standing at the edge of the green'. The indication being that they were both still on the green.

here we go, I found the link: http://www.golfchannel.com/media/referee-dan-maselli-comments-controversy-17/

[mvmac]

U.S. team captain Juli Inkster says she had a "good talk" with Suzann Pettersen and both are ready to move on regarding the putt concession controversy at the 2015 Solheim Cup.

http://www.golfchannel.com/media/inkster-pettersen-have-good-talk-ready-move/

[ccotenj]

unless the player is absolutely positive that they heard "it's good", and others heard it as well, there is only ONE person "responsible" for the controversy, and that is the player that picked up the ball...   regardless of where their opponents were standing/walking/taking a crap...

suzann is getting a raw deal...

[nevets88]

I'll have a little fun at the expense of the SC debacle since it ended well for the US, in all good spirits, this is dedicated to the SC.

[MrDC]

There are no proof as far as I can tell, that indicates the European players walking off the green and towards the next tee.

Let's not forget that Lee had picked up her ball without the concent twice earlier that round, and that her playing partner told her not to pick it up. She picks it up, starts crying, and suddenly the rules of golf does not apply anymore. And the European players are blamed and called out for bad sportsmanship, because the opponent broke a rule.

What about watching the putt? is that proof enough?

Lee was wrong, we all know that, but walking away when you didn't concede is a bad move that is not in the spirit of the game, that is the big issue, stay put if you want the putt.

[rkim291968]

Lee was wrong, we all know that, but walking away when you didn't concede is a bad move that is not in the spirit of the game, that is the big issue, stay put if you want the putt.

... and there are people saying Susan Petterson walked away on purpose to trick Allison to pick up the ball.   Apparently, they have seen other SP's trickeries to distract her opponent - e.g, excessive putting swing practice while someone is trying to putt (happened in an LPGA event).   I don't know if SP has such pattern -  I doubt it.   But it's something people will watch closely going forward.

[Zeph]

What about watching the putt? is that proof enough?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVP7x0I5AUQ

Lee was wrong, we all know that, but walking away when you didn't concede is a bad move that is not in the spirit of the game, that is the big issue, stay put if you want the putt.

That video shows Hull, walking on the green. It does 1) not show Pettersen and 2) not show anyone walking off the green.

It seems pretty clear that Hull considered the hole tied, but she never told Lee to pick it up. Pettersen stands at the other side of the green and we don't know if she moved or not, but she is getting the blame based on TV-pictures of Hull.

[Golfingdad]

That video shows Hull, walking on the green. It does 1) not show Pettersen and 2) not show anyone walking off the green.

It seems pretty clear that Hull considered the hole tied, but she never told Lee to pick it up. Pettersen stands at the other side of the green and we don't know if she moved or not, but she is getting the blame based on TV-pictures of Hull.

Yeah, I agree with this.  If you watch only Lee during the video, she has Hull and the two Euro caddies right in front of her and as the putt misses she raises her head, so she certainly could see the three of them immediately start to move on.  I'd bet that's what triggered her to mistakenly think the putt was conceded, so SP didn't play a part in that.

However, SP was taking the brunt of the blame because it was apparently her decision to call the penalty and take the cheap win on the hole rather than just scold them and say "Next time, make sure you hear us say its good before you pick up."

I say "was" because as far as most are concerned, its water under the bridge.  She realized she screwed up, apologized, it was accepted, and now its over.

[jcjim]

Cheap shot for Petterson and the Euros...

Nobody here was there, if Lee didn't think the putt was conceded she would have putted a little 18" putt..Maybe Petterson needs to stay home instead of coming here and making a lot more money than they make over there..

[Ringworld]

know the rules.  it could have been argued that Lee misheard.  It could also be argued that Hull gave consent.  Shame on the captain and Lee and the rules official for not knowing all the rules.

[geezer]

rather than just scold them and say "Next time, make sure you hear us say its good before you pick up."

I've heard it said from several different sources that this was the 3rd time in the round Lee had picked up early without concession.

[Golfingdad]

I've heard it said from several different sources that this was the 3rd time in the round Lee had picked up early without concession.

Why the secrecy?

If that was true, that would have been THE FIRST thing that Petterson should have said in defense of herself when asked about it after the round.

[mvmac]

I've heard it said from several different sources that this was the 3rd time in the round Lee had picked up early without concession.

Any links?

I think that's something we would have heard about.

[Zeph]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mvmac

Any links?

I think that's something we would have heard about.

I can't find any sources for this, and it seems not to be a fact.

Quote:

Yet the American player believed she heard a concession, a point she has no reason whatsoever to invent. There have been blatant exaggerations as to how long the putt in question actually was. Both the US and European camps denied rumours that players and Lee in particular had earlier been warned about picking up prematurely.

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2015/sep/21/solheim-cup-golf-europe-us-suzann-pettersen-alison-lee-solheim-cup-ewan-murray

[Scotsclaff]

I think Pettersen's been"encouraged" to post that apology.