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TxGolfDude

Have 3-Woods/Fairway Metals Really Improved Since 2008?

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21 hours ago, Cantankerish said:

Just a thought.  You said that you discarded poor contact shots.  Well, the woods can be weighted for increased distance versus increased forgiveness, right?  What if you are talking about a club with the weight in the center for length, but which you will be sending fewer shots where you aim?  I can't stand dealing with nonfacts.  I would need to know this stuff before shelling out good money on a club you may turn out to hate.

 

Good point, and I neglected to mention these were all stiff tip manufacturer shafts, using a Pro V1XAll the settings were neutral, from-the-factory settings.

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20 hours ago, pganapathy said:

@TxGolfDude - The first thing I need to know about is how many clubs are there in your bag.  If the new 3 wood is just replacing the old 3 wood, then distances need to be considered.  If you can just add the new 3 wood and keep the rest of the clubs, the decision is easier.

Second, what is the distance gap between your current driver and the new 3 wood.  If it isn't much, or lengths are the same, which one would you be willing to drop from your bag.  Or would you look at a new driver to increase that length.

Third, what is the dispersion with the newer 3 wood. Is it as good as your gamer.  If not, distance isn't everything.  Being in the fairway 10 to 20 yards shorter is better than being in the rough.  You can always play better from the fairway.

Here's my bag and carry distances:

Driver: Callaway 1.5 Mini 14* (Turned down to 13*) 43" KuroKage R Flex shaft. Carry: 236 

3 wood: Taylormade 2008 Burner 15* carry 205

5 wood: Taylormade 2008 Burner 18* carry 196

7 wood: Taylormade 2008 Burner 21* carry 185

Cobra King One Length 22* hybrid carry 172

Cobra King One Length 25* hybrid carry 164

6I - SW, Wishon Sterling Single Lengths Irons and my Edel putter makes 14 clubs.

Dispersion was pretty equal between the old Burner and the M6 I am thinking about. 

Looking at it now, I don't even see why I would replace the old 3 wood, as it keeps that 205-225 gap filled pretty nicely; but I'm here to hear what you folks here think, as I love new ideas that I may not have considered.

 

19 hours ago, HonestyPolicy said:

Sounds like you had fun as well as gained some insight. I always find it a lot of fun to hit clubs and see the results but also find it's hard to find a shop that will allow you to spend that kind of time in the bay hitting. 17 yards of carry is a nice gain from just an equipment change and as far as the cost, don't think of it like it's $300, think of it more like it's only $17.65 a yard :-)

Question: Were you able to change shafts as well or were you hitting whatever shaft was in the demo club? Just wondering if the shaft might have had some effect on your results and/or if you were able to isolate that variable or not.

Keep us informed of the Tour Edge/Exotics results. It would be really interesting to see your results on those vs the data you've already posted. 

 

I wasn't able to change shafts, they were all stock demos.

I will let you know how the Tour Edge demo works out!

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3 minutes ago, TxGolfDude said:

Here's my bag and carry distances:

Driver: Callaway 1.5 Mini 14* (Turned down to 13*) 43" KuroKage R Flex shaft. Carry: 236 

3 wood: Taylormade 2008 Burner 15* carry 205

5 wood: Taylormade 2008 Burner 18* carry 196

7 wood: Taylormade 2008 Burner 21* carry 185

Cobra King One Length 22* hybrid carry 172

Cobra King One Length 25* hybrid carry 164

6I - SW, Wishon Sterling Single Lengths Irons and my Edel putter makes 14 clubs.

Dispersion was pretty equal between the old Burner and the M6 I am thinking about. 

Looking at it now, I don't even see why I would replace the old 3 wood, as it keeps that 205-225 gap filled pretty nicely; but I'm here to hear what you folks here think, as I love new ideas that I may not have considered.

 

You have two options.  Get a new 3 wood, and then look for a new driver.  Otherwise, the gap between the 3 wood and driver is too small to justify the cost.  Option 2 is keep the existing set-up and accept you are losing distance.  The yardage gaps are alright between your clubs currently.

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16 hours ago, ncates00 said:

Something seems off with these numbers.  I'm not calling you out or questioning your ability or anything by the way.  I'm purely looking at the numbers, and I hope you play what works for you.  That said, to me, your ball speed is far too low to hit a carry of 222.  Perhaps it was a typo, but given the other ball speeds you listed, I think not.  You'd need to hit about 10 more mph of ball speed to get a carry of 220ish at that launch angle and spin.  I hit my 3w with similar-ish launch angle but with 148 ballspeed/with similar spin to a tune of 235 carry.  Sometimes the carry will jump if I catch a low 2k spin ball.  Anyway, you may want to double check these numbers and what kind of launch monitor you were on, because the numbers, to me, just don't add up.  Regardless, best of luck and play well this year.

