I hate tailgaters

[Lihu]

4 minutes ago, jamo said:

I'm serious. For a species whose previous top speed was like 15 MPH I think we do surprisingly well in a metal box careening down a highway at 65. 

From that point of view, it is pretty amazing. I think the many rules and regulations and road signs help. If you've ever driven in an environment where no rules are followed and people do pretty much what they want. . .

Edited March 26, 2017 by Lihu
grammar

[JonMA1]

1 hour ago, jamo said:

I'm serious. For a species whose previous top speed was like 15 MPH I think we do surprisingly well in a metal box careening down a highway at 65. 

This is a good point.

Here's what I've always thought.... how many times do we stub our toes on piece of furniture, drop something in the kitchen, or otherwise do something clumsy? Yet, with thousands of drivers going at each other at 65mph, sometimes on an icy surface with limited visibility and nothing but a narrow stripe of paint separating them, it is a bit surprising there isn't more mayhem. (Although some of that may be due to improved safety technology.)

But that's exactly what makes the dumb choices drivers make so much more aggravating. It's as though the laws of physics don't apply to them.

[Jack Watson]

2 hours ago, jamo said:

I'm serious. For a species whose previous top speed was like 15 MPH I think we do surprisingly well in a metal box careening down a highway at 65. 

We do?

http://www.newsweek.com/us-traffic-deaths-injuries-and-related-costs-2015-363602

A person is injured in a car crash every fifteen or so seconds in the USA.

Edited March 26, 2017 by Jack Watson

[colin007]

On 3/24/2017 at 5:16 PM, Golfingdad said:

I don't understand this from either angle.  Tailgating is dangerous and dumb.  But you know what else is dangerous and dumb?  Brake checking somebody who is tailgating.  Sure, we can laugh at this one because the only person who crashed was the tailgater, but he could've just as easily gone right and smashed into an innocent bystander.  There was also a high probability of the tailgater not seeing and rear ending the guy - I'm sure he'd have felt joy at that outcome.

If somebody behind you wants to go faster than you are going, just get out of their way.  It's really that simple.

And, @boogielicious, I also thought the same thing when I read the thread.  If it was started by @Lihu, it would have definitely been about football game tailgating, and he'd be complaining about all of those annoying UCLA fans that tear up his golf course every Saturday.

I agree. I don't think brake checking is ever a good idea. Nether is tailgating, but two wrongs don't make a right. Brake checking is extremely dangerous. If not for the possibility of causing an accident, you never know who's behind you or what kind of road rage monster they might be.

Tailgating doesn't solve anything, and neither does brake checking.

My big thing is, if you are in the left lane and aren't passing anyone, GTFO and pull over. People just seem to find the left lane comfortable for some reason and just park it out there.

[jamo]

1 hour ago, Jack Watson said:

We do?

http://www.newsweek.com/us-traffic-deaths-injuries-and-related-costs-2015-363602

A person is injured in a car crash every fifteen or so seconds in the USA.

Can you imagine explaining modern car transportation to someone even just 100 years ago? It all seems natural now because we've lived with it our entire lives, but the entire operation would be bonkers insane to someone who hasn't. You hop in a box and controlled explosions propel you down roads (sometimes full of potholes, often narrow and with cars on all sides of you). I've been driving nearly 10 years (somewhere just south of 100k miles) and I can count the amount of serious accidents I've seen occur on two fingers.

I'm not saying it's particularly safe (air travel is more safe per mile travelled, etc. etc.), just that it's astounding that it's as safe as it is. There are a lot of very, very stupid people out there and yet they seem to drive just fine.

[JonMA1]

2 hours ago, colin007 said:

My big thing is, if you are in the left lane and aren't passing anyone, GTFO and pull over

Agreed - unless you're letting someone merge as was the case with the video.

Neither driver did anything I don't see every time I drive to Detroit or Grand Rapids - other than the resulting accident.  

---

Here's the entire story....

The first driver was required to get to/stay in the left lane because of merging traffic. However, the second driver couldn't let him get away with that so he took the appropriate action by tailgating - what other choice did he have?

Now the driver #1 could have sped up a little and gotten back over to the right, allowing driver #2 to be on his way. But that wouldn't have taught driver #2 that no one - NO ONE - tailgates him and gets away with it! So he took the appropriate action of brake checking that SOB into the median. Now everyone else knows to never, ever mess with driver #1.

The story driver #2 told was that he was doing nothing wrong. "I was simply driving the speed limit in the left lane when suddenly this jerk (driver #1) abruptly changes lanes and slams on the brakes... causing me to lose control". The cop didn't buy it and wrote #2 a ticket for careless driving.

Driver #1 was a little nervous at first that a witness might have taken his tag. But after a few days, he started feeling pretty bad-ass about the whole thing... I'm a road warrior he thought to himself.

A couple weeks later, driver #1 tried the same tactic - unbeknownst to him that this tailgater was texting on her phone. She slammed into the back of his vehicle causing him to lose control and end up in the median. She told the same story to the cop that driver #2 had, only this time the cop believed it. She was crying after all... and had a nice body. 

What choice did the cop have?

[Lihu]

I looked at the video again, it looks like they're all traveling at 50mph or less? I have no idea how the car tailgating got so out of control? Must have been a terrible driver?

Anyway, the definition of tailgating in So. CA is a bit different than other paces and many of us commonly drive about 2 or 3 car lengths or less at 75mph with traffic on both sides. Normal for my area anyway.

The idiots who actually tailgate usually cause 3 to 4 car pileups which are very common.

So this is what our DMV recommends if you are being tailgated:

Quote

Check traffic behind you often to know if you are being tailgated (another driver is following too closely). If you are being tailgated, be careful! Brake slowly before stopping. Tap your brakes lightly a few times to warn the tailgater you are slowing down.

https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detail/pubs/hdbk/scanning

Edited March 27, 2017 by Lihu
Added the details and that it looks like the drivers are going 40 to 50mph?

