USGA Announces Local Rule for 18-2 on Putting Green

[Baog]

 

4 minutes ago, Piz said:

If it is okay to touch it; why require an interpretation if the player almost touches it?

The reason is because now, only the location of the ball for the next stroke is affected by the outcome of the interpretation. Without the local rule you'd still have to make the same determination and it's a difference of a stroke and the location of the ball for the next stroke.

[David in FL]

I really don't understand why they would do this.  It seems to be contrary to one of the key principles of the rules, and I simply don't see any benefit to doing so. 

A few of the biggest, dumbest, albeit unintentional, rules violations I've ever had have been by inadvertently kicking my ball, dropping a club on it, or hitting it when making a practice stroke.  I just don't think that such a bonehead move should rate a free pass on one part of the course, but not on another.

[Baog]

14 minutes ago, David in FL said:

I just don't think that such a bonehead move should rate a free pass on one part of the course, but not on another.

Does this mean that you also do not believe that we should be able to mark and replace our ball on the green without penalty unless we can also mark and replace elsewhere without penalty? If not, is the difference that accidentally moving the ball is boneheadded and mark/replace isn't?

Edited December 8, 2016 by Baog

[Piz]

How can one almost accidentally cause the ball to move?  Replace the term "accidental" with "incidental" and I'm okay with it.

[iacas]

1 hour ago, sjduffers said:

And by "didn't do anything", you mean didn't step in, didn't make a practice stroke, didn't ground the putter, right?

No, I mean "didn't do anything to cause the ball to move."

The cause of the ball moving still has to be determined.

1 hour ago, sjduffers said:

I'd say, he did something (that changed the environment of the ball) and give him the penalty-free replace the ball decision.

Are you reading the rule properly? Neither situation penalizes him: it just changes where the location of the ball for his next shot.

1 hour ago, sjduffers said:

In the extremely rare case, where the player is ready to strike his putt, but does not do it for whatever reason (gathering his thoughts, firming his balance, having a brain fart?) for an overlong period of time and a gust of wind happens to cause the ball to move then, it would not be different from the current 18-2 rule (e.g. Vittel not penalized because it took 5-6 seconds for the ball to move). Just play it as it lies then.

That's my point. 18-2/0.5 still applies. You still have to determine if the player is the most likely cause of the ball moving.

15 minutes ago, David in FL said:

A few of the biggest, dumbest, albeit unintentional, rules violations I've ever had have been by inadvertently kicking my ball, dropping a club on it, or hitting it when making a practice stroke.  I just don't think that such a bonehead move should rate a free pass on one part of the course, but not on another.

Yeah, welcome to the wussifying of the Rules. People whine about something being unfair, and this is what we get.

8 minutes ago, Piz said:

How can one almost accidentally cause the ball to move?  Replace the term "accidental" with "incidental" and I'm okay with it.

Not sure what you're asking. If they "almost" caused the ball to move the rule doesn't even matter, because it didn't move.

[No Mulligans]

I don't like the explanation for why this is a Local Rule instead of a permanent rule.  This will lead to confusion/arguments as to whether the "local rule" is in affect for a given round, especially for casual rounds.

It seems to me that a local rule is a rule that can be applied when there are certain conditions that warrant a change in the rules, like lift, clean and place.  The reasoning for this being a local rule has nothing to do with special local conditions.  I wish this had been made a "permanent" rule.  It still could have been changed or eliminated on the next revision after an evaluation period.

5 hours ago, Rulesman said:

 7) Why not make this a permanent change to the Rules, instead of just a Local Rule? 

The Rules of Golf are typically revised every four years, with the latest version taking effect in January 2016. The introduction of the Local Rule is outside the normal revision cycle and enables committees to eliminate the penalty for ball-moved situations on the putting green. While the relevant Rules are under consideration as part of the comprehensive Rules Modernisation project, we believed it was important to allow for committees to address this issue in advance of the full changes from that project taking effect.

 

 

[iacas]

2 minutes ago, No Mulligans said:

I don't like the explanation for why this is a Local Rule instead of a permanent rule.

It's a Local Rule because they don't change the Rules of Golf except on a set schedule. The next revision is not until 2018, but they wanted a way to address this for 2017. That's it.

2 minutes ago, No Mulligans said:

This will lead to confusion/arguments as to whether the "local rule" is in affect for a given round, especially for casual rounds.

Will it? That many balls are being accidentally moved on the putting greens?

2 minutes ago, No Mulligans said:

It seems to me that a local rule is a rule that can be applied when there are certain conditions that warrant a change in the rules, like lift, clean and place. The reasoning for this being a local rule has nothing to do with special local conditions.