Great timing! I just went back to hit that club again at the bay (I'm here right now), and here's that club again. Spin rate down (trying to swing flatter today), but that doesn't explain the increase in launch angle. I'm not a physicist though lol.

 

IMG_0424.jpg

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This is very interesting. I have the exact same problem with the exact same club. I have played the Burner 3 wood since its release in 2008. I actually went to Club Champion in Houston to be fitted for a new one and the guy basically told me to keep what I have. My smash was like 1.46 on average which is pretty hard to beat. I didn't get to try the F9 though which is the last one on my list before I throw in the towel. I have a steep-ish swing and I hear the rails do wonders for that type of swing off the deck. I can hit anything off the tee.

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15 hours ago, David in FL said:

The short answer is yes!

I played that exact club for a long time and loved it, but I have moved on two generations since then, and my results are better for having done so.

Thanks for sharing! Not sure what I'm gonna do yet, but I like to know what everyone else thinks!

14 hours ago, LMoore said:

Tax, I really like the exotics CBX. But in testing, I found that most brand name, Callaway, Ping, ....were really close with the same shaft. I chose the CBX for certain tee shots and par 5s that didn’t require a quick stop. It does have a few 100 less rpm ( for me). 

More than that, I like the classic look. 

Bad news. $299 won’t touch it.

After looking where it would fit in my bag (I'm at the PGA Superstore hitting it right now), I'm thinking the same thing...I think I'm trying to make myself fall in love with it because of the numbers lol!

 

15 minutes ago, pganapathy said:

You have two options.  Get a new 3 wood, and then look for a new driver.  Otherwise, the gap between the 3 wood and driver is too small to justify the cost.  Option 2 is keep the existing set-up and accept you are losing distance.  The yardage gaps are alright between your clubs currently.

I was thinking the same thing...of course, if I get a new (longer, not necessarily straighter) driver, the M6 3 wood...then I have to gap up tp replace the 5 and 7 woods somehow, too. All while spending probably north of a thousand bucks to get some yards and (maybe, maybe not) be in the fairway. Decisions decisions....I think I may stick with my current set up for now, and kep poking around for a driver I can hit longer and at least as straight as my Callaway Mini before I consider any changes. Thanks for helping out!

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4 hours ago, TxGolfDude said:

I think I may stick with my current set up for now, and kep poking around for a driver I can hit longer and at least as straight as my Callaway Mini before I consider any changes. Thanks for helping out!

Distance is important no doubt, but for me, I would rather hit a 5 iron from the fairway than a 7 from the rough.  Very good players are talented enough to hit out of the rough and control the ball.  Most others aren't.  Pick a new club based on a dispersion pattern before the additional distance.  To date, I struggle with my latest driver.  It is longer than my previous one for sure, but not as accurate.  However, I must admit, when I get it right, it is brilliant.  Long and straight.  If I could have my old one back, I would probably do so, but my father games it well, so I have left it for him, with the intention of practicing more with my current driver to add the requisite accuracy

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12 hours ago, pganapathy said:

Distance is important no doubt, but for me, I would rather hit a 5 iron from the fairway than a 7 from the rough.  Very good players are talented enough to hit out of the rough and control the ball.  Most others aren't.  Pick a new club based on a dispersion pattern before the additional distance.  To date, I struggle with my latest driver.  It is longer than my previous one for sure, but not as accurate.  However, I must admit, when I get it right, it is brilliant.  Long and straight.  If I could have my old one back, I would probably do so, but my father games it well, so I have left it for him, with the intention of practicing more with my current driver to add the requisite accuracy

I totally agree.

I spent a lot of time on drivers that I had trouble controlling. They gave me some extra length when I hit them right, but I found myself out of the fairway a lot. Then I found my latest gamer and it wasn't cheap, an 8.5 degree Titleist 913D2 but the amount of confidence that I have when I step up to the tee is a great feeling. I literally know I'm going to hit the fairway with it. It's aging now and I am getting older too and the loss of distance is concerning, so following this post is great insight into the replacement process which will become eventual for me.    

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Playing launch monitor golf is one game, playing golf on a golf course is another game. You have to try a fairway wood on a real golf course to see how it works for you. Hilly lies, fairway conditions, rough, how it reacts when it hits the green, can you control trajectory and occasionally bend a shot a bit if you have to. 

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There have been changes since 2008. I am using a 15 degree Callaway Rogue 3 wood, and the face is hotter and more forgiving. Shafts have changed a bit as well.