[iacas]

10 hours ago, jamo said:

I'm serious. For a species whose previous top speed was like 15 MPH I think we do surprisingly well in a metal box careening down a highway at 65. 

I'm with you.

[saevel25]

7 hours ago, Jack Watson said:

We do?

http://www.newsweek.com/us-traffic-deaths-injuries-and-related-costs-2015-363602

A person is injured in a car crash every fifteen or so seconds in the USA.

That is actually a terrible stat to throw out. It doesn't do anything to actually quantify the danger of driving. 

In the US we average 1.12 vehicle fatalities every 100 million miles traveled. There is about 33-35K fatalities every year from vehicle related crashes. In the US we travel about 3.1 trillion miles in total per year. 

We are 3x less likely to die from driving then we were in the 80's.

 

[Hardspoon]

10 hours ago, jamo said:

I'm serious. For a species whose previous top speed was like 15 MPH I think we do surprisingly well in a metal box careening down a highway at 65. 

Yeah.  Especially when you consider how many innate faults we have to overcome: motion-induced blindness (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motion-induced_blindness), speed blindness, object fixation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Target_fixation)...the list goes on and on.

Everything about driving a car is fighting our natural biological and mental instinct.

[Lihu]

10 hours ago, Hardspoon said:

Yeah.  Especially when you consider how many innate faults we have to overcome: motion-induced blindness (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motion-induced_blindness), speed blindness, object fixation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Target_fixation)...the list goes on and on.

Everything about driving a car is fighting our natural biological and mental instinct.

Which is why we should be driving in a safe manner at all times.

Sorry to anyone who thinks that "brake checking" was wrong, but it was the tailgating that caused the accident. The brake check was just a logical consequence and recommended at least in CA by our DMV.

What if he took out other cars around him when he swerved out of control? Was it worth it just to show that he's impatient with the person in front?

I'm still amazed that some people think the accident was caused by the "brake check"?

[nevets88]

10 hours ago, Hardspoon said:

Yeah.  Especially when you consider how many innate faults we have to overcome: motion-induced blindness (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motion-induced_blindness), speed blindness, object fixation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Target_fixation)...the list goes on and on.

Everything about driving a car is fighting our natural biological and mental instinct.

Also consider how much we drive at night, in the rain, in the snow, driving distracted, sleepy. Also still a lot driving under the influence.

[ScouseJohnny]

On 3/24/2017 at 8:18 AM, DaveP043 said:

 When I've been in Scotland or Ireland, drivers consistently move to the "slow lane" immediately after passing   Its something we should do better, whenever it makes sense.

The other thing that is unacceptable in the UK (I can't speak for Ireland), but which I see all the time here in the US is "weaving." Chopping in and out of lanes and undertaking just to get ahead of the traffic. Once had the pleasure of seeing a copper reading some idiot the riot act on a busy dual carriageway in Leicester for that - he was really giving the guy a bollocking.

[iacas]

13 minutes ago, Lihu said:

Sorry to anyone who thinks that "brake checking" was wrong, but it was the tailgating that caused the accident. The brake check was just a logical consequence and recommended at least in CA by our DMV.

Huh? Where do they recommend this?

 

@Lihu… c'mon.

[ScouseJohnny]

Quote

Huh? Where do they recommend this?

They don't. Instead, quite reasonably, they recommend defensive driving.

Page 34 of the California DMV manual:

 

Quote

 

Most rear end collisions are caused by tailgating. To avoid tailgating, use the “3 second rule”: when the vehicle ahead of you passes a certain point, such as a sign, count “one-

   thousand-one, one-thousand-two, one-thousand-three.” This takes approximately 3

seconds. If you pass the same point before you finish counting, you are following too

closely.

 

You should allow for 4 or more seconds or when:

• A tailgater is behind you. Allow extra room ahead and do not brake suddenly.

Slow down gradually or merge into another lane to prevent a collision with the

tailgater!

 

 

Source: https://www.dmv.ca.gov/web/eng_pdf/dl600.pdf

[Lihu]

1 hour ago, iacas said:

Huh? Where do they recommend this?

 

@Lihu… c'mon.

I quoted it in an earlier post.

The video looked like he lightly tapped the brakes, it's not like his wheels were screeching or anything.

Edited March 27, 2017 by Lihu
Added more crap.

[iacas]

16 minutes ago, Lihu said:

The video looked like he lightly tapped the brakes, it's not like his wheels were screeching or anything.

@Lihu please re-read what you linked to (and quoted yourself, and even bolded and italicized in your quote):

Quote

Check traffic behind you often to know if you are being tailgated (another driver is following too closely). If you are being tailgated, be careful! Brake slowly before stopping. Tap your brakes lightly a few times to warn the tailgater you are slowing down.

This is their advice if you're slowing down (like you plan to make a turn, or a traffic light is up ahead, etc.). Their advice is to show the brake lights by tapping a few times, then slowing down. This is better advice, when slowing down, than just immediately slowing down because they may hit you.

It's not advice for highway travel.

[Lihu]

Just now, iacas said:

@Lihu please re-read what you linked to.

This is their advice if you're slowing down (like you plan to make a turn, or a traffic light is up ahead, etc.). Their advice is to show the brake lights by tapping a few times, then slowing down. This is better advice, when slowing down, than just immediately slowing down because they may hit you.

It's not advice for highway travel.

Exactly what I saw, the guy being tailgated then proceeded to turn into the slow lane and drive there. I'm not even sure he/she was even aware that the person tailgating ran off the road or not because he/she just kept on going?

At least in CA, the person behind is always at fault, so I am looking at it from that point of view.