Yes it does: fast, sloped greens. A muni with slow, flat greens doesn't need this Local Rule (as long as it's a Local Rule, that is).

2 minutes ago, No Mulligans said:

I wish this had been made a "permanent" rule.  It still could have been changed or eliminated on the next revision after an evaluation period.

Wait a year.

[David in FL]

1 hour ago, Baog said:

Does this mean that you also do not believe that we should be able to mark and replace our ball on the green without penalty unless we can also mark and replace elsewhere without penalty? If not, is the difference that accidentally moving the ball is boneheadded and mark/replace isn't?

There are already times you're allowed to mark and replace your ball through the green.

Having said that, I accept that there are some different rules while on the green.  I just don't see why something like this should be included.  Don't step on your ball.  Don't cause it to move other than while making a stroke.  It's that easy.

[Asheville]

iacas, what's your reference for your insistence that the four year Rules update cycle is to be disrupted with a wholesale change in 2018? 

We expect that the Decisions will update in 2018, but I've not heard, except from you here, that there will be a new Rules book in 2018.

[iacas]

I didn't say that. I said they left their options open with a two-year cycle this time.

[Asheville]

You've asserted several times in this thread alone that there will be a Rules revision in 2018. The Decisions are scheduled to be revised in 2018 and the Rules in 2020. Do you have other information?

[iacas]

1 hour ago, Asheville said:

You've asserted several times in this thread alone that there will be a Rules revision in 2018. The Decisions are scheduled to be revised in 2018 and the Rules in 2020. Do you have other information?

I will disagree that I've "asserted" anything, more "hinted," but:

1. The Rules book doesn't say 2016-2019. Previously rules books covered the four-year period.
2. They're prepping a "preview" of the overhaul (or whatever you want to call it) that will come out this year.
3. The world handicap system was supposed to debut in 2018.

Those are the reasons I'm comfortable sharing right now. There are a couple of others.

Now, back to the topic at hand, please…?

[Valleygolfer]

Will this affect the replacement rule if your ball is hit by another person's ball? Or is this only when everyone is on the green? I don't know how the separation is decided or if it is considered a completely different scenario.

 

[David in FL]

5 minutes ago, Valleygolfer said:

Will this affect the replacement rule if your ball is hit by another person's ball? Or is this only when everyone is on the green? I don't know how the separation is decided or if it is considered a completely different scenario.

 

I can't see how one would have any affect on the other.

[iacas]

1 hour ago, Valleygolfer said:

Will this affect the replacement rule if your ball is hit by another person's ball? Or is this only when everyone is on the green? I don't know how the separation is decided or if it is considered a completely different scenario.

This has nothing to do with that.

[Fourputt]

7 hours ago, No Mulligans said:

I don't like the explanation for why this is a Local Rule instead of a permanent rule.  This will lead to confusion/arguments as to whether the "local rule" is in affect for a given round, especially for casual rounds.

It seems to me that a local rule is a rule that can be applied when there are certain conditions that warrant a change in the rules, like lift, clean and place.  The reasoning for this being a local rule has nothing to do with special local conditions.  I wish this had been made a "permanent" rule.  It still could have been changed or eliminated on the next revision after an evaluation period.

 

There are already local rules on the books which don't depend on any particular conditions.   Local rules for embedded ball through the green and electronic distance measuring device allowance are strictly up to the whim of the managing agency or committee.

[Rulesman]

7 hours ago, Asheville said:

iacas, what's your reference for your insistence that the four year Rules update cycle is to be disrupted with a wholesale change in 2018? 

We expect that the Decisions will update in 2018, but I've not heard, except from you here, that there will be a new Rules book in 2018.

It was announced some time ago and is general knowledge that there is a major review of the rules in progress.

It has just been announced that a preview will be published in 2017.

From the Q&As

1)       Why not wait and change the Rule as part of the next Rules cycle?

As part of the Rules Modernisation initiative being pursued by The R&A and USGA, we plan to preview a comprehensive set of proposed changes in 2017. Given the significant ongoing issues that have arisen with the application of Rule 18-2 over the last several years, we concluded that this particular change should be available to all committees now, through the adoption of a Local Rule.

The open ended date of the current publication (2016 - .....) makes it clear that the new version will be issued before 2020 and widely 'leaked' information is that it is hoped to be 2018.

 

Edited December 9, 2016 by Rulesman

[Rulesman]

Of course, a major task will be to revise all the decisions that would be affected by any changes