I bit the bullet, and went through my whole bag over the last 18 months. I am 61, and though I haven't  gained a ton of distance, the new sticks have me where I was 10-15 years ago, and with much less effort.

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On 3/21/2019 at 11:07 AM, TxGolfDude said:

Thanks for sharing! Not sure what I'm gonna do yet, but I like to know what everyone else thinks!

After looking where it would fit in my bag (I'm at the PGA Superstore hitting it right now), I'm thinking the same thing...I think I'm trying to make myself fall in love with it because of the numbers lol!

 

I was thinking the same thing...of course, if I get a new (longer, not necessarily straighter) driver, the M6 3 wood...then I have to gap up tp replace the 5 and 7 woods somehow, too. All while spending probably north of a thousand bucks to get some yards and (maybe, maybe not) be in the fairway. Decisions decisions....I think I may stick with my current set up for now, and kep poking around for a driver I can hit longer and at least as straight as my Callaway Mini before I consider any changes. Thanks for helping out!

No matter what the numbers look like in absolute terms, the relative performance of whatever you hit the best will likely perform the best on the course. That’s more or less the experience of everyone I talk to. I don’t really check my SS too much any more even though I do own a couple launch monitors, but it sounds like we’re in the same ballpark distance wise. So, that being said, tip stiffening really helped me a lot. Cutting an inch off the tip helped my shots become more consistent and my confidence increased hitting my 3W. Now, I almost exclusively hit that or hybrid off the tee playing 5500 to 6000 yards. My driver is yet another issue...but solve the 3W and golf gets really fun. 😊

Edited by Lihu

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On 3/22/2019 at 5:00 AM, tinker said:

Playing launch monitor golf is one game, playing golf on a golf course is another game. You have to try a fairway wood on a real golf course to see how it works for you. Hilly lies, fairway conditions, rough, how it reacts when it hits the green, can you control trajectory and occasionally bend a shot a bit if you have to. 

How does an average joe go about doing this? I'm not disagreeing at all. But I have a hard enough time finding a store with a bay that will let me test clubs for more than 10 minutes, let alone test something on the course. Any insights/hints/tips are appreciated.

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I've found a 16.5 degree 3hl gives me more distance.  Like one of the guys was saying, they keep lowering launch and spin on a 3 wood....doesn't make a ton of sense to me.  Low penetrating ball flight....I'm screwed if I'm trying to hold a green.  The "almost 4 wood" gives me higher launch and the right amount of spin to hit it past a 3 wood and hold a green.

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Short answer:  no.  Finding a club, or clubs, that reliably cover the middle distances is a life-long pursuit.  Who, in their right mind, is going to trade an old fave for a new shiny object?  I don't want a hybrid that goes farther than the one I use now.  I don't need irons that require me to reassess how I should approach the next shot.  The game is difficult enough without having to make more calculations.

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On 4/17/2019 at 1:49 PM, Chasing_Bogeys said:

How does an average joe go about doing this? I'm not disagreeing at all. But I have a hard enough time finding a store with a bay that will let me test clubs for more than 10 minutes, let alone test something on the course. Any insights/hints/tips are appreciated.

I agree. All I’m saying is that most launch monitor data is of minimal use to the average Joe golfer. If you swing hard go stiff, slower go regular flex. Pick one that really looks good to you at address. After that you take it out and play and see what you have. That’s been the case for 100 years. I have read tests where they compare clubs and throw out the bad shots and compare the readings on the good shots. If you throw out the bad shots on the course every body who plays would be a single digit player. A club you can do something with on most shots is the keeper and when you find it stay out of the simulators and stop reading the marketing.

Edited by tinker
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On 4/19/2019 at 4:31 PM, tinker said:

I agree. All I’m saying is that most launch monitor data is of minimal use to the average Joe golfer. If you swing hard go stiff, slower go regular flex. Pick one that really looks good to you at address. After that you take it out and play and see what you have. That’s been the case for 100 years. I have read tests where they compare clubs and throw out the bad shots and compare the readings on the good shots. If you throw out the bad shots on the course every body who plays would be a single digit player. A club you can do something with on most shots is the keeper and when you find it stay out of the simulators and stop reading the marketing.

 

OK, but you have to decide where to spend that $300-ish on a wood. So you need SOMETHING to go by. Simulator data gives you something. It may not be perfect (and I agree that just throwing out the bad swings might not give you the best info), but it gives you something. Ideally you could find a demo day at a range with grass area to hit from. That would be more realistic and give you better data / feel. But using a simulator and comparing multiple options against each other and against your current club is a good way to go.